I tried the instruction tutorial on http://maczealots.com/tutorials/ruby-on-rails/ and in the middle of trying to install fixrbconfig I got an error: usr/lib/ruby/1.8/powerpc-darwin8.0/ruby.h does not exist. This probably means you haven''t yet installed Xcode from the Tiger DVD. You won''t be able to compile Ruby extensions without it. Please install it then rerun this program. I had installed Xcode. Any clue? Also, I''m bothered by this error and the fact that configuration needs to be fixed. Why do I need to "fix" something after installing it, why do I have to use terminal to do it, and why do I have an obscure error like this one? The main problem I see with languages and scripts like Ruby on Rails, PHP, etc. is that they will never be distributable to everyone who really needs them because the task of installing the underlying application is so daunting. Any discussion in the open source community about solving that problem? -- Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.
On 7/16/06, Todd Flaming <toddflaming@mac.com> wrote:> I tried the instruction tutorial on > http://maczealots.com/tutorials/ruby-on-rails/ > > and in the middle of trying to install fixrbconfig I got an error: > > usr/lib/ruby/1.8/powerpc-darwin8.0/ruby.h does not exist. This probably > means you haven''t yet installed Xcode from the Tiger DVD. You won''t be > able to compile Ruby extensions without it. Please install it then rerun > this program. > > I had installed Xcode. > > Any clue?Is ruby installed at /usr/local/... instead? What do you get from the following command? (those are backticks not quotes) $ ls -l `which ruby`> Also, I''m bothered by this error and the fact that configuration needs > to be fixed. Why do I need to "fix" something after installing it, why > do I have to use terminal to do it, and why do I have an obscure error > like this one?Welcome to the world of software development.> The main problem I see with languages and scripts like Ruby on Rails, > PHP, etc. is that they will never be distributable to everyone who > really needs them because the task of installing the underlying > application is so daunting. Any discussion in the open source community > about solving that problem?The whole configure / make / make install cycle is amazingly robust considering all that it does. Add in package managers from any number of sources and it''s a miracle that anything works at all. Every problem I''ve ever had with installing ruby, rails, gems, etc. have been 100% my own fault. Without knowing more about what you''ve done or where your files really were installed, it''s hard to say what''s wrong. More info would be good. -- James
i do most of my development on mac too. i had problem after problem until i found the article on hivelogic: http://hivelogic.com/articles/2005/12/01/ruby_rails_lighttpd_mysql_tiger everything worked great. i definitely recomment checking it out. -- Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.
James Ludlow wrote:> Is ruby installed at /usr/local/... instead? What do you get from the > following command? (those are backticks not quotes) > > $ ls -l `which ruby`Thanks. I get /usr/bin/ruby -- Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.
Josh Kieschnick wrote:> i do most of my development on mac too. i had problem after problem > until i found the article on hivelogic: > > http://hivelogic.com/articles/2005/12/01/ruby_rails_lighttpd_mysql_tiger > > everything worked great. i definitely recomment checking it out.I tried it, and the first two things in it did not work. I figured out one of them, and I''m sure I can figure out the other, but they''re pretty basic introductory instructions (editing a file and setting a path), so I''m loathe to start following his instructions on more complicated things, like downloading and compiling software. -- Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.
> The main problem I see with languages and scripts like Ruby on Rails, > PHP, etc. is that they will never be distributable to everyone who > really needs them because the task of installing the underlying > application is so daunting. Any discussion in the open source community > about solving that problem?I would argue from the other direction and say the great thing about Rails, PHP, etc. is that they don''t have to be distributable. You host it on your server, and it can instantly be accessed by anyone. Re: the installation tutorials-- I ran through the hivelogic installaion tutorial, once and it didn''t work. I started the tutorial from scratch and it worked great. I would go through the whole thing. You should be able to get it working. If you don''t want to bother installing all of the Ruby and Rails components, there is a great app that I use for development called Locomotive: http://locomotive.raaum.org/ It is a self-contained application that has a webserver (lighttpd), Ruby, and Rails bundled. You don''t have to install any of the individual components. Launch Locomotive, create a ruby application and your good to go. As I said, I use it for development, and it is great. -- Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.
Todd Flaming wrote:> James Ludlow wrote: > >> Is ruby installed at /usr/local/... instead? What do you get from the >> following command? (those are backticks not quotes) >> >> $ ls -l `which ruby` > > Thanks. I get /usr/bin/rubyAlso, I downloaded rubygems-0.9.0 to my desktop (extracted to a folder), opened terminal, changed to that directory, and then suDID several things: ] ruby setup.rb [worked] ] gem install rails [worked] ] gem install fixrbconfig [seems to have worked -- said it did] and then ] fixrbconfig That didn''t work. That''s when I got the error (... ruby.h does not exist). I tried to ignore that and went on. I tried ] gem install sqlite3 That didn''t work either. It said ERROR: While executing gem ... (Gem::GemNotFoundException) Could not find sqlite3 (> 0) in the repository I hope that''s enough info. -- Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.
On 7/16/06, Todd Flaming <toddflaming@mac.com> wrote:> > Josh Kieschnick wrote: > > i do most of my development on mac too. i had problem after problem > > until i found the article on hivelogic: > > > > http://hivelogic.com/articles/2005/12/01/ruby_rails_lighttpd_mysql_tiger > > > > everything worked great. i definitely recomment checking it out. > > I tried it, and the first two things in it did not work. I figured out > one of them, and I''m sure I can figure out the other, but they''re pretty > basic introductory instructions (editing a file and setting a path), so > I''m loathe to start following his instructions on more complicated > things, like downloading and compiling software.when you mention that the first two things from the hivelogic article didn''t work out - if you could provide a bit more detail we might be able to better assist. i am really hoping the ''mkdir src && cd src'' commands didn''t fail =) alternatively you could use something like darwinports to manage some of the softwares. james duncan davidson''s article sandboxing rails with darwinports does a great job explaining the process: http://duncandavidson.com/essay/2006/04/portsandbox cheers, jean-pierre -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://wrath.rubyonrails.org/pipermail/rails/attachments/20060716/d37d49bc/attachment-0001.html
Dan Spirlock wrote:> Re: the installation tutorials-- > > I ran through the hivelogic installaion tutorial, once and it didn''t > work. I started the tutorial from scratch and it worked great. I would > go through the whole thing. You should be able to get it working. ...In the interest of not letting problems go and providing help to people who need it, I''m responding to this to share what went wrong. Hopefully if someone knows the answer the next person trying the tutorial will have it. The hivelogic tutorial says, in a nutshell, do everything I say to do literally and don''t deviate. So I tried, but it''s not that simple. Step 1:> open terminal, [implicitly go to your personal root directory (type "cd" Enter), > type: > mkdir src > cd srcI did that, and it worked Step 2:> edit it by typing > mate ~/.bash_loginThat doesn''t work, because text mate doesn''t seem to operate from a command line. But he did say use a text editor, so I used emacs (I typed "cd.." and then "emacs .bash_login"). Step 3:> add to the path line, if there is a file, the following: > export PATH="/usr/local/bin:/usr/local/sbin:$PATH"I had no .bash_login in my root (tried "ls -la" and it was not listed). So I made a new one and added that line. Step 4:> execute the file by typing: > . ~/.bash_loginThat didn''t work: tcsh: /sw/bin/.: Permission denied -- Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.
> Step 4: >> execute the file by typing: >> . ~/.bash_login > > That didn''t work: > tcsh: /sw/bin/.: Permission deniedWhat are the permission settings on your .bash_login file? if you do: ls -l ~/.bash_login you should see something like rwxr-xr-x for the permission settings. If you don''t see that (particularly the ''x'' parts) you may need to make your .bash_login file executable by typing: chmod 755 ~/.bash_login -- Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.
Dan Spirlock wrote:>> Step 4: >>> execute the file by typing: >>> . ~/.bash_login >> >> That didn''t work: >> tcsh: /sw/bin/.: Permission denied > > What are the permission settings on your .bash_login file? if you do: > > ls -l ~/.bash_login > > you should see something like rwxr-xr-x for the permission settings. If > you don''t see that (particularly the ''x'' parts) you may need to make > your .bash_login file executable by typing: > > chmod 755 ~/.bash_loginDid that, permissions on that file properly set (-rwxr-xr-x). Tried it again, same error:> tcsh: /sw/bin/.: Permission denied.Seems to be referring to the path, not the file. -- Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.
Problem fixed, I think. The hivelogic article had a space between the
first "." and the rest. So I took it out and retyped the command from
my root directory ("./.bash_login" and Enter"). It did nothing
except
give me a new prompt, so I''m assuming it worked. Then I moved on...
Step 6: install readline> curl -O ftp://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/readline/readline-5.1.tar.gz
Doesn''t work. I get this:
curl: (67) Access denied: 421
--
Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.
> Did that, permissions on that file properly set (-rwxr-xr-x). Tried it > again, same error: > >> tcsh: /sw/bin/.: Permission denied. > > Seems to be referring to the path, not the file.The "." at the beginning of the command ". ~/.bash_login" seems odd, but I checked in the tutorial and the "." is definitely there. I''m not sure why since that refers to hidden files that don''t normally need to be operated on. Try the following commands: cd ~ then ./.bash_login -- Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.
On 7/16/06, Dan Spirlock <dans@bias-inc.com> wrote:> > > Did that, permissions on that file properly set (-rwxr-xr-x). Tried it > > again, same error: > > > >> tcsh: /sw/bin/.: Permission denied. > > > > Seems to be referring to the path, not the file. > > The "." at the beginning of the command ". ~/.bash_login" seems odd, but > I checked in the tutorial and the "." is definitely there. I''m not sure > why since that refers to hidden files that don''t normally need to be > operated on. Try the following commands:". filename" (dot space filename) is a shell command that means "execute the following file".
Dan Spirlock wrote:> >> Did that, permissions on that file properly set (-rwxr-xr-x). Tried it >> again, same error: >> >>> tcsh: /sw/bin/.: Permission denied. >> >> Seems to be referring to the path, not the file. > > The "." at the beginning of the command ". ~/.bash_login" seems odd, but > I checked in the tutorial and the "." is definitely there. I''m not sure > why since that refers to hidden files that don''t normally need to be > operated on. Try the following commands: > > cd ~ > > then > > ./.bash_loginSee above ... I got there too, just at teh same time. Note the curl "access denied" problem. BTW ... Your help is greatly appreciated. If I ever do get this installed, I will repost all of this in easy-to-read format so the next guy in my situation can take advantage, and I''ll pass along credit for helping. -- Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.
James Ludlow wrote:> ". filename" (dot space filename) is a shell command that means > "execute the following file".It didn''t work for me, but I tried "./filename" (i.e., no space) and that did. It could be I''m running a different shell (tsch). It could also be that my computer is special and the laws of computing and physics don''t apply to it, which is what my IT department has been telling me for years. But if it worked, then I get access denied for curl (see above). Any thoughts? -- Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.
Hey Todd, Not sure how far you are, but I made this page for anyone looking to get the Ruby/Rails stack rolling on OSX. It says of Intel, but it would work will all flavours. http://www.nshb.net/install-ruby-and-rails-on-mac-intel -Nathaniel On 7/16/06, Todd Flaming <toddflaming@mac.com> wrote:> > James Ludlow wrote: > > ". filename" (dot space filename) is a shell command that means > > "execute the following file". > > It didn''t work for me, but I tried "./filename" (i.e., no space) and > that did. It could be I''m running a different shell (tsch). It could > also be that my computer is special and the laws of computing and > physics don''t apply to it, which is what my IT department has been > telling me for years. > > But if it worked, then I get access denied for curl (see above). Any > thoughts? > > -- > Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/. > _______________________________________________ > Rails mailing list > Rails@lists.rubyonrails.org > http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails >-- Kind regards, Nathaniel Brown President & CEO Inimit Innovations Inc. - http://inimit.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://wrath.rubyonrails.org/pipermail/rails/attachments/20060716/6f4f58c6/attachment.html
Started out and got ports, but here''s a newbie question: how do I edit my path? -- Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.
On 7/17/06, Josh Kieschnick <jjkiesch@gmail.com> wrote:> i do most of my development on mac too. i had problem after problem > until i found the article on hivelogic: > > http://hivelogic.com/articles/2005/12/01/ruby_rails_lighttpd_mysql_tiger > > everything worked great. i definitely recomment checking it out.Dan''s HiveLogic tutorial is definitely the best way to get up and running with rails on Mac OS X. Most of the others either have errors, or are missing crucial pieces of information. It gives you a clean rails and ruby install in /usr/local/ making you immune to problems when Software Update kicks in. -- Cheers Koz
Michael Koziarski wrote:> On 7/17/06, Josh Kieschnick <jjkiesch@gmail.com> wrote: >> i do most of my development on mac too. i had problem after problem >> until i found the article on hivelogic: >> >> http://hivelogic.com/articles/2005/12/01/ruby_rails_lighttpd_mysql_tiger >> >> everything worked great. i definitely recomment checking it out. > > Dan''s HiveLogic tutorial is definitely the best way to get up and > running with rails on Mac OS X. Most of the others either have > errors, or are missing crucial pieces of information. > > It gives you a clean rails and ruby install in /usr/local/ making you > immune to problems when Software Update kicks in. > > -- > Cheers > > KozI''m happy to use it, but I''m not getting very far. See above: when I get to curl, it tells me access is denied. Every step of the process must work, or I can''t go on. -- Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.
Todd Flaming wrote:> Problem fixed, again. I tried the letter O instead. >> curl -O ftp://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/readline/readline-5.1.tar.gzThat''s Step 5 (typo above). Now things seem to be moving. Will update once all is done for other people struggling. -- Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.
You can edit your path by modifying the .cshrc file within your ~/ home directory. My Path looks something like this: setenv PATH "/Users/nshb/bin:/usr/local/bin:/opt/local/lib/mysql5/bin:/usr/local/sbin:/opt/local/bin:/bin:/sbin:/usr/bin:/usr/sbin" I am curious, where abouts did you need to modify the path to proceed? BTW, all the other tutorials I have found rely on downloading the TGZ files, which becomes a mess when wanting to update. DarwinPorts are there for a reason, and work exceptionally well. I don''t recommend using alternative methods unless DarwinPorts either a) doesn''t have the version you want b) simply doesn''t have the package you want. -Nathaniel On 7/16/06, Todd Flaming <toddflaming@mac.com> wrote:> > Todd Flaming wrote: > > Problem fixed, again. I tried the letter O instead. > >> curl -O ftp://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/readline/readline-5.1.tar.gz > > That''s Step 5 (typo above). Now things seem to be moving. Will update > once all is done for other people struggling. > > -- > Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/. > _______________________________________________ > Rails mailing list > Rails@lists.rubyonrails.org > http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails >-- Kind regards, Nathaniel Brown President & CEO Inimit Innovations Inc. - http://inimit.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://wrath.rubyonrails.org/pipermail/rails/attachments/20060716/de3b7ffc/attachment.html
Forgot to mention, once you modify your path, you will need to reload the TERM. You can verify your path has been updated by running: echo $PATH -NSHB On 7/16/06, Nathaniel Brown <nshb@inimit.com> wrote:> > You can edit your path by modifying the .cshrc file within your ~/ home > directory. > > My Path looks something like this: > > setenv PATH > "/Users/nshb/bin:/usr/local/bin:/opt/local/lib/mysql5/bin:/usr/local/sbin:/opt/local/bin:/bin:/sbin:/usr/bin:/usr/sbin" > > > I am curious, where abouts did you need to modify the path to proceed? > > BTW, all the other tutorials I have found rely on downloading the TGZ > files, which becomes a mess when wanting to update. DarwinPorts are there > for a reason, and work exceptionally well. I don''t recommend using > alternative methods unless DarwinPorts either a) doesn''t have the version > you want b) simply doesn''t have the package you want. > > -Nathaniel > > On 7/16/06, Todd Flaming <toddflaming@mac.com> wrote: > > > Todd Flaming wrote: > > > Problem fixed, again. I tried the letter O instead. > > >> curl -O ftp://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/readline/readline-5.1.tar.gz > > > > That''s Step 5 (typo above). Now things seem to be moving. Will update > > once all is done for other people struggling. > > > > -- > > Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/. > > _______________________________________________ > > Rails mailing list > > Rails@lists.rubyonrails.org > > http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails > > > > > > -- > Kind regards, > > Nathaniel Brown > President & CEO > Inimit Innovations Inc. - http://inimit.com >-- Kind regards, Nathaniel Brown President & CEO Inimit Innovations Inc. - http://inimit.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://wrath.rubyonrails.org/pipermail/rails/attachments/20060716/47077fed/attachment.html
Nathaniel Brown wrote:> Forgot to mention, once you modify your path, you will need to reload > the > TERM. You can verify your path has been updated by running: > > echo $PATH > > -NSHB > > On 7/16/06, Nathaniel Brown <nshb@inimit.com> wrote: >> I am curious, where abouts did you need to modify the path to proceed? >> >> > Rails mailing list >> President & CEO >> Inimit Innovations Inc. - http://inimit.com >> > > > > -- > Kind regards, > > Nathaniel Brown > President & CEO > Inimit Innovations Inc. - http://inimit.comBoth your set of instructions and the hivelogic instructions require that I edit the path. I have been having no luck. First I tried the command explicitly given to me by hivelogic. Didn''t work. Then I edited every .XXXXX file I could find reference to, tried every combination of syntax I could find, and no luck. Is there anyone out there who knows how to edit a path on mac osx? Seems crazy that Ruby on Rails would be stopped in its tracks by a path issue. -- Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.
> Nathaniel Brown wrote: >>> I am curious, where abouts did you need to modify the path to proceed?Here''s the section from your instructions:> - Install xCode from your CDs (Disk 1), or download from Apple > - Download and Install DarwinPorts (latest is DarwinPorts-1.2.1-10.4.dmg) > - Add /opt/local/bin/port to your path-- Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.
On Mon, 2006-07-17 at 03:39 +0200, Todd Flaming wrote:> > Nathaniel Brown wrote: > >>> I am curious, where abouts did you need to modify the path to proceed? > > Here''s the section from your instructions: > > > - Install xCode from your CDs (Disk 1), or download from Apple > > - Download and Install DarwinPorts (latest is DarwinPorts-1.2.1-10.4.dmg) > > - Add /opt/local/bin/port to your path---- path=$PATH:/opt/local/bin/port Craig
Todd Flaming wrote:> I have been having no luck [editing the path]. First I tried the > command explicitly given to me by hivelogic. Didn''t work. Then I > edited every .XXXXX file I could find reference to, tried every > combination of syntax I could find, and no luck. > > Is there anyone out there who knows how to edit a path on mac osx? > Seems crazy that Ruby on Rails would be stopped in its tracks by a path > issue.Figured it out, and am sharing for the benefit of all newbies. Here is a good place to look for instructions and an explanation, which helps you out without regard to shell. http://www.macdevcenter.com/pub/a/mac/2003/01/21/pear_macosx.html Note that the instructions actually were insufficient to do what I needed, because the hivelogic instructions require that the addition of /usr/local/bin and /usr/local/sbin go at the front. These instructions put it at the end. So just put /usr/local/bin:/usr/local/sbin before $path with the space between teh two, and it works: % echo ''set path = (/usr/local/bin $path)'' >> ~/.cshrc % source ~/.cshrc Note that this problem game up when trying to install rubygems, and it told me the file was not a gzip. Stumped, even after fixing the path, I redownloaded the file and that solved the problem. Now I''m continuing. Sorry for those people who know this stuff well. I''m trying to help everyone in my shoes. -- Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.
Todd Flaming wrote:> ... > That''s Step 5 (typo above). Now things seem to be moving. Will update > once all is done for other people struggling.Now the latest problem with hivelogic instructions. I reach the FCGI section, and do everything word for word:> curl -O http://www.fastcgi.com/dist/fcgi-2.4.0.tar.gz > tar xzvf fcgi-2.4.0.tar.gz > cd fcgi-2.4.0 > ./configure --prefix=/usr/local > make > sudo make install > cd ..Okay. Then ...> We?ll also need to add the Ruby-FastCGI bindings > > curl -O http://sugi.nemui.org/pub/ruby/fcgi/ruby-fcgi-0.8.6.tar.gz > tar xzvf ruby-fcgi-0.8.6.tar.gz > cd ruby-fcgi-0.8.6 > /usr/local/bin/ruby install.rb config --prefix=/usr/localThis doesn''t work. Here''s what I get:> install.rb: entering config phase... > ---> lib > <--- lib > ---> ext > ---> ext/fcgi > /usr/local/bin/ruby /Users/me/src/ruby-fcgi-0.8.6/ext/fcgi/extconf.rb > checking for fcgiapp.h... no > checking for fastcgi/fcgiapp.h... no > *** /Users/me/src/ruby-fcgi-0.8.6/ext/fcgi/extconf.rb failed *** > Could not create Makefile due to some reason, probably lack of > necessary libraries and/or headers. Check the mkmf.log file for more > details. You may need configuration options.Any ideas? -- Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.
Todd Flaming wrote:> I tried the instruction tutorial on > http://maczealots.com/tutorials/ruby-on-rails/ > > and in the middle of trying to install fixrbconfig I got an error: > > usr/lib/ruby/1.8/powerpc-darwin8.0/ruby.h does not exist. This probably > means you haven''t yet installed Xcode from the Tiger DVD. You won''t be > able to compile Ruby extensions without it. Please install it then rerun > this program. > > I had installed Xcode. > > Any clue? > > Also, I''m bothered by this error and the fact that configuration needs > to be fixed. Why do I need to "fix" something after installing it, why > do I have to use terminal to do it, and why do I have an obscure error > like this one? > > The main problem I see with languages and scripts like Ruby on Rails, > PHP, etc. is that they will never be distributable to everyone who > really needs them because the task of installing the underlying > application is so daunting. Any discussion in the open source community > about solving that problem?please mr.flaming i bought a macbook air from some guy and it has u logged on as a user but i dont know the password so i cant do much and i cant create my own account can u please tell me the psssword i spent 1200 on it and the guy didnt tell me the password can u please tell me the password hint on the account is advent its your account on itunes and the macbook -- Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/. --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Talk" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk+unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-talk?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
On Feb 21, 3:36 am, Omar Saraya <rails-mailing-l...-ARtvInVfO7ksV2N9l4h3zg@public.gmane.org> wrote:> please mr.flaming i bought a macbook air from some guy and it has u > logged on as a user but i dont know the password so i cant do much and i > cant create my own account can u please tell me the psssword i spent > 1200 on it and the guy didnt tell me the password can u please tell me > the password hint on the account is advent its your account on itunes > and the macbook > --You can reset the password with a Mac OS X installation disk (see http://support.apple.com/kb/HT1274 ) Fred --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Talk" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-talk?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---