Hi My current desktop at home is a DELL DIMENSION 8100, got it in 2001, still a good machine but makes little to much noise and sometimes a little slow due to only 768MB ram. It''s setup for dual boot with WinXP and Debian. http://swampthing.dk/~tsj/hardware/#nDELL_DIMENSION_8100 So for some time I have been thinking of a change to new hardware, and it would be great by Virtualisation to have WinXP and Debian running at same time. I currently have a good look on a barebone like Shuttle XPC SG31G5, a lot of ram and a VT enabled Intel processor. But now the point that keep me back. Only Dom0 have direct access to graphics card, so a way could be to setup Debian with full X on Dom0 and use this to VPN / rdesktop into the different DomU, one with WinXP and one with Debian as I have now. As Internet traffic primary will be from DomU and out I see no risks for Dom0, other than from time to time OS on Dom0 might need to download updates. Any bad things about using Xen this way??? I know it will not be possible to use heavy graphics on a DomU WinXP, but how about support for USB devices, soundcard etc??? Will it be possible within DomU WinXP to enjoy a DVD movie including sound??? Brgds Torben _______________________________________________ Xen-users mailing list Xen-users@lists.xensource.com http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users
Thiago Camargo Martins Cordeiro
2009-May-06 17:13 UTC
Re: [Xen-users] Is Xen a way to go for me?
Hi Torben, I didn''t know if you can play DVD (videolan.org will probably work) with sound within XP domU but, I''m sure you can run Windows (via SDL not VNC ou RDP) very fast under Xen, Debian 5 and even Windows Xen GPl PV drivers. The Xen Live CD is what you are looking for... ;-) http://wiki.xensource.com/xenwiki/LiveCD Just my two cents... Regards, Thiago 2009/5/6 Torben Schou Jensen <tsj@swampthing.dk>> Hi > My current desktop at home is a DELL DIMENSION 8100, got it in 2001, still > a good machine but makes little to much noise and sometimes a little slow > due to only 768MB ram. > It''s setup for dual boot with WinXP and Debian. > http://swampthing.dk/~tsj/hardware/#nDELL_DIMENSION_8100<http://swampthing.dk/%7Etsj/hardware/#nDELL_DIMENSION_8100> > > So for some time I have been thinking of a change to new hardware, > and it would be great by Virtualisation to have WinXP and Debian running > at same time. > > I currently have a good look on a barebone like Shuttle XPC SG31G5, > a lot of ram and a VT enabled Intel processor. > > But now the point that keep me back. > > Only Dom0 have direct access to graphics card, so a way could be to setup > Debian with full X on Dom0 and use this to VPN / rdesktop into the > different DomU, one with WinXP and one with Debian as I have now. > As Internet traffic primary will be from DomU and out I see no risks for > Dom0, other than from time to time OS on Dom0 might need to download > updates. > Any bad things about using Xen this way??? > > I know it will not be possible to use heavy graphics on a DomU WinXP, but > how about support for USB devices, soundcard etc??? > Will it be possible within DomU WinXP to enjoy a DVD movie including > sound??? > > Brgds > Torben > > > > _______________________________________________ > Xen-users mailing list > Xen-users@lists.xensource.com > http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users >_______________________________________________ Xen-users mailing list Xen-users@lists.xensource.com http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users
2009/5/6 Torben Schou Jensen <tsj@swampthing.dk>:> I currently have a good look on a barebone like Shuttle XPC SG31G5, > a lot of ram and a VT enabled Intel processor.You may wish to check for VT-d capability as well as VT-x capability, this will allow (sooner or later) passing PCI devices such as graphics cards into Windows guest. _______________________________________________ Xen-users mailing list Xen-users@lists.xensource.com http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hi, On 6 May 2009, at 17:02, Torben Schou Jensen wrote:> Hi > My current desktop at home is a DELL DIMENSION 8100, got it in 2001, > still > a good machine but makes little to much noise and sometimes a little > slow > due to only 768MB ram. > It''s setup for dual boot with WinXP and Debian. > http://swampthing.dk/~tsj/hardware/#nDELL_DIMENSION_8100Thats still a good machine, in fact, if you can live with the fact that you can''t run Windows as a DomU (needs IVT/AMDV for HVM mode), you can at least use it to test what Xen can do for you. That would be very important, because Xen is heavily geared towards server application and might miss some features, you know from other virtualization solutions for workstations and desktop (Qemu,Virtual Box, VMware Workstation and so on). If you want to try running Windows, just use Qemu, that should give you a pretty good idea on how it would run in Xen HVM mode (although it might be slower, because your CPU is missing IVT).> So for some time I have been thinking of a change to new hardware, > and it would be great by Virtualisation to have WinXP and Debian > running > at same time. > > I currently have a good look on a barebone like Shuttle XPC SG31G5, > a lot of ram and a VT enabled Intel processor.You don''t need too much RAM, in your case, 4GB should be the maximum. I also don''t think that the Shuffle barebone is a good choice, because you will be restricted concerning CPU/Mainboard upgrades (and subsequently feature upgrades), which can be very important for what you want to do. A normal PC case or an ATX size HTPC case would probably work much better here and give you a completely free hand in choosing your components for a maximum of virtualization features like Intel VT-d or AMD IOMMU (and you will need those). You should check the mailing lists for success stories and take a close look at the specs before buying your hardware, because all the really interesting stuff for Desktop/Media application is still a little sketchy. Also remember, even though the Shuffle seems to use a mobile CPU, the overhead from running Windows in HVM and Debian in Dom0 and DomU will increase the CPU temperature(depending on the HVM overhead mostly) and therefor raise the noise level (which might not be so nice for such a slim case). If you want low power consumption, AMD is currently the way to go even if they are a little behind on speed. But you should wait about half a year, so they can get their new desktop chipsets (which will hopefully finally include IOMMU) and low power AM3 CPUs out.> But now the point that keep me back. > > Only Dom0 have direct access to graphics card, so a way could be to > setup > Debian with full X on Dom0 and use this to VPN / rdesktop into the > different DomU, one with WinXP and one with Debian as I have now. > As Internet traffic primary will be from DomU and out I see no risks > for > Dom0, other than from time to time OS on Dom0 might need to download > updates. > Any bad things about using Xen this way??? > > I know it will not be possible to use heavy graphics on a DomU > WinXP, but > how about support for USB devices, soundcard etc??? > Will it be possible within DomU WinXP to enjoy a DVD movie including > sound???Support for USB devices as well as sound support are available for HVM DomUs, but with limitations. Almost all the USB devices, I have ever tested with any virtualization technology (VMware, Qemu, VirtualBox, Parallels and Xen) seem to have problems with performing certain operations like Firmware upgrades. Besides that, you should expect to have to attach and detach USB devices to DomU manually at least the first time, you connect them (maybe every time, didn''t play with it too much). The Qemu sound drivers (especially es1370) seem to be pretty advanced by now, but since it is based on an older card, I doubt you will be able to get 5.1 sound out of it, to really enjoy DVDs. If you really need 5.1 surround sound, you will probably have to either run it through a sound server in Dom0, or pass the sound card through to the Windows DomU (VT-d/IOMMU needed). Also note, that at least in PV mode (usually used for Linux), it does not yet seem to be possible to use a CD/DVD effectively inside a DomU without passing the IDE/SATA/SCSI controller through. PvSCSI could do much for this problem, but as of version 3.3.1, it still does not seem to work properly with SATA drives (and probably IDE) of linux. You should also expect problems with burning CDs/DVDs from the Windows DomU (you''ll probably have to do that in Dom0). On the bright side though, with the right hardware and a VT-d or IOMMU- enabled mainboard chances are, that you could succeed in passing your graphics card to the Windows or Linux DomU, which as far as I know isn''t possible in other virtualization solutions and would ultimately improve performance, including DVD playback, since most graphics cards ship at least with basic decoders and you get rid of the VNC middle man. I hope, this isn''t too confusing, Paul. - -- Paul Schulze Mail: avlex82@gmail.com Why can''t a programmer tell the difference between Halloween and Christmas? Because OCT31 = DEC25. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.10 (Darwin) iEYEARECAAYFAkoCv2UACgkQj2zIQLJNnKNy+gCeNY/uxphGxHWXTqB76bS8TE9J KnAAoPV8p6hT772fFduWBk3Pnc9UHNNJ =vQsT -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ Xen-users mailing list Xen-users@lists.xensource.com http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users
Hi,> and it would be great by Virtualisation to have WinXP and Debian > running at same time.I think that Xen is much more for server-virtualization where even no display is needed for normal operation! You should rather go for VirtualBox or maybe VMware!> I currently have a good look on a barebone like Shuttle XPC SG31G5, > a lot of ram and a VT enabled Intel processor.You also have to check if the BIOS supports HVM, if not it does not help if the CPU supports it. For running WinXP on VirtualBox, HVM is not needed and it runs quite good and very stable! The closed source version supports "3D Graphics", Sound and USB, but I have no experiences how good it works for "real" multimedia-applications. -- Chau y hasta luego, Thorolf _______________________________________________ Xen-users mailing list Xen-users@lists.xensource.com http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users