Vorbis - Nov 2001 - What kind of Ogg Vorbis-services you would like to have?

Hi!

What kind of services, which use Ogg Vorbis or create value to Ogg
Vorbis-user, you are interested?

I'm a student at Helsinki School of Economics and Business Administration,
and I'm taking a course in which we are supposed to create business plan
for some new business. So, I happened to bump to Ogg Vorbis in the Intenet,
and I Thought, Wow that's a really interesting product both ethically and
commercially! MP3-format GOODBYE, ADIEU! But I don't want to create some
service which won't create value to anybody! So I need your help.

I would like to know WHAT YOU WANT, WHAT SERVICES YOU'LL NEED (I'm
talking
about the time when Ogg Vorbis will be in the markets)

Because there is CERTAIN IDEOLOGY BEHIND OGG VORBIS I'd like TO RESPECT IT.
So I have some GUIDELINES which I hope you would cosider:

        *Service shouldn't cost anything (or at least would be very
cheap)for
end-users. (It would be financed mostly by advertising)
        
        *Service should create value to you.

        *Service should be interesting and value-creating for others too!
        
        *It shouldn't break common ethical values

        *I don't want another Napster!

        *And most importantly service would somehow exploit Ogg Vorbis-format!

        *Service would be something new and innovative or something old but
which
is innovatively arranged to serve Ogg Vorbis-users.

I COULD REALLY USE SOME HELP! So, please answer my question! By answering
my question you'll also help yourself. Maybe somebody will then realize
your "wish-service"!

THANKS FOR PAYING ATTENTION AND A REALLY BIG HUG FOR EACH OF YOU WHO'LL
RESPOND TO MY QUESTION! :) 

        -Anna-

     

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Anna Hämäläinen wrote:
> 
> Hi!
Hi!
> What kind of services, which use Ogg Vorbis or create value to Ogg
> Vorbis-user, you are interested?
Please keep in mind that I'm only an end-user, so I'm not involved nor
interested in business matters, but the most obvious business could be
streaming radios where listeners pay for a subscription
(or where sponsors pay via advertising).
Even pay-per-download sites could develop a business, but after all
they're business models not inherently related to Vorbis.
>         *I don't want another Napster!
In fact Vorbis has nothing to do with file-sharing, being "only" a
lossy
music codec! :-)
Anyway if Vorbis becomes the de-facto standard, it will be used
even by *pster-like users, but as a nice side-effect.
>         *And most importantly service would somehow exploit Ogg
Vorbis-format!
I think the most important thing would exploit Vorbis, apart its wonderful
quality, it's being patent-free, so no one has to pay Mr. Vorbis in order
to use its format.
Given this important statement, business and the like then may follow
more and better than with the current situation where the leading format
imposes heavy licensing-fees..


-- 
(o<
//\   GnuPGid: B8B68C17 
V_/_  pinguino 186198 @ http://counter.li.org

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On Mon, 5 Nov 2001, Anna [iso-8859-1] Hämäläinen wrote:
> 	*Service shouldn't cost anything (or at least would be very cheap)for
> end-users. (It would be financed mostly by advertising)
> 	
> 	*Service should create value to you.
> 
> 	*Service should be interesting and value-creating for others too!
> 	
> 	*It shouldn't break common ethical values
> 
> 	*I don't want another Napster!
> 
> 	*And most importantly service would somehow exploit Ogg Vorbis-format!
> 
> 	*Service would be something new and innovative or something old but which
> is innovatively arranged to serve Ogg Vorbis-users.
I just want a plain, online radio service with several music channels that
meets the following criteria:

* Don't force me to use a stupid web interface if I already know what I want
to listen to (*cough* *cough* Spinner.com *cough*).  I want to be able to drop
a URL into ogg123 and be done with it.

* No DJ interruptions.  Local radio is annoying because DJs and stupid
listeners are constantly blabbing on the air.

* Audio advertising between songs is fine.  I wouldn't mind listening to 30
seconds of ads every 5 minutes or so.  Heck, embed URLs in the Vorbis comment
headers so I can click on them in my xterm and open them in my browser if I am
interested.  The option of removing the ads in exchange for payment would be
nice, but I don't know how listener authentication would work.

* Don't make me use Real or Windows Media.  (I know, you already said this
was
going to be in Ogg format, but I include this for completeness.)

The basic premise here is that I want a service that provides me with content
(including ads for products and services that I might like), but does not
try to control me.


---
Stan Seibert

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i want a cd ripper/encoder that will also download track names off the
internet and tag them, and possibly rip directly to vorbis, or to wave then
vorbis, and also be high-speed, and also have no rip errors, i.e.
pops/clicks.  if anybody has a list of some good ones, i havent really found
a good one yet.  so if someone has one that they use and can help me out, it
would be much appreciated.

Andy (Dale)
andycool22@peoplepc.com
AndyCool22 on AIM
http://livejournal.com/~andycool22
----- Original Message -----
From: "Anna Hämäläinen" <k71075@kyyppari.hkkk.fi>
To: <vorbis@xiph.org>
Sent: Monday, November 05, 2001 10:29 AM
Subject: [vorbis] What kind of Ogg Vorbis-services you would like to have?

Hi!

What kind of services, which use Ogg Vorbis or create value to Ogg
Vorbis-user, you are interested?

I'm a student at Helsinki School of Economics and Business Administration,
and I'm taking a course in which we are supposed to create business plan
for some new business. So, I happened to bump to Ogg Vorbis in the Intenet,
and I Thought, Wow that's a really interesting product both ethically and
commercially! MP3-format GOODBYE, ADIEU! But I don't want to create some
service which won't create value to anybody! So I need your help.

I would like to know WHAT YOU WANT, WHAT SERVICES YOU'LL NEED (I'm
talking
about the time when Ogg Vorbis will be in the markets)

Because there is CERTAIN IDEOLOGY BEHIND OGG VORBIS I'd like TO RESPECT IT.
So I have some GUIDELINES which I hope you would cosider:

*Service shouldn't cost anything (or at least would be very cheap)for
end-users. (It would be financed mostly by advertising)

*Service should create value to you.

*Service should be interesting and value-creating for others too!

*It shouldn't break common ethical values

*I don't want another Napster!

*And most importantly service would somehow exploit Ogg Vorbis-format!

*Service would be something new and innovative or something old but which
is innovatively arranged to serve Ogg Vorbis-users.

I COULD REALLY USE SOME HELP! So, please answer my question! By answering
my question you'll also help yourself. Maybe somebody will then realize
your "wish-service"!

THANKS FOR PAYING ATTENTION AND A REALLY BIG HUG FOR EACH OF YOU WHO'LL
RESPOND TO MY QUESTION! :)

-Anna-

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But it does! Try the option that I talked about in the previous message.
> Also, it doesn't matter what kind of machine you have, EAC will 
always pause
> the ripping process while it encodes.
> Even on a dual P3-1GHz, where you obviously have free CPU resources.
> 

---
http://alex.iribarren.com

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On 2001-11-05, Anna Hämäläinen wrote:
> 	*Service shouldn't cost anything (or at least would be very cheap)for
> end-users. (It would be financed mostly by advertising)
>
> 	*Service should create value to you.
>
> 	*Service should be interesting and value-creating for others too!
>
> 	*It shouldn't break common ethical values
>
> 	*I don't want another Napster!
>
> 	*And most importantly service would somehow exploit Ogg Vorbis-format!
>
> 	*Service would be something new and innovative or something old but which
> is innovatively arranged to serve Ogg Vorbis-users.
>
An idea I personally don't need now (I don't have a portable player,
etc):

Something similar to the numerous file-storage services (xdrive, etc.) but
with specific support for vorbis could be good.  The first
"vorbis-smart"
ability I see is bit peeling.  It should be able to do bit peeling on the
server and stream to you a lower-bitrate version.  At your T1-connected
workplace you listen to the full quality, at another place over a
modem/ISDN you listen at lower quality, at another place you download some
of your collection to your portable player at low bitrate too.  Maybe the
later could one day develop into schemes like what is now appearing with
electronic photo "frames" - at any place in the world, you plug your
internet-enabled portable player into a phone jack, erhh, a quantum
internet connector and refresh your player with a new portion of your
online music collection.

Landing back at our century ;), it can also provide streaming services:
the server takes a file/playlist that it has or streams-in/downloads it
from locations you tell it (maybe from the IceS that runs on your own
computer) and restreams it to others.  The combination of a storage with a
publicly accessible streaming server would allow everyone to create an
internet radio station for free.

Of course all public features should be optinal.

Have interfaces to obtain the metadata of ogg files (without downloading
them).  Have search.

Have abilities for sharing things with others: give them read/search
access on your files/metadata; allow them to see what songs you currently
listen to.  Combine these two: every listener who enables this becomes a
radio station that streams exactly what he listens to from his home (will
probably require more support from the player).

* Somebody, think of a way to handle the copyright issues.  I can't
brainstorm if I try to account for them ;).

* Here is the most innovative idea here:

Have collobarative playlist editing abilities (conference).  I don't think
this has ever been done.  Imagine 3 people going on a picnic.  Each one
has a portable player.  They connect to their music collection, decide
together which songs they want to take with them, divide them among the
portables and load them in.  Meeting at the picnic, they have the music
they together wanted.  Or just imagine several DJs around the world
control together a single radio station...

In general, I imagine the audio equivallent of SourceForge - the audio
paradise humanity would have if it sorted out the lisencing matters ;).
Everything should be open and free to the users (unlike MyPlay).

In the future, expand this to other formats: flac, tarkin (how much
hardware do you need for an open vidoe streaming server ?-), etc.

* Profit: who pays for all this???

Advertisement placers.  Users who desire very much diskspace on the server
(?).  People who want you to deploy and support a similar system in e.g.
their organization (like SOurceForge did).  A funny thing to do is to have
the streaming server plug holes that might appear when the source lags
behind with commercials ;).  Invent more.


-- 
Beni Cherniavsky <cben@tx.technion.ac.il>
                 (also scben@t2 in Technion)

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