I thought this might be interesting to you, it's an extract from the latest streaming media newsletter, I was intrested to note that MS are claiming cd quality audio at 48kbps whichi is obviously very low, I didn't think much of it at first because nobody uses MS codecs for audio anyway! However (a bit I missed off this quote by the look of it) I then read mention of portable audio players and thought hmmm, if you can get cd quality audio in a third of the memory, people might use it for that. I mean imagine if you have one of those little 16mb winCE things, not a lot of use really but then if you had 3 times the space it would be like 48mb and 32 would be like 96mb and it all starts sounding a lot more useful. Anyway I just thought it was interesting, probably it sounds horrible :) love Freya "During his keynote, Ballmer talked about the next operating system, codenamed “Whistler”, which features advanced audio and video functions. He also unveiled new Windows Media 8 audio and video codecs with significant quality improvements. Near CD-quality audio is now available at 48Kbps, beating Microsoft’s previous 64Kbps rate. For video, “near VHS” is available at 250Kbps, while “near DVD” is at 500Kbps. The quest for higher quality audio and video is growing rapidly. In May, RealNetworks announced RealVideo 8, which it claims can show VHS quality video at about 300Kbps. More recently, it announced RealAudio 8, which provides CD quality audio at 64Kbps – half the size of MP3. However, Microsoft now has the upper hand, with its announcement that it will support CD quality audio at 48Kbps. Windows Media 8 codecs are backward-compatible with Windows Media Player 7 and 6.4." __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ --- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ Ogg project homepage: http://www.xiph.org/ogg/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'vorbis-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered.
Heres the bit I missed: With the new codec released Tuesday, Microsoft says users can store about three times more music than MP3 on portable devices. Microsoft also unveiled its new Windows Media Player 8 for Pocket PC devices. --- Freya <freya128@yahoo.com> wrote:> I thought this might be interesting to you, it's an > extract from the latest streaming media newsletter, > I > was intrested to note that MS are claiming cd > quality > audio at 48kbps whichi is obviously very low, I > didn't > think much of it at first because nobody uses MS > codecs for audio anyway! However (a bit I missed off > this quote by the look of it) I then read mention of > portable audio players and thought hmmm, if you can > get cd quality audio in a third of the memory, > people > might use it for that. I mean imagine if you have > one > of those little 16mb winCE things, not a lot of use > really but then if you had 3 times the space it > would > be like 48mb and 32 would be like 96mb and it all > starts sounding a lot more useful. > > Anyway I just thought it was interesting, probably > it > sounds horrible :) > > love > > Freya > > "During his keynote, Ballmer talked about the next > operating system, codenamed “Whistler”, which > features > advanced audio and video functions. He also unveiled > new Windows Media 8 audio and video codecs with > significant quality improvements. Near CD-quality > audio is now available at 48Kbps, beating > Microsoft’s > previous 64Kbps rate. For video, “near VHS” is > available at 250Kbps, while “near DVD” is at > 500Kbps. > > The quest for higher quality audio and video is > growing rapidly. In May, RealNetworks announced > RealVideo 8, which it claims can show VHS quality > video at about 300Kbps. More recently, it announced > RealAudio 8, which provides CD quality audio at > 64Kbps > – half the size of MP3. However, Microsoft now has > the > upper hand, with its announcement that it will > support > CD quality audio at 48Kbps. Windows Media 8 codecs > are > backward-compatible with Windows Media Player 7 and > 6.4." > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of > Products. > http://shopping.yahoo.com/ > > --- >8 ---- > List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ > Ogg project homepage: http://www.xiph.org/ogg/ > To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to > 'vorbis-request@xiph.org' > containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. > No subject is needed. > Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will beignored/filtered. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ --- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ Ogg project homepage: http://www.xiph.org/ogg/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'vorbis-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered.
Oh yeah, they have some samples on their site. Interestingly enough, they don't compare any of their sounds to MP3 or OGG, only Real, which we all know is inferior in quality... Although the original WAV does give you a good idea as to the degredation in quality. Check it out (the url is probably wrapped): http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowsmedia/en/compare/quality.asp -----Original Message----- From: Freya [mailto:freya128@yahoo.com] Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2000 10:15 AM To: vorbis@xiph.org Subject: Re: [vorbis] new MS codecs Heres the bit I missed: With the new codec released Tuesday, Microsoft says users can store about three times more music than MP3 on portable devices. Microsoft also unveiled its new Windows Media Player 8 for Pocket PC devices. --- Freya <freya128@yahoo.com> wrote:> I thought this might be interesting to you, it's an > extract from the latest streaming media newsletter, > I > was intrested to note that MS are claiming cd > quality > audio at 48kbps whichi is obviously very low, I > didn't > think much of it at first because nobody uses MS > codecs for audio anyway! However (a bit I missed off > this quote by the look of it) I then read mention of > portable audio players and thought hmmm, if you can > get cd quality audio in a third of the memory, > people > might use it for that. I mean imagine if you have > one > of those little 16mb winCE things, not a lot of use > really but then if you had 3 times the space it > would > be like 48mb and 32 would be like 96mb and it all > starts sounding a lot more useful. > > Anyway I just thought it was interesting, probably > it > sounds horrible :) > > love > > Freya > > "During his keynote, Ballmer talked about the next > operating system, codenamed "Whistler", which > features > advanced audio and video functions. He also unveiled > new Windows Media 8 audio and video codecs with > significant quality improvements. Near CD-quality > audio is now available at 48Kbps, beating > Microsoft's > previous 64Kbps rate. For video, "near VHS" is > available at 250Kbps, while "near DVD" is at > 500Kbps. > > The quest for higher quality audio and video is > growing rapidly. In May, RealNetworks announced > RealVideo 8, which it claims can show VHS quality > video at about 300Kbps. More recently, it announced > RealAudio 8, which provides CD quality audio at > 64Kbps > - half the size of MP3. However, Microsoft now has > the > upper hand, with its announcement that it will > support > CD quality audio at 48Kbps. Windows Media 8 codecs > are > backward-compatible with Windows Media Player 7 and > 6.4." > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of > Products. > http://shopping.yahoo.com/ > > --- >8 ---- > List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ > Ogg project homepage: http://www.xiph.org/ogg/ > To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to > 'vorbis-request@xiph.org' > containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. > No subject is needed. > Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will beignored/filtered. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ --- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ Ogg project homepage: http://www.xiph.org/ogg/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'vorbis-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered. --- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ Ogg project homepage: http://www.xiph.org/ogg/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'vorbis-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered.
Let's seem them put Dolby 5.1 in their codec. ;-) -----Original Message----- From: Aleksandar Dovnikovic [mailto:aldov@EUnet.yu] Sent: Thursday, December 14, 2000 11:07 AM To: vorbis@xiph.org Subject: Re: [vorbis] new MS codecs "JD Conley" <jdc@malibuboats.com> wrote:> Oh yeah, they have some samples on their site. Interestingly enough, they > don't compare any of their sounds to MP3 or OGG, only Real, which we all > know is inferior in quality... Although the original WAV does give you a > good idea as to the degredation in quality.I remember that Microsoft has compared their codec with MP3 (one of the earlier version of wma) - to show that 64kbps wma sounds as good as MP3 - but they used stereo 128kbps MP3 and 64kbps mono wma !! Greetings, Aleksandar --- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ Ogg project homepage: http://www.xiph.org/ogg/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'vorbis-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered. --- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ Ogg project homepage: http://www.xiph.org/ogg/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'vorbis-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered.
On Thu, 14 Dec 2000, Freya wrote:> I thought this might be interesting to you, it's an > extract from the latest streaming media newsletter, I > was intrested to note that MS are claiming cd quality > audio at 48kbps whichi is obviously very low,Sounds pretty incredible to me, considering that current versions of WMA sound far worse than mp3 at same bitrate. Somehow they have made quantum leap and improved their codec by factor of 10 overnight? -Dan --- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ Ogg project homepage: http://www.xiph.org/ogg/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'vorbis-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered.
Segher Boessenkool <segher@wanadoo.nl> writes:> I did 3-4x speedup already, it's just not working right [...]I know what you're saying, but these two phrases in juxtaposition always make me smile. :-) --Mike -- [O]ne of the features of the Internet [...] is that small groups of people can greatly disturb large organizations. --Charles C. Mann --- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ Ogg project homepage: http://www.xiph.org/ogg/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'vorbis-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered.
> >Don't you have it on CD? That's called theft, you > know.True but lets keep in mind that of the 5 major labels producing music worldwide, 4 of them are known manufacturers/ dealers in weapons. (no-one is too sure of what BMG gets up to as they are a privately held german company) so unless you are buying your music on independant lables or possibly BMG, then you are still morally wrong as you are a party to murder. Anyway I think the whole thing is a load of OTT nonsense. Is anyone here old enough to remember "home taping is killing music?". People always tend to buy the original if they really like some piece of music and can get their hands on it. Speaking as someone once involved in an independant label, a lot of small labels and artists are very happy to have people copy their music so that it will be more available, it tends to lead to more sales! :) love Freya __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ --- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ Ogg project homepage: http://www.xiph.org/ogg/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'vorbis-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered.
--- Segher Boessenkool <segher@wanadoo.nl> wrote:> Sorry if I offended you, then. I get angry at people > who think we > develop audio codecs for the purpose of stealing > music. Yes I think > must music is overpriced, but that doesn't mean you > can steal it. Well, > let's not get into politics :-) >I can understand you being very offended at the accusation that you are developing a tool that will only be used for immoral purposes, it's interesting that this isn't a charge levied at the manufacturers of cd-writers and such like... love Freya __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ --- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ Ogg project homepage: http://www.xiph.org/ogg/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'vorbis-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered.
> From: Segher Boessenkool (segher@wanadoo.nl) > Date: Fri 15 Dec 2000 - 18:07:06 PST > > Chun-Yu wrote: > > > > Try encoding the same album in 128 kbps MP3 and listen to it. Most of the > > time, 128 kbps MP3 sounds terrible to me. WMA at 128 kbps is also pretty > > bad, but not nearly as bad as MP3. VQF at 96 kbps usually does sound better > > than MP3 and WMA at 128 kbps, though. A friend of mine gave me the Aquarium > > What encoder are you using? Aquarium is transparent at 96kbps mp3. > > > CD by Aqua in both VQF and WMA format (he forgot I already had it and gave > > it to me again after he switched from VQF to WMA). The VQFs are 96 kilobit > > Don't you have it on CD? That's called theft, you know.Others call it "a gift to a friend". Or "fair non-commercial use". -- David Balazic -------------- "Be excellent to each other." - Bill & Ted - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - --- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ Ogg project homepage: http://www.xiph.org/ogg/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'vorbis-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered.