samba - Jul 2016 - new user introduction, and a few questions

hi
Ok, I've now got more info. Doing smbclient -L blackfang returns the
following error. unknown name switch type dns. session setup failed.
NT_STATUS_LOGON_FAILURE. This is frustrating. Isn't this supposed to
work regardless of whether I have an account on the machine I'm trying
to connect to? Hear's what I'm trying to do. I'm basically trying to
configure samba, however I need to so that when I try to connect to a
windows computer or a linux computer running samba, it asks me for a
user account and password if needed, otherwise it connects without
error. Why is this proving so difficult? I'm really sorry if I sound
frustrated, it's not you guys at all. I've been banging my head against
the wall with this for about a week, trying to configure samba before
releasing  the new stable image of sonar to the public. It also doesn't
help that most of my users are not at all understanding when something
they expect to work doesn't. Windows just works, why can't linux work
like windows, so on and so forth. That's what I have to look forward to
if I get this wrong.

Thanks
Kendell Clark


coffeeking wrote:
> hi
>
> Completely agree about windows. From what I'm hearing on this list
> there's no "default" file that will do what I want? If
I'm
> understanding this right it's not how samba is configured so much as
> it is what the gui tools will let me do? I use the mate desktop, with
> the caja file manager and it's caja share extension. I've tried a
few
> things, connecting to smb:blackfang. This will think for a few seconds
> and then return with "no such file or directory". I'm sorry
to keep
> going back to the same circles, I'm just trying to understand how
> these things work. I'd like to come up with a smb.conf file which will
> work for most users, since a lot of them connect to windows computers
> or linux boxes running a samba server. Is this possible? dolphin isn't
> an option for me because orca, the linux gtk screen reader, can't read
> it. I do know that trying to connect to windows computers over the
> network with nautilus or caja yields  the "no such file or
directory"
> error or "connection timed out". I'm missing something, just
not sure
> what. If I'm being annoying, please don't hesitate to point me to
> docs. It also sounds like results may vary based on what linux
> distribution you use. Sonar is based on the manjaro linux distro which
> is in turn based on arch, if that helps.
>
> Thanks
>
> Kendell Clark
>
>
>
> On 7/16/2016 9:54 PM, Methosomega wrote:
>> Windows is built to be generically compatible and configurable for
>> the common person. This does not make well for stability, function,
>> or security. Linux is built for everything but ease... To this end
>> there are gui apps that allow you to easily configure samba. Nothing
>> "just works" but when it does, it will never fail under most
>> circumstances. Windows it will work one day and not the next with
>> absolutely no reason... Now there were some changes to windows
>> security settings that make it less interoperable with samba (not
>> samba's fault) samba has also made security changes to make samba
>> more secure. One utility i have used for 10 years and has been
>> wonderful is "Webmin" its great for configuring most of the
basic
>> linux systems and most all of the basic server software. I highly
>> recommend it..
>> So after setting a share checking passwords and rights i spent 20
>> hours trying to figure out why i couldnt access share and found on
>> centos(my distro) in addition to the samba share you also have to do
>> a "chcon -t samba_share_t /path" to turn on the samba
security flag
>> or it wont allow samba to access the directory.. Now in my browser i
>> cannot see the samba system but i have no problem accessing it. This
>> may be a result of that IPC$ share that you sometimes get i think its
>> a pc share that windows does automatically that you may have to share
>> the "computer" in order for
>> It to be viewable like windows does. This is a function i want on
>> mine so maybe we can work on it together... Im out and about right
>> now but ill sent you a couple things to try when I get home.
>>
>> Chad
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On Jul 16, 2016, at 9:06 PM, coffeeking <coffeekingms at
gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> hi
>>>
>>> Not just yet. I've set up a windows 10 instance on my desktop
to
>>> test with. It's not activated so I've got a month to test,
will
>>> probably only keep it around a couple of days. How is windows doing
>>> this? When I go to connect to mellisa's computer which is
running
>>> windows 7, even with the workgroup name changed from the default
>>> windows finds it and connects. I try the same on linux and I get
>>> "cannot mount windows share. No such file or directory."
It's
>>> maddening. I'm not complaining, I'm just curious. Why is
windows
>>> able to autoconfigure itself, and samba isn't? Or is it, and I
>>> haven't set the right options?
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>>
>>> Kendell Clark
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> On 7/16/2016 9:01 PM, Methosomega wrote:
>>>> Welcome kendell, i just signed up today my self... Have you
gotten
>>>> your issue resolved? I see a lot of info but I cant tell who is
>>>> who, it doesn't say..
>>>>
>>>> Chad
>>>>
>>>>> On Jul 16, 2016, at 7:44 PM, kendell clark
>>>>> <coffeekingms at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> hi
>>>>> Basically I'm trying to come up with a default config
file that will
>>>>> allow people to access their stuff that reside on windows
computers,
>>>>> macs or linux computers from across the network. I know
windows
>>>>> uses the
>>>>> "WORKGROUP" name by default unless you change it,
but one thing I've
>>>>> noticed is that samba can't simply query windows for
the info it
>>>>> needs,
>>>>> it has to be set explicitly. Windows is somehow able to
figure this
>>>>> stuff out. I'm going to guess that the way windows does
this is some
>>>>> patented ultra secret method that samba can't use or it
would. I
>>>>> don't
>>>>> know if it's possible to come up with a one size fits
all config
>>>>> file,
>>>>> but is it possible to come up with one that will work with
most
>>>>> "default" windows installations where the user
hasn't changed the
>>>>> settings from the way they're initially set? I'm
new to all of
>>>>> this, so
>>>>> if there's good docs on all of this, just point me to
them and
>>>>> I'll get
>>>>> out of your hair.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks
>>>>> Kendell Clark
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Xen wrote:
>>>>>> kendell clark schreef op 16-07-2016 9:31:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> hi all
>>>>>>> My name is Kendell Clark, and I've just
subscribed to this list. I
>>>>>>> thought I'd write this email to introduce
myself, and ask a
>>>>>>> couple of
>>>>>>> questions about configuring samba. I'm a co
developer of a linux
>>>>>>> distribution for the visually impaired and disabled
called Sonar
>>>>>>> GNU
>>>>>>> linux, which you can learn more about at
>>>>>>> http://www.sonargnulinux.com.
>>>>>>> I've been struggling to come up with a default
samba
>>>>>>> configuration file
>>>>>>> that will work for at least most windows and linux
environments
>>>>>>> if not
>>>>>>> all.
>>>>>> Basically you want a configuration for the local
systems running
>>>>>> your
>>>>>> distribution that will share stuff in a certain default
way?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Or are you also concerned with importing stuff from the
other
>>>>>> computers?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Importing stuff might be an issue as it depends on the
GUI of your
>>>>>> distribution? What I mean is that e.g. Linux Mint
(Cinnamon) is
>>>>>> rather
>>>>>> user friendly but I would not suggest it is ready for
everything
>>>>>> such
>>>>>> as mounting random shares from other servers? I
haven't tried in
>>>>>> full.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I do know Mint supports the USERSHARE thing and will
allow people to
>>>>>> share their own folders from the GUI as long as you
don't mess
>>>>>> with it
>>>>>> behind the scenes (e.g. using a net command yourself)
because it
>>>>>> doesn't sync that.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So I do not know how good the mounting experience is
from Linux.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Personally I am trying to fix it as much as possible
from my own
>>>>>> project in such a way that the names of the shares are
almost
>>>>>> incapable of being changed (by a regular user).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A convient mount dialog, that also reinstates a mount
on login,
>>>>>> to my
>>>>>> knowledge and mind, doesn't really exist yet.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This is not Samba, this is mount.cifs, and the GUI
configuration
>>>>>> whatever Distro or DE uses.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> My next couple of questions have to do with the
windows side of
>>>>>>> things.
>>>>>>> I don't use it myself I'm  strictly a linux
guy but I do set
>>>>>>> windows up
>>>>>>> for my fiance a lot, and  I install it on my laptop
periodically
>>>>>>> to test
>>>>>>> samba on to make sure it works like I've set it
up. One thing I've
>>>>>>> noticed is that it seems somehow able to
autoconfigure most of this
>>>>>>> stuff. If I change the work group name on
mellisa's computer, a
>>>>>>> windows
>>>>>>> installation on my desktop or another computer
finds it and
>>>>>>> connects
>>>>>>> with no problems, prompting for a user name and
password.
>>>>>> You mean for shares that were already configured
previously and are
>>>>>> now slightly changed on the "server"?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Samba doesn't.
>>>>>>> It simply won't connect. Is there an
"automatic" or "figure it out"
>>>>>>> option in the config file I can use? The only
reason I'm asking is
>>>>>>> because a lot of my users are not very experienced
they're mostly
>>>>>>> windows users and they expect things to more or
less configure
>>>>>>> themselves. If they have to configure stuff their
first option is
>>>>>>> generally to complain and ask why I can't
simply do it for them.
>>>>>> This is not really Samba, again, I am not meaning to be
rude.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> But Samba has very little to do with actually
/accessing/ files (or
>>>>>> shares).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Most configuration is done by GUI environments that try
to make some
>>>>>> of it work.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Now I realize the "client" side of things is
also important. I am
>>>>>> just
>>>>>> wishing to elude that the user side of this with
regards to this, is
>>>>>> actually a componenent of your desktop environment
(mate, as you
>>>>>> call
>>>>>> it).
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> My next
>>>>>>> question has to do with this "homegroup"
stuff. I don't know
>>>>>>> much about
>>>>>>> windows but this seems to be a different sharing
system, not
>>>>>>> cifs, and
>>>>>>> windows specific. Can samba take advantage of these
or should I
>>>>>>> just
>>>>>>> disable the home group stuff on all the windows
computers I want to
>>>>>>> connect with?
>>>>>> I personally consider the HomeGroup a very detrimental
thing. They
>>>>>> have broken network-browsing, apparently, for regular
fileshares and
>>>>>> won't even allow you to see the hosts on the
network anymore,
>>>>>> instead
>>>>>> opening webpages to configure routers and such, if
these can be
>>>>>> found.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If anything, I would want to change Windows computers
such that
>>>>>> regular browsing works again; that will solve a lot of
problems.
>>>>>> Even
>>>>>> among Windows computers themselves, HomeGroup is
terribly
>>>>>> annoying and
>>>>>> inconvenient.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It appears the only way from e.g. a Windows 10 computer
to access
>>>>>> any
>>>>>> shares on the network, is to use a direct access link
like
>>>>>> \\server\share. That is the most inconvenient thing
there has ever
>>>>>> been for a Windows user. I do not know how to turn
HomeGroup (In
>>>>>> Windows 10) off myself, but I would really stay away
from it if I
>>>>>> were
>>>>>> you, rather than try to incorporate it in your system
(although a
>>>>>> best
>>>>>> of both worlds may be possible if you do want to
support it).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Support" is not the same as "Wanting to
use it".
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I don't get the Windows filesharing thing anymore.
I must be getting
>>>>>> old (35 now ;-)).
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> My last question has to do with what samba shows
when I do
>>>>>>> manage to connect to my fiance's windows
computer. A typical
>>>>>>> listing
>>>>>>> looks like
>>>>>>> $admin$
>>>>>>> c$
>>>>>>> f$
>>>>>>> Users
>>>>>>> The only one I can successfully connect to is the
"users"
>>>>>>> folder. The
>>>>>>> rest lock me out regardless of what user name and
password I
>>>>>>> supply.
>>>>>> I take it your c$ and f$ are complete volume shares? I
mean a
>>>>>> complete
>>>>>> "partition" with a drive letter is getting
shared?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I have no clue why that wouldn't mount, I have not
tried it myself,
>>>>>> sorry. But in general it seems like the stuff you want
to mount
>>>>>> cannot
>>>>>> end with a $ sign?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> If
>>>>>>> I connect through a test windows installation
windows doesn't
>>>>>>> display
>>>>>>> anything but the "Users" item so I'm
guessing those are system
>>>>>>> shares
>>>>>>> that aren't supposed to be used.
>>>>>> Ah, yes.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> In order to access flash drives,
>>>>>>> external hard drives, etc across the network I have
to set them up
>>>>>>> explicitly to be shared. I'm wondering if samba
can access these?
>>>>>> Sure, why not. Do you mean shares from Windows
computers, or shares
>>>>>> from your own systems?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You ask about Samba access, not samba sharing.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There is no inhibition in Samba (mount.cifs) to mount
shared
>>>>>> directories from other hosts. The inhibition is in how
convenient
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> user interface of the local system is going to be in
configuring all
>>>>>> of that (and not getting fixed with a solution that is
>>>>>> unchangable by
>>>>>> a regular user).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I am not knowledgeable enough yet about the GVFS
system. I do
>>>>>> know you
>>>>>> can sufficiently configure stuff for display in fstab:
there are
>>>>>> options for choosing the name that something will have
in your
>>>>>> GUI, I
>>>>>> take it this is the same for Mate as it is for
Cinnamon.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> x-gvfs-show and x-gvfs-name come to mind. Look it up,
it will
>>>>>> help, I
>>>>>> guess.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> But these are "root" access things that mess
up fstab. I am sure
>>>>>> it is
>>>>>> also possible to get stuff mounted in /media/user/, I
just don't
>>>>>> know
>>>>>> how good that will be.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You will need to find a way to either integrate the
"Gnome
>>>>>> Automounter" (using /media/user) or by having a
custom solution that
>>>>>> adds and changes things in fstab to be able to pass
those "pretty"
>>>>>> parameters to Mate/Cinnamon.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> However, I do not know if a solution exists that will
be so
>>>>>> convenient
>>>>>> that it asks your for a password when you log in.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That also doesn't exist for mounting crypt shares.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Not really. Not very well. If I put something in
crypttab, SystemD
>>>>>> will bug me with its unlocking, even it is set to
noauto and nofail.
>>>>>> SystemD is not a very good beast.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So I cannot put those shares (or cryptdevices) in fstab
or crypttab
>>>>>> the way I want to.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And then the mounting feature from Cinnamon also
won't work. Anyway.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And if
>>>>>>> so, how to set it up? Sorry to ask so many
questions, I'm just
>>>>>>> trying to
>>>>>>> come up with a default samba configuration that
will work in most
>>>>>>> situations without configuration needed, if
that's possible. I'm a
>>>>>>> fairly knowledgable linux user but i'm still
learning how to
>>>>>>> develop a
>>>>>>> linux distribution that's user friendly and
does what most users
>>>>>>> want
>>>>>>> out of the box. My files are attached, they're
both very small.
>>>>>>> Thanks for any help
>>>>>> Like I said, I am a little angry with myself for not
making it more
>>>>>> clear in a nice way, that most of the user interface
stuff doesn't
>>>>>> really belong to Samba in that sense ;-).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Regards.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> But you have my sympathy, I am trying to do much of the
same thing
>>>>>> currently with Cinnamon, but just dealing with a system
of fixed
>>>>>> mounts that I want to have the user to have no say
about ;-).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Of course, having actual convenience would be much
nicer.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Regards.
>>>>> -- 
>>>>> To unsubscribe from this list go to the following URL and
read the
>>>>> instructions: 
https://lists.samba.org/mailman/options/samba
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> To unsubscribe from this list go to the following URL and read the
>>> instructions:  https://lists.samba.org/mailman/options/samba
>

hi
Ok, this is odd. Samba now works. I went to smb://blackfang, samba
prompted me for my user name and password, and then connected. There was
an smbclient update, and that must've fixed it because before that it
wouldn't work. My final question is printer sharing. Is it simple to set
up printer sharing where a printer is installed on a windows machine and
shared across the network and if so, how to configure samba for this?
There's probably docs on this and if you like you can point me to them
and I'll read up on that.
Thanks
Kendell Clark


kendell clark wrote:
> hi
> Ok, I've now got more info. Doing smbclient -L blackfang returns the
> following error. unknown name switch type dns. session setup failed.
> NT_STATUS_LOGON_FAILURE. This is frustrating. Isn't this supposed to
> work regardless of whether I have an account on the machine I'm trying
> to connect to? Hear's what I'm trying to do. I'm basically
trying to
> configure samba, however I need to so that when I try to connect to a
> windows computer or a linux computer running samba, it asks me for a
> user account and password if needed, otherwise it connects without
> error. Why is this proving so difficult? I'm really sorry if I sound
> frustrated, it's not you guys at all. I've been banging my head
against
> the wall with this for about a week, trying to configure samba before
> releasing  the new stable image of sonar to the public. It also doesn't
> help that most of my users are not at all understanding when something
> they expect to work doesn't. Windows just works, why can't linux
work
> like windows, so on and so forth. That's what I have to look forward to
> if I get this wrong.
>
> Thanks
> Kendell Clark
>
>
> coffeeking wrote:
>> hi
>>
>> Completely agree about windows. From what I'm hearing on this list
>> there's no "default" file that will do what I want? If
I'm
>> understanding this right it's not how samba is configured so much
as
>> it is what the gui tools will let me do? I use the mate desktop, with
>> the caja file manager and it's caja share extension. I've tried
a few
>> things, connecting to smb:blackfang. This will think for a few seconds
>> and then return with "no such file or directory". I'm
sorry to keep
>> going back to the same circles, I'm just trying to understand how
>> these things work. I'd like to come up with a smb.conf file which
will
>> work for most users, since a lot of them connect to windows computers
>> or linux boxes running a samba server. Is this possible? dolphin
isn't
>> an option for me because orca, the linux gtk screen reader, can't
read
>> it. I do know that trying to connect to windows computers over the
>> network with nautilus or caja yields  the "no such file or
directory"
>> error or "connection timed out". I'm missing something,
just not sure
>> what. If I'm being annoying, please don't hesitate to point me
to
>> docs. It also sounds like results may vary based on what linux
>> distribution you use. Sonar is based on the manjaro linux distro which
>> is in turn based on arch, if that helps.
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>> Kendell Clark
>>
>>
>>
>> On 7/16/2016 9:54 PM, Methosomega wrote:
>>> Windows is built to be generically compatible and configurable for
>>> the common person. This does not make well for stability, function,
>>> or security. Linux is built for everything but ease... To this end
>>> there are gui apps that allow you to easily configure samba.
Nothing
>>> "just works" but when it does, it will never fail under
most
>>> circumstances. Windows it will work one day and not the next with
>>> absolutely no reason... Now there were some changes to windows
>>> security settings that make it less interoperable with samba (not
>>> samba's fault) samba has also made security changes to make
samba
>>> more secure. One utility i have used for 10 years and has been
>>> wonderful is "Webmin" its great for configuring most of
the basic
>>> linux systems and most all of the basic server software. I highly
>>> recommend it..
>>> So after setting a share checking passwords and rights i spent 20
>>> hours trying to figure out why i couldnt access share and found on
>>> centos(my distro) in addition to the samba share you also have to
do
>>> a "chcon -t samba_share_t /path" to turn on the samba
security flag
>>> or it wont allow samba to access the directory.. Now in my browser
i
>>> cannot see the samba system but i have no problem accessing it.
This
>>> may be a result of that IPC$ share that you sometimes get i think
its
>>> a pc share that windows does automatically that you may have to
share
>>> the "computer" in order for
>>> It to be viewable like windows does. This is a function i want on
>>> mine so maybe we can work on it together... Im out and about right
>>> now but ill sent you a couple things to try when I get home.
>>>
>>> Chad
>>>
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>>> On Jul 16, 2016, at 9:06 PM, coffeeking <coffeekingms at
gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> hi
>>>>
>>>> Not just yet. I've set up a windows 10 instance on my
desktop to
>>>> test with. It's not activated so I've got a month to
test, will
>>>> probably only keep it around a couple of days. How is windows
doing
>>>> this? When I go to connect to mellisa's computer which is
running
>>>> windows 7, even with the workgroup name changed from the
default
>>>> windows finds it and connects. I try the same on linux and I
get
>>>> "cannot mount windows share. No such file or
directory." It's
>>>> maddening. I'm not complaining, I'm just curious. Why
is windows
>>>> able to autoconfigure itself, and samba isn't? Or is it,
and I
>>>> haven't set the right options?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks
>>>>
>>>> Kendell Clark
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> On 7/16/2016 9:01 PM, Methosomega wrote:
>>>>> Welcome kendell, i just signed up today my self... Have you
gotten
>>>>> your issue resolved? I see a lot of info but I cant tell
who is
>>>>> who, it doesn't say..
>>>>>
>>>>> Chad
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Jul 16, 2016, at 7:44 PM, kendell clark
>>>>>> <coffeekingms at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> hi
>>>>>> Basically I'm trying to come up with a default
config file that will
>>>>>> allow people to access their stuff that reside on
windows computers,
>>>>>> macs or linux computers from across the network. I know
windows
>>>>>> uses the
>>>>>> "WORKGROUP" name by default unless you change
it, but one thing I've
>>>>>> noticed is that samba can't simply query windows
for the info it
>>>>>> needs,
>>>>>> it has to be set explicitly. Windows is somehow able to
figure this
>>>>>> stuff out. I'm going to guess that the way windows
does this is some
>>>>>> patented ultra secret method that samba can't use
or it would. I
>>>>>> don't
>>>>>> know if it's possible to come up with a one size
fits all config
>>>>>> file,
>>>>>> but is it possible to come up with one that will work
with most
>>>>>> "default" windows installations where the
user hasn't changed the
>>>>>> settings from the way they're initially set?
I'm new to all of
>>>>>> this, so
>>>>>> if there's good docs on all of this, just point me
to them and
>>>>>> I'll get
>>>>>> out of your hair.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks
>>>>>> Kendell Clark
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Xen wrote:
>>>>>>> kendell clark schreef op 16-07-2016 9:31:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> hi all
>>>>>>>> My name is Kendell Clark, and I've just
subscribed to this list. I
>>>>>>>> thought I'd write this email to introduce
myself, and ask a
>>>>>>>> couple of
>>>>>>>> questions about configuring samba. I'm a co
developer of a linux
>>>>>>>> distribution for the visually impaired and
disabled called Sonar
>>>>>>>> GNU
>>>>>>>> linux, which you can learn more about at
>>>>>>>> http://www.sonargnulinux.com.
>>>>>>>> I've been struggling to come up with a
default samba
>>>>>>>> configuration file
>>>>>>>> that will work for at least most windows and
linux environments
>>>>>>>> if not
>>>>>>>> all.
>>>>>>> Basically you want a configuration for the local
systems running
>>>>>>> your
>>>>>>> distribution that will share stuff in a certain
default way?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Or are you also concerned with importing stuff from
the other
>>>>>>> computers?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Importing stuff might be an issue as it depends on
the GUI of your
>>>>>>> distribution? What I mean is that e.g. Linux Mint
(Cinnamon) is
>>>>>>> rather
>>>>>>> user friendly but I would not suggest it is ready
for everything
>>>>>>> such
>>>>>>> as mounting random shares from other servers? I
haven't tried in
>>>>>>> full.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I do know Mint supports the USERSHARE thing and
will allow people to
>>>>>>> share their own folders from the GUI as long as you
don't mess
>>>>>>> with it
>>>>>>> behind the scenes (e.g. using a net command
yourself) because it
>>>>>>> doesn't sync that.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So I do not know how good the mounting experience
is from Linux.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Personally I am trying to fix it as much as
possible from my own
>>>>>>> project in such a way that the names of the shares
are almost
>>>>>>> incapable of being changed (by a regular user).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A convient mount dialog, that also reinstates a
mount on login,
>>>>>>> to my
>>>>>>> knowledge and mind, doesn't really exist yet.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This is not Samba, this is mount.cifs, and the GUI
configuration
>>>>>>> whatever Distro or DE uses.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> My next couple of questions have to do with the
windows side of
>>>>>>>> things.
>>>>>>>> I don't use it myself I'm  strictly a
linux guy but I do set
>>>>>>>> windows up
>>>>>>>> for my fiance a lot, and  I install it on my
laptop periodically
>>>>>>>> to test
>>>>>>>> samba on to make sure it works like I've
set it up. One thing I've
>>>>>>>> noticed is that it seems somehow able to
autoconfigure most of this
>>>>>>>> stuff. If I change the work group name on
mellisa's computer, a
>>>>>>>> windows
>>>>>>>> installation on my desktop or another computer
finds it and
>>>>>>>> connects
>>>>>>>> with no problems, prompting for a user name and
password.
>>>>>>> You mean for shares that were already configured
previously and are
>>>>>>> now slightly changed on the "server"?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Samba doesn't.
>>>>>>>> It simply won't connect. Is there an
"automatic" or "figure it out"
>>>>>>>> option in the config file I can use? The only
reason I'm asking is
>>>>>>>> because a lot of my users are not very
experienced they're mostly
>>>>>>>> windows users and they expect things to more or
less configure
>>>>>>>> themselves. If they have to configure stuff
their first option is
>>>>>>>> generally to complain and ask why I can't
simply do it for them.
>>>>>>> This is not really Samba, again, I am not meaning
to be rude.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But Samba has very little to do with actually
/accessing/ files (or
>>>>>>> shares).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Most configuration is done by GUI environments that
try to make some
>>>>>>> of it work.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Now I realize the "client" side of things
is also important. I am
>>>>>>> just
>>>>>>> wishing to elude that the user side of this with
regards to this, is
>>>>>>> actually a componenent of your desktop environment
(mate, as you
>>>>>>> call
>>>>>>> it).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> My next
>>>>>>>> question has to do with this
"homegroup" stuff. I don't know
>>>>>>>> much about
>>>>>>>> windows but this seems to be a different
sharing system, not
>>>>>>>> cifs, and
>>>>>>>> windows specific. Can samba take advantage of
these or should I
>>>>>>>> just
>>>>>>>> disable the home group stuff on all the windows
computers I want to
>>>>>>>> connect with?
>>>>>>> I personally consider the HomeGroup a very
detrimental thing. They
>>>>>>> have broken network-browsing, apparently, for
regular fileshares and
>>>>>>> won't even allow you to see the hosts on the
network anymore,
>>>>>>> instead
>>>>>>> opening webpages to configure routers and such, if
these can be
>>>>>>> found.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> If anything, I would want to change Windows
computers such that
>>>>>>> regular browsing works again; that will solve a lot
of problems.
>>>>>>> Even
>>>>>>> among Windows computers themselves, HomeGroup is
terribly
>>>>>>> annoying and
>>>>>>> inconvenient.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It appears the only way from e.g. a Windows 10
computer to access
>>>>>>> any
>>>>>>> shares on the network, is to use a direct access
link like
>>>>>>> \\server\share. That is the most inconvenient thing
there has ever
>>>>>>> been for a Windows user. I do not know how to turn
HomeGroup (In
>>>>>>> Windows 10) off myself, but I would really stay
away from it if I
>>>>>>> were
>>>>>>> you, rather than try to incorporate it in your
system (although a
>>>>>>> best
>>>>>>> of both worlds may be possible if you do want to
support it).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "Support" is not the same as
"Wanting to use it".
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I don't get the Windows filesharing thing
anymore. I must be getting
>>>>>>> old (35 now ;-)).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> My last question has to do with what samba
shows when I do
>>>>>>>> manage to connect to my fiance's windows
computer. A typical
>>>>>>>> listing
>>>>>>>> looks like
>>>>>>>> $admin$
>>>>>>>> c$
>>>>>>>> f$
>>>>>>>> Users
>>>>>>>> The only one I can successfully connect to is
the "users"
>>>>>>>> folder. The
>>>>>>>> rest lock me out regardless of what user name
and password I
>>>>>>>> supply.
>>>>>>> I take it your c$ and f$ are complete volume
shares? I mean a
>>>>>>> complete
>>>>>>> "partition" with a drive letter is
getting shared?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I have no clue why that wouldn't mount, I have
not tried it myself,
>>>>>>> sorry. But in general it seems like the stuff you
want to mount
>>>>>>> cannot
>>>>>>> end with a $ sign?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If
>>>>>>>> I connect through a test windows installation
windows doesn't
>>>>>>>> display
>>>>>>>> anything but the "Users" item so
I'm guessing those are system
>>>>>>>> shares
>>>>>>>> that aren't supposed to be used.
>>>>>>> Ah, yes.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> In order to access flash drives,
>>>>>>>> external hard drives, etc across the network I
have to set them up
>>>>>>>> explicitly to be shared. I'm wondering if
samba can access these?
>>>>>>> Sure, why not. Do you mean shares from Windows
computers, or shares
>>>>>>> from your own systems?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You ask about Samba access, not samba sharing.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> There is no inhibition in Samba (mount.cifs) to
mount shared
>>>>>>> directories from other hosts. The inhibition is in
how convenient
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> user interface of the local system is going to be
in configuring all
>>>>>>> of that (and not getting fixed with a solution that
is
>>>>>>> unchangable by
>>>>>>> a regular user).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I am not knowledgeable enough yet about the GVFS
system. I do
>>>>>>> know you
>>>>>>> can sufficiently configure stuff for display in
fstab: there are
>>>>>>> options for choosing the name that something will
have in your
>>>>>>> GUI, I
>>>>>>> take it this is the same for Mate as it is for
Cinnamon.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> x-gvfs-show and x-gvfs-name come to mind. Look it
up, it will
>>>>>>> help, I
>>>>>>> guess.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But these are "root" access things that
mess up fstab. I am sure
>>>>>>> it is
>>>>>>> also possible to get stuff mounted in /media/user/,
I just don't
>>>>>>> know
>>>>>>> how good that will be.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You will need to find a way to either integrate the
"Gnome
>>>>>>> Automounter" (using /media/user) or by having
a custom solution that
>>>>>>> adds and changes things in fstab to be able to pass
those "pretty"
>>>>>>> parameters to Mate/Cinnamon.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> However, I do not know if a solution exists that
will be so
>>>>>>> convenient
>>>>>>> that it asks your for a password when you log in.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That also doesn't exist for mounting crypt
shares.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Not really. Not very well. If I put something in
crypttab, SystemD
>>>>>>> will bug me with its unlocking, even it is set to
noauto and nofail.
>>>>>>> SystemD is not a very good beast.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So I cannot put those shares (or cryptdevices) in
fstab or crypttab
>>>>>>> the way I want to.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And then the mounting feature from Cinnamon also
won't work. Anyway.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> And if
>>>>>>>> so, how to set it up? Sorry to ask so many
questions, I'm just
>>>>>>>> trying to
>>>>>>>> come up with a default samba configuration that
will work in most
>>>>>>>> situations without configuration needed, if
that's possible. I'm a
>>>>>>>> fairly knowledgable linux user but i'm
still learning how to
>>>>>>>> develop a
>>>>>>>> linux distribution that's user friendly and
does what most users
>>>>>>>> want
>>>>>>>> out of the box. My files are attached,
they're both very small.
>>>>>>>> Thanks for any help
>>>>>>> Like I said, I am a little angry with myself for
not making it more
>>>>>>> clear in a nice way, that most of the user
interface stuff doesn't
>>>>>>> really belong to Samba in that sense ;-).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Regards.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But you have my sympathy, I am trying to do much of
the same thing
>>>>>>> currently with Cinnamon, but just dealing with a
system of fixed
>>>>>>> mounts that I want to have the user to have no say
about ;-).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Of course, having actual convenience would be much
nicer.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Regards.
>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this list go to the following URL
and read the
>>>>>> instructions: 
https://lists.samba.org/mailman/options/samba
>>>> -- 
>>>> To unsubscribe from this list go to the following URL and read
the
>>>> instructions:  https://lists.samba.org/mailman/options/samba

On 17/07/16 09:35, kendell clark wrote:
> hi
> Ok, this is odd. Samba now works. I went to smb://blackfang, samba
> prompted me for my user name and password, and then connected. There was
> an smbclient update, and that must've fixed it because before that it
> wouldn't work. My final question is printer sharing. Is it simple to
set
> up printer sharing where a printer is installed on a windows machine and
> shared across the network and if so, how to configure samba for this?
> There's probably docs on this and if you like you can point me to them
> and I'll read up on that.
> Thanks
> Kendell Clark
>
>
>
Your wish is my command :-)

See here: https://wiki.samba.org/index.php/Print_server_support

Rowland

kendell clark schreef op 17-07-2016 8:00:
> hi
> Ok, I've now got more info. Doing smbclient -L blackfang returns the
> following error. unknown name switch type dns. session setup failed.
> NT_STATUS_LOGON_FAILURE.
I don't know why it fails there or did fail there. But typically you can 
use the -N option to specify the Guest account.

Your call must be:

smbclient -NL blackfang

(N becomes before the L here).

I understand your error and your frustration, it is not your fault.

When developers in general are content with a solution that works for 
experts, that means that in general you need to become an expert before 
you can use it. In general developers are experts and when experts are 
their target audience....

Or you could also put it this way: if the target audience is an audience 
that has already, in general, on average, spent at least 20.000 hours 
learning Linux, then that shifts the idea of how user friendly your 
solution should be.

Further many Linux people (not saying developers, but the people around 
them as well) do not like to hear much that something doesn't work.

The attitudes on this list are much more user friendly than what you 
will see around, from my perspective and opinion.

So there is nothing to blame but, well, culture.

In any case, I can try to help as much as I can, but I do not have a 
solution myself, as this really requires GUI development, and the best I 
can do myself is shell scripting, or at best hacking C source code to 
make something work that currently doesn't. I find that "server"
coding
is easier to get started with than "GUI coding".



> This is frustrating. Isn't this supposed to
> work regardless of whether I have an account on the machine I'm trying
> to connect to?
Guest user.
>  Hear's what I'm trying to do. I'm basically trying to
> configure samba, however I need to so that when I try to connect to a
> windows computer or a linux computer running samba, it asks me for a
> user account and password if needed, otherwise it connects without
> error.
It is using guest user by default.

> Why is this proving so difficult? I'm really sorry if I sound
> frustrated, it's not you guys at all.
I do not know if you are visually impaired yourself. I had a friend who 
was a great programmer but his eyesight was so bad that his computer 
operation was so severely limited that the simplest of things (for me) 
were very hard for him because his reading speed was just way below 
mine.

Not saying that to be negative. Just saying that I could understand if 
using Linux would be harder for someone with bad eyesight. The amount of 
reading you have to do sometimes to get the simplest things working is 
abysmal.

This friend wanted to use some C library or C++ library on his Windows 
computer and he did not understand how to use it. This boggled my mind a 
bit because such things are generally rather easy. He didn't know how to 
install it. It appears he had been programming for quite a number of 
years. But he required on-screen magnification, a huge screen, and 
mostly also, a huge keyboard ;-).

I understand running up against walls, I do so myself all the time. 
Recently I ran up to the "autofs" wall being scarcely documented. The 
developer promised he would add the missing bits to the documentation. 
It is like the key to the secret of how it worked, was missing.

People who have learned these things in the past "the hard way" now 
often forget how it was for them to learn it. Then, they consider such 
knowledge "obvious" but it was never for them. When they learned it.

What they already know, they think a new person should easily be able to 
learn, but they forget that they already know all the pathways. They do 
not have to look for the pathways. And they don't realize this.

They don't comprehend a person that doesn't already know where to find 
what they think that new person should be looking for. Ie. sure it is in 
the manual, but you know where to find it, but the other person doesn't.

Everything becomes rather easy if you've already scaled the walls and 
know all the crevices.

Finding your way blindly proves to be a little harder than what people 
expect, no pun intended ;-).


>  I've been banging my head against
> the wall with this for about a week, trying to configure samba before
> releasing  the new stable image of sonar to the public. It also doesn't
> help that most of my users are not at all understanding when something
> they expect to work doesn't. Windows just works, why can't linux
work
> like windows, so on and so forth. That's what I have to look forward to
> if I get this wrong.
Can't blame them. A small team of 5 people working at this for 3 months 
would have the most perfect solution available for everyone (from a GUI 
perspective). We also have small teams (so to speak) of 5 people working 
at it for 3 months, but they perform so poorly on a whole that they 
produce maybe 1% of the advances that the other team could achieve.

In Linux, I believe, without hoping to offend anyone here, and 
particularly in the arena of graphical user interfaces where everyone 
has a different idea of what needs to happen, cooperation between 
developers and other creatives seems to be so difficult that progress is 
kept back merely by way of disagreement.

Also a lot of people want (their) users to like something, instead of 
making what people like. So first I make something and then I get you to 
like it, instead of the other way around. User opinion is often 
disregarded and frustrated.

Take KDE. You can choose from about 10 Window Switchers (Window List 
switchers when you press alt-tab) but all of them are bad.

Cinnamon (Mint) has one that is almost perfect and convenient to use. 
Why the difference?

Apparently the KDE people are not content with using the obvious. So 
either the thumbnails are too big, or they are too small. But the middle 
ground is not ventured.

You can't actually have normal-sized icons. You can only have those that 
are too small, or too big.

So you have 10 alternative ways of doing things, and none of them are 
right. And then someone else makes only a single alternative, and it is 
perfect.

:-/.

Meaning. You can have a million developers doing the bad thing, and 
after you set those million developers to work for a million hours each, 
you will still not have anything worth of mention.

But if you merely take one person doing the right thing, within 5000 
hours you will have something outstanding.


...on the Kate/Kwrite developer list there is now mention of a bug that 
was fixed before. But after a revamp the code was thrown out, and the 
bug returned. Now the developer that fixed the bug is asking for 
volunteers to tackle the issue because apparently he doesn't know how to 
do it anymore?

It's a very simple problem. And see how they go about it. See how it is 
getting tackled.

It is frustratingly inefficient this way of working, without hoping to 
put anyone in a bad light personally here.

So my general appraisal of the Linux situation in terms of user 
interfaces is that people get mired in work that does't get them 
anywhere, and inefficiently get stuck while not advancing, while someone 
else using a different way of working, or a different way of 
cooperating, would have been miles ahead by now.

Everyone seems to be stuck in the mud. Well, anyway. The Cinnamon and 
Mint people (Mate also) seem to be doing much better and appear to be 
advancing much faster.

So I think some of them are not unkind to hearing actual use cases that 
you might have and what you run into. I am not familiar with their 
developer channels just yet.

My apologies if this is too much text.

The I Ching mentions:

"No game in the field". It is not enough to be persistent in
searching.
You also have to look in the right place.

Well, whatever ;-). Regards.

Am 17.07.2016 um 17:48 schrieb Xen:
> I do not know if you are visually impaired yourself. I had a friend who
> was a great programmer but his eyesight was so bad that his computer
> operation was so severely limited that the simplest of things (for me)
> were very hard for him because his reading speed was just way below mine.
>
> Not saying that to be negative. Just saying that I could understand if
> using Linux would be harder for someone with bad eyesight. The amount of
> reading you have to do sometimes to get the simplest things working is
> abysmal
seriously?

i started to migrate anything to Linux in 2006 after my corneal 
transplantation on the first eye which means you can't read anything 
with that for at least one year at a time where the other eye worked 50% 
at best

you rargumentation is really adventurous

the opposite maybe is true - i learned to read completly different than 
normal people and focus the important parts which makes me read and 
understand technical documentations or configurations 2-3 times faster 
the average people since i need only to read a small amount uf text

at least that is what i notice for a decade and let me despair from time 
to time

-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: signature.asc
Type: application/pgp-signature
Size: 181 bytes
Desc: OpenPGP digital signature
URL:
<http://lists.samba.org/pipermail/samba/attachments/20160717/bc6df218/signature.sig>