(well, from me anyway. I promise) Trying to follow the "Self-referential Many-to-Many Relationships" recipe from the Rails Recipes book. This is what I''m doing: Tasks can have a predecessor relationship with each other. My Task class has this: has_and_belongs_to_many :predecessors, :class_name => "Task", :join_table => "predecessor", :association_foreign_key => "predecessor_id", :foreign_key => "task_id" The join table predecessor looks like this: CREATE TABLE predecessor ( predecessor_id BIGINT NOT NULL, task_id BIGINT NOT NULL ); if I create two tasks t1 and t2 and make t2 a predecessor of t1 (like so: t1.predecessors << t2), then I can access t2 in memory ala t1.predecessors[0]. but calling save on t1 has no effect on persisting the predecessor relationship and if I populate the join table manually to create predecessors for t1, t1.predecessors still returns []. In my environment I have: ActiveRecord::Base.pluralize_table_names = false and in any case I''ve tried both :join_table => "predecessor" , and :join_table => "predecessors" with the same result. what am i doing wrong? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://wrath.rubyonrails.org/pipermail/rails/attachments/20060427/9a405c44/attachment.html