R help - Jan 2008 - Linux, UNIX, XP32, Vista X64 or ...? [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

Dear All,
I am currently using R in Windows PC with a 2 GB of RAM. Some pretty large
datasets are expected soon, perhaps in an order of several GB. I am facing a
similar situation like Ralph, either to get a new PC with a bigger RAM or
else. I am just wondering if R is getting faster in other systems like UNIX
or Linux. Any suggestions are appreciated.
Regards,
Jin
--------------------------------------------
Jin Li, PhD
Spatial Modeller/
Computational Statistician
Marine & Coastal Environment
Geoscience Australia
Ph: 61 (02) 6249 9899
Fax: 61 (02) 6249 9956
email: jin.li at ga.gov.au
--------------------------------------------


-----Original Message-----
From: r-help-bounces at r-project.org [mailto:r-help-bounces at r-project.org]
On
Behalf Of Prof Brian Ripley
Sent: Thursday, 24 January 2008 12:05
To: Ralph79
Cc: r-help at r-project.org
Subject: Re: [R] Problems with XP32-"3GB-patch"?/ Worth upgrading to
Vista
X64?

On Wed, 23 Jan 2008, Ralph79 wrote:
>
> Dear R-Users,
>
> as I will start a huge simulation in a few weeks, I am about to buy a new
> and fast PC. I have noticed, that the RAM has been the limiting factor in
> many of my calculations up to now (I had 2 GB in my "old" system,
but
> Windows still used quite a lot of virtual memory), hence my new computer
> will have 4 GB of fast DDR2-800 RAM.
>
> However, I know that 1.) Windows 32 bit cannot make use of more than about
> 3,2 GB RAM and 2.) it is normally not allowed to allocate more than 2 GB of
> RAM to one single application (at least under XP, I don't know if that
has
> changed under Vista?).
>
> I remember from the R-FAQ that you can manually adjust XP so that it
> allocates up to 3 GB to one application ("the 3GB patch"), but I
read in a
> PC-magazine and some message boards that this may cause problems. Does
> anybody of you successfully use this "trick" without any
problems?
Yes, many people: most 32-bit Exchange servers use it.  Please don't rate
the advice in the R documentation below tittle-tattle you read on the web.
> Would it be wise to use a 64bit OS, as e.g. Vista X64? I think, under Vista
> X64 it should be no problem to allocate 4 GB of RAM to R. Any experiences
> with that?
That's what the rw-FAQ says, and we do write answers based on experience!
> Thanks in advance,
> Ralph Wirth
>
>
> -----
> Ralph Wirth
> University Erlangen-Nuremberg, Chair of Statistics
> GfK Group, Department of Methods and Product Development
>
>
-- 
Brian D. Ripley,                  ripley at stats.ox.ac.uk
Professor of Applied Statistics,  http://www.stats.ox.ac.uk/~ripley/
University of Oxford,             Tel:  +44 1865 272861 (self)
1 South Parks Road,                     +44 1865 272866 (PA)
Oxford OX1 3TG, UK                Fax:  +44 1865 272595

______________________________________________
R-help at r-project.org mailing list
https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help
PLEASE do read the posting guide http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html
and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.

Jin.Li at ga.gov.au wrote:
> Dear All,
> I am currently using R in Windows PC with a 2 GB of RAM. Some pretty large
> datasets are expected soon, perhaps in an order of several GB. I am facing
a
> similar situation like Ralph, either to get a new PC with a bigger RAM or
> else. I am just wondering if R is getting faster in other systems like UNIX
> or Linux. Any suggestions are appreciated.
> Regards,
> Jin
>   
It has always been faster in Linux than in Windows on the same hardware. 
In addition, the toolchain issues have been holding up 64 bit 
development  on 64 bit Windows, whereas  64 bit build has been working 
on Linux for years.
> --------------------------------------------
> Jin Li, PhD
> Spatial Modeller/
> Computational Statistician
> Marine & Coastal Environment
> Geoscience Australia
> Ph: 61 (02) 6249 9899
> Fax: 61 (02) 6249 9956
> email: jin.li at ga.gov.au
> --------------------------------------------
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: r-help-bounces at r-project.org [mailto:r-help-bounces at
r-project.org] On
> Behalf Of Prof Brian Ripley
> Sent: Thursday, 24 January 2008 12:05
> To: Ralph79
> Cc: r-help at r-project.org
> Subject: Re: [R] Problems with XP32-"3GB-patch"?/ Worth upgrading
to Vista
> X64?
>
> On Wed, 23 Jan 2008, Ralph79 wrote:
>
>   
>> Dear R-Users,
>>
>> as I will start a huge simulation in a few weeks, I am about to buy a
new
>> and fast PC. I have noticed, that the RAM has been the limiting factor
in
>> many of my calculations up to now (I had 2 GB in my "old"
system, but
>> Windows still used quite a lot of virtual memory), hence my new
computer
>> will have 4 GB of fast DDR2-800 RAM.
>>
>> However, I know that 1.) Windows 32 bit cannot make use of more than
about
>> 3,2 GB RAM and 2.) it is normally not allowed to allocate more than 2
GB of
>> RAM to one single application (at least under XP, I don't know if
that has
>> changed under Vista?).
>>
>> I remember from the R-FAQ that you can manually adjust XP so that it
>> allocates up to 3 GB to one application ("the 3GB patch"),
but I read in a
>> PC-magazine and some message boards that this may cause problems. Does
>> anybody of you successfully use this "trick" without any
problems?
>>     
>
> Yes, many people: most 32-bit Exchange servers use it.  Please don't
rate
> the advice in the R documentation below tittle-tattle you read on the web.
>
>   
>> Would it be wise to use a 64bit OS, as e.g. Vista X64? I think, under
Vista
>> X64 it should be no problem to allocate 4 GB of RAM to R. Any
experiences
>> with that?
>>     
>
> That's what the rw-FAQ says, and we do write answers based on
experience!
>
>   
>> Thanks in advance,
>> Ralph Wirth
>>
>>
>> -----
>> Ralph Wirth
>> University Erlangen-Nuremberg, Chair of Statistics
>> GfK Group, Department of Methods and Product Development
>>
>>
>>     
>
>   

-- 
   O__  ---- Peter Dalgaard             ?ster Farimagsgade 5, Entr.B
  c/ /'_ --- Dept. of Biostatistics     PO Box 2099, 1014 Cph. K
 (*) \(*) -- University of Copenhagen   Denmark          Ph:  (+45) 35327918
~~~~~~~~~~ - (p.dalgaard at biostat.ku.dk)                  FAX: (+45) 35327907

Hi Peter,
Thank you for the quick answer. 
Given that we have UNIX system available here in Geoscience Australia, I am
wondering if UNIX is also faster and with 64 bit build. Perhaps they may be
kind enough to let me have a Linux system.
As I only have experience in using Windows PC, what kind of challenges are
there for using R in other systems like UNIX and Linux? 
Thanks again,
Jin

-----Original Message-----
From: Peter Dalgaard [mailto:p.dalgaard at biostat.ku.dk] 
Sent: Thursday, 24 January 2008 10:23
To: Li Jin
Cc: r-help at r-project.org
Subject: Re: [R] Linux, UNIX, XP32, Vista X64 or ...? [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

Jin.Li at ga.gov.au wrote:
> Dear All,
> I am currently using R in Windows PC with a 2 GB of RAM. Some pretty large
> datasets are expected soon, perhaps in an order of several GB. I am facing
a
> similar situation like Ralph, either to get a new PC with a bigger RAM or
> else. I am just wondering if R is getting faster in other systems like UNIX
> or Linux. Any suggestions are appreciated.
> Regards,
> Jin
>   
It has always been faster in Linux than in Windows on the same hardware. 
In addition, the toolchain issues have been holding up 64 bit 
development  on 64 bit Windows, whereas  64 bit build has been working 
on Linux for years.
> --------------------------------------------
> Jin Li, PhD
> Spatial Modeller/
> Computational Statistician
> Marine & Coastal Environment
> Geoscience Australia
> Ph: 61 (02) 6249 9899
> Fax: 61 (02) 6249 9956
> email: jin.li at ga.gov.au
> --------------------------------------------
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: r-help-bounces at r-project.org [mailto:r-help-bounces at
r-project.org] On
> Behalf Of Prof Brian Ripley
> Sent: Thursday, 24 January 2008 12:05
> To: Ralph79
> Cc: r-help at r-project.org
> Subject: Re: [R] Problems with XP32-"3GB-patch"?/ Worth upgrading
to Vista
> X64?
>
> On Wed, 23 Jan 2008, Ralph79 wrote:
>
>   
>> Dear R-Users,
>>
>> as I will start a huge simulation in a few weeks, I am about to buy a
new
>> and fast PC. I have noticed, that the RAM has been the limiting factor
in
>> many of my calculations up to now (I had 2 GB in my "old"
system, but
>> Windows still used quite a lot of virtual memory), hence my new
computer
>> will have 4 GB of fast DDR2-800 RAM.
>>
>> However, I know that 1.) Windows 32 bit cannot make use of more than
about
>> 3,2 GB RAM and 2.) it is normally not allowed to allocate more than 2
GB
of
>> RAM to one single application (at least under XP, I don't know if
that has
>> changed under Vista?).
>>
>> I remember from the R-FAQ that you can manually adjust XP so that it
>> allocates up to 3 GB to one application ("the 3GB patch"),
but I read in a
>> PC-magazine and some message boards that this may cause problems. Does
>> anybody of you successfully use this "trick" without any
problems?
>>     
>
> Yes, many people: most 32-bit Exchange servers use it.  Please don't
rate
> the advice in the R documentation below tittle-tattle you read on the web.
>
>   
>> Would it be wise to use a 64bit OS, as e.g. Vista X64? I think, under
Vista
>> X64 it should be no problem to allocate 4 GB of RAM to R. Any
experiences
>> with that?
>>     
>
> That's what the rw-FAQ says, and we do write answers based on
experience!
>
>   
>> Thanks in advance,
>> Ralph Wirth
>>
>>
>> -----
>> Ralph Wirth
>> University Erlangen-Nuremberg, Chair of Statistics
>> GfK Group, Department of Methods and Product Development
>>
>>
>>     
>
>   

-- 
   O__  ---- Peter Dalgaard             ?ster Farimagsgade 5, Entr.B
  c/ /'_ --- Dept. of Biostatistics     PO Box 2099, 1014 Cph. K
 (*) \(*) -- University of Copenhagen   Denmark          Ph:  (+45) 35327918
~~~~~~~~~~ - (p.dalgaard at biostat.ku.dk)                  FAX: (+45) 35327907

Thank you very much for the explanation and clarification, Patrick. It is a
great help.
Best regards,
Jin


-----Original Message-----
From: Patrick Burns [mailto:pburns at pburns.seanet.com] 
Sent: Friday, 25 January 2008 9:48
To: Li Jin
Cc: p.dalgaard at biostat.ku.dk; r-help at r-project.org
Subject: Re: [R] Linux, UNIX, XP32, Vista X64 or ...? [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

Perhaps there are other opinions, but from my point
of view R is spectacularly similar in Linux and Windows
(and will be virtually identical in Linux and Unix).  As
long as you are doing "R" things, you should be in home
territory.

I regularly transfer R objects between 64-bit Linux and
Windows, and have never had any problems.

Patrick Burns
patrick at burns-stat.com
+44 (0)20 8525 0696
http://www.burns-stat.com
(home of S Poetry and "A Guide for the Unwilling S User")

Jin.Li at ga.gov.au wrote:
>Hi Peter,
>Thank you for the quick answer. 
>Given that we have UNIX system available here in Geoscience Australia, I am
>wondering if UNIX is also faster and with 64 bit build. Perhaps they may be
>kind enough to let me have a Linux system.
>As I only have experience in using Windows PC, what kind of challenges are
>there for using R in other systems like UNIX and Linux? 
>Thanks again,
>Jin
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Peter Dalgaard [mailto:p.dalgaard at biostat.ku.dk] 
>Sent: Thursday, 24 January 2008 10:23
>To: Li Jin
>Cc: r-help at r-project.org
>Subject: Re: [R] Linux, UNIX, XP32, Vista X64 or ...? [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
>
>Jin.Li at ga.gov.au wrote:
>  
>
>>Dear All,
>>I am currently using R in Windows PC with a 2 GB of RAM. Some pretty
large
>>datasets are expected soon, perhaps in an order of several GB. I am
facing
>>    
>>
>a
>  
>
>>similar situation like Ralph, either to get a new PC with a bigger RAM
or
>>else. I am just wondering if R is getting faster in other systems like
UNIX
>>or Linux. Any suggestions are appreciated.
>>Regards,
>>Jin
>>  
>>    
>>
>It has always been faster in Linux than in Windows on the same hardware. 
>In addition, the toolchain issues have been holding up 64 bit 
>development  on 64 bit Windows, whereas  64 bit build has been working 
>on Linux for years.
>
>  
>
>>--------------------------------------------
>>Jin Li, PhD
>>Spatial Modeller/
>>Computational Statistician
>>Marine & Coastal Environment
>>Geoscience Australia
>>Ph: 61 (02) 6249 9899
>>Fax: 61 (02) 6249 9956
>>email: jin.li at ga.gov.au
>>--------------------------------------------
>>
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: r-help-bounces at r-project.org [mailto:r-help-bounces at
r-project.org] On
>>Behalf Of Prof Brian Ripley
>>Sent: Thursday, 24 January 2008 12:05
>>To: Ralph79
>>Cc: r-help at r-project.org
>>Subject: Re: [R] Problems with XP32-"3GB-patch"?/ Worth
upgrading to Vista
>>X64?
>>
>>On Wed, 23 Jan 2008, Ralph79 wrote:
>>
>>  
>>    
>>
>>>Dear R-Users,
>>>
>>>as I will start a huge simulation in a few weeks, I am about to buy
a new
>>>and fast PC. I have noticed, that the RAM has been the limiting
factor in
>>>many of my calculations up to now (I had 2 GB in my "old"
system, but
>>>Windows still used quite a lot of virtual memory), hence my new
computer
>>>will have 4 GB of fast DDR2-800 RAM.
>>>
>>>However, I know that 1.) Windows 32 bit cannot make use of more than
about
>>>3,2 GB RAM and 2.) it is normally not allowed to allocate more than
2 GB
>>>      
>>>
>of
>  
>
>>>RAM to one single application (at least under XP, I don't know
if that has
>>>changed under Vista?).
>>>
>>>I remember from the R-FAQ that you can manually adjust XP so that it
>>>allocates up to 3 GB to one application ("the 3GB patch"),
but I read in a
>>>PC-magazine and some message boards that this may cause problems.
Does
>>>anybody of you successfully use this "trick" without any
problems?
>>>    
>>>      
>>>
>>Yes, many people: most 32-bit Exchange servers use it.  Please don't
rate
>>the advice in the R documentation below tittle-tattle you read on the
web.
>>
>>  
>>    
>>
>>>Would it be wise to use a 64bit OS, as e.g. Vista X64? I think,
under
>>>      
>>>
>Vista
>  
>
>>>X64 it should be no problem to allocate 4 GB of RAM to R. Any
experiences
>>>with that?
>>>    
>>>      
>>>
>>That's what the rw-FAQ says, and we do write answers based on
experience!
>>
>>  
>>    
>>
>>>Thanks in advance,
>>>Ralph Wirth
>>>
>>>
>>>-----
>>>Ralph Wirth
>>>University Erlangen-Nuremberg, Chair of Statistics
>>>GfK Group, Department of Methods and Product Development
>>>
>>>
>>>    
>>>      
>>>
>>  
>>    
>>
>
>
>  
>

On the PC there is a builtin GUI but not on UNIX and there are
some packages that are OS specific in which case you might
get more or less selection but probably more.  Also depending
on the specific system you may have greater difficulty installing
certain packages due to the need to compile them on UNIX
and the possibility exists that you don't quite have the right
libraries.  On Windows you get binaries so this is not a problem.
I have repeatedly found that common packages that I took
for granted on Windows had some problem with installation
on UNIX and I had to hunt around and figure out what the problem
was with my UNIDX libraries or possibly some other problem.
For all R packages this won't be a problem but for packages
that use C and FORTRAN this can be.  Although I am lumping
all UNIX systems together I think this varies quite a bit from
one particular type/distro of UNIX/Linux to another and I suspect if you
are careful in picking out the right one (if you have a choice) you
will actually have zero problems.

On Jan 23, 2008 6:08 PM,  <Jin.Li at ga.gov.au>
wrote:
> Dear All,
> I am currently using R in Windows PC with a 2 GB of RAM. Some pretty large
> datasets are expected soon, perhaps in an order of several GB. I am facing
a
> similar situation like Ralph, either to get a new PC with a bigger RAM or
> else. I am just wondering if R is getting faster in other systems like UNIX
> or Linux. Any suggestions are appreciated.
> Regards,
> Jin
> --------------------------------------------
> Jin Li, PhD
> Spatial Modeller/
> Computational Statistician
> Marine & Coastal Environment
> Geoscience Australia
> Ph: 61 (02) 6249 9899
> Fax: 61 (02) 6249 9956
> email: jin.li at ga.gov.au
> --------------------------------------------
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: r-help-bounces at r-project.org [mailto:r-help-bounces at
r-project.org] On
> Behalf Of Prof Brian Ripley
> Sent: Thursday, 24 January 2008 12:05
> To: Ralph79
> Cc: r-help at r-project.org
> Subject: Re: [R] Problems with XP32-"3GB-patch"?/ Worth upgrading
to Vista
> X64?
>
> On Wed, 23 Jan 2008, Ralph79 wrote:
>
> >
> > Dear R-Users,
> >
> > as I will start a huge simulation in a few weeks, I am about to buy a
new
> > and fast PC. I have noticed, that the RAM has been the limiting factor
in
> > many of my calculations up to now (I had 2 GB in my "old"
system, but
> > Windows still used quite a lot of virtual memory), hence my new
computer
> > will have 4 GB of fast DDR2-800 RAM.
> >
> > However, I know that 1.) Windows 32 bit cannot make use of more than
about
> > 3,2 GB RAM and 2.) it is normally not allowed to allocate more than 2
GB of
> > RAM to one single application (at least under XP, I don't know if
that has
> > changed under Vista?).
> >
> > I remember from the R-FAQ that you can manually adjust XP so that it
> > allocates up to 3 GB to one application ("the 3GB patch"),
but I read in a
> > PC-magazine and some message boards that this may cause problems. Does
> > anybody of you successfully use this "trick" without any
problems?
>
> Yes, many people: most 32-bit Exchange servers use it.  Please don't
rate
> the advice in the R documentation below tittle-tattle you read on the web.
>
> > Would it be wise to use a 64bit OS, as e.g. Vista X64? I think, under
Vista
> > X64 it should be no problem to allocate 4 GB of RAM to R. Any
experiences
> > with that?
>
> That's what the rw-FAQ says, and we do write answers based on
experience!
>
> > Thanks in advance,
> > Ralph Wirth
> >
> >
> > -----
> > Ralph Wirth
> > University Erlangen-Nuremberg, Chair of Statistics
> > GfK Group, Department of Methods and Product Development
> >
> >
>
> --
> Brian D. Ripley,                  ripley at stats.ox.ac.uk
> Professor of Applied Statistics,  http://www.stats.ox.ac.uk/~ripley/
> University of Oxford,             Tel:  +44 1865 272861 (self)
> 1 South Parks Road,                     +44 1865 272866 (PA)
> Oxford OX1 3TG, UK                Fax:  +44 1865 272595
>
> ______________________________________________
> R-help at r-project.org mailing list
> https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help
> PLEASE do read the posting guide
http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html
> and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.
>
> ______________________________________________
> R-help at r-project.org mailing list
> https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help
> PLEASE do read the posting guide
http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html
> and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.
>

Thanks to all for your kind suggestions.

After some discussion with our IT staff, I was told the UNIX system we have
is Solaris and installation of R is very time consuming because "Given that
this software is not standard, and given the amount of time required to
compile the software (and potentially it's dependencies), it will need to be
resourced as a project ..." From my experience with IT staff, it may take
quite a long time for them to set up such project, let alone the
installation.

Given that, I wonder if it is possible to install it myself. As I have
mentioned before, I have no experience in using UNIX, but I will have an
access to the UNIX system soon. Any suggestions and help are greatly
appreciated.

Regards,
Jin

-----Original Message-----
From: Gabor Grothendieck [mailto:ggrothendieck at gmail.com] 
Sent: Monday, 28 January 2008 11:38
To: Li Jin
Cc: r-help at r-project.org
Subject: Re: [R] Linux, UNIX, XP32, Vista X64 or ...? [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

On the PC there is a builtin GUI but not on UNIX and there are
some packages that are OS specific in which case you might
get more or less selection but probably more.  Also depending
on the specific system you may have greater difficulty installing
certain packages due to the need to compile them on UNIX
and the possibility exists that you don't quite have the right
libraries.  On Windows you get binaries so this is not a problem.
I have repeatedly found that common packages that I took
for granted on Windows had some problem with installation
on UNIX and I had to hunt around and figure out what the problem
was with my UNIDX libraries or possibly some other problem.
For all R packages this won't be a problem but for packages
that use C and FORTRAN this can be.  Although I am lumping
all UNIX systems together I think this varies quite a bit from
one particular type/distro of UNIX/Linux to another and I suspect if you
are careful in picking out the right one (if you have a choice) you
will actually have zero problems.

On Jan 23, 2008 6:08 PM,  <Jin.Li at ga.gov.au>
wrote:
> Dear All,
> I am currently using R in Windows PC with a 2 GB of RAM. Some pretty large
> datasets are expected soon, perhaps in an order of several GB. I am facing
a
> similar situation like Ralph, either to get a new PC with a bigger RAM or
> else. I am just wondering if R is getting faster in other systems like UNIX
> or Linux. Any suggestions are appreciated.
> Regards,
> Jin
> --------------------------------------------
> Jin Li, PhD
> Spatial Modeller/
> Computational Statistician
> Marine & Coastal Environment
> Geoscience Australia
> Ph: 61 (02) 6249 9899
> Fax: 61 (02) 6249 9956
> email: jin.li at ga.gov.au
> --------------------------------------------
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: r-help-bounces at r-project.org [mailto:r-help-bounces at
r-project.org] On
> Behalf Of Prof Brian Ripley
> Sent: Thursday, 24 January 2008 12:05
> To: Ralph79
> Cc: r-help at r-project.org
> Subject: Re: [R] Problems with XP32-"3GB-patch"?/ Worth upgrading
to Vista
> X64?
>
> On Wed, 23 Jan 2008, Ralph79 wrote:
>
> >
> > Dear R-Users,
> >
> > as I will start a huge simulation in a few weeks, I am about to buy a
new
> > and fast PC. I have noticed, that the RAM has been the limiting factor
in
> > many of my calculations up to now (I had 2 GB in my "old"
system, but
> > Windows still used quite a lot of virtual memory), hence my new
computer
> > will have 4 GB of fast DDR2-800 RAM.
> >
> > However, I know that 1.) Windows 32 bit cannot make use of more than
about
> > 3,2 GB RAM and 2.) it is normally not allowed to allocate more than 2
GB
of
> > RAM to one single application (at least under XP, I don't know if
that
has
> > changed under Vista?).
> >
> > I remember from the R-FAQ that you can manually adjust XP so that it
> > allocates up to 3 GB to one application ("the 3GB patch"),
but I read in
a
> > PC-magazine and some message boards that this may cause problems. Does
> > anybody of you successfully use this "trick" without any
problems?
>
> Yes, many people: most 32-bit Exchange servers use it.  Please don't
rate
> the advice in the R documentation below tittle-tattle you read on the web.
>
> > Would it be wise to use a 64bit OS, as e.g. Vista X64? I think, under
Vista
> > X64 it should be no problem to allocate 4 GB of RAM to R. Any
experiences
> > with that?
>
> That's what the rw-FAQ says, and we do write answers based on
experience!
>
> > Thanks in advance,
> > Ralph Wirth
> >
> >
> > -----
> > Ralph Wirth
> > University Erlangen-Nuremberg, Chair of Statistics
> > GfK Group, Department of Methods and Product Development
> >
> >
>
> --
> Brian D. Ripley,                  ripley at stats.ox.ac.uk
> Professor of Applied Statistics,  http://www.stats.ox.ac.uk/~ripley/
> University of Oxford,             Tel:  +44 1865 272861 (self)
> 1 South Parks Road,                     +44 1865 272866 (PA)
> Oxford OX1 3TG, UK                Fax:  +44 1865 272595
>
> ______________________________________________
> R-help at r-project.org mailing list
> https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help
> PLEASE do read the posting guide
http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html
> and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.
>
> ______________________________________________
> R-help at r-project.org mailing list
> https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help
> PLEASE do read the posting guide
http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html
> and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.
>