I''ve been using xen at work for several months and pretty happy with it. I''m currently running several machines at home and I''m thinking about picking up some new hardware and consolidating them. The machines I have are: myth backend on FC9 myth frontend on MythDora (FC8) mail/dns/dhcp/web server on FC5 (I know, old...) multi-purpose/storage machine (FC9) Windows XP machine - some windows utils, Nero burning, etc Some of these would need direct access to PCI cards. mythtv needs access to three tuner cards. Not sure I would try the myth frontend machine. Could I have a domU have direct access to a specific video card? (nvidia fx5200) Windows XP would need direct access to DVD-RW drives. Or at least be able to use them as writers. Possible? Of course I have to get the "boss" to approve, but I''m thinking about this hardware: Motherboard: http://www.ecost.com/Detail/MOTHERNOARDS/GIGA-BYTE/GA-P35-S3G/40399167.aspx Processor: http://www.ecost.com/Detail/Processors/Intel/BX80562Q6600/34990428.aspx Then I would add a couple SATA hard drives and 4 gig of RAM (2x2048), allowing for an additional 4 gig later. Am I nuts or could this work? Thanks, James _______________________________________________ Xen-users mailing list Xen-users@lists.xensource.com http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users
On Sat, 2008-07-12 at 20:40 -0400, James Pifer wrote:> I''ve been using xen at work for several months and pretty happy with it. > I''m currently running several machines at home and I''m thinking about > picking up some new hardware and consolidating them. > > The machines I have are: > myth backend on FC9 > myth frontend on MythDora (FC8) > mail/dns/dhcp/web server on FC5 (I know, old...) > multi-purpose/storage machine (FC9) > Windows XP machine - some windows utils, Nero burning, etc > > Some of these would need direct access to PCI cards. mythtv needs access > to three tuner cards. > > Not sure I would try the myth frontend machine. Could I have a domU have > direct access to a specific video card? (nvidia fx5200) > > Windows XP would need direct access to DVD-RW drives. Or at least be > able to use them as writers. Possible? > > Of course I have to get the "boss" to approve, but I''m thinking about > this hardware: > > Motherboard: > http://www.ecost.com/Detail/MOTHERNOARDS/GIGA-BYTE/GA-P35-S3G/40399167.aspx > > Processor: > http://www.ecost.com/Detail/Processors/Intel/BX80562Q6600/34990428.aspx > > Then I would add a couple SATA hard drives and 4 gig of RAM (2x2048), > allowing for an additional 4 gig later. > > Am I nuts or could this work? >Oh yeah, couple things I forgot. What about sound and USB devices from domU''s? Not something I even think about in my work environment. Thanks, James _______________________________________________ Xen-users mailing list Xen-users@lists.xensource.com http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users
On Sat, Jul 12, 2008 at 8:51 PM, James Pifer <jep@obrien-pifer.com> wrote:> On Sat, 2008-07-12 at 20:40 -0400, James Pifer wrote: > > I''ve been using xen at work for several months and pretty happy with it. > > I''m currently running several machines at home and I''m thinking about > > picking up some new hardware and consolidating them. > > > > The machines I have are: > > myth backend on FC9 >I dont think it is possible to have s FC9 domU at this point. From what I''ve read, it is in transition and pciback is not working. I have tried an FC8 domU but I couldn''t get pciback working there as well. I have an Ubuntu 8.04 domU running mythbackend and that seems to be working fine except for ivtv DMA timeouts here and there in dmesg. I am not sure that the DMA timeouts are a xen issue though. I am hoping that someone will come up with an error free mythbackend domU setup using pvr 250s and pvr 500s one day and post how they did it. Also, you will need to play with swiotlb a bit to get everything working. Increasing swiotlb memory allowed me to increase mpeg buffer memory as well to prevent dropped frames from "Not reading fast enough" errors.> > > myth frontend on MythDora (FC8) >You can run a mythfrontend in dom0. The newest nvidia drivers will compile in a xen kernel if you specify a particular environment variable. Go a bit further and load up on nvidia specific driver options in xorg.conf to reduce xorg cpu usage to near zero. I just figured this out the other night. If you need the info, I can post it here. I managed to reduce xorg cpu utilization to <10 %. I tried to setup a mythfrontend domU but couldn''t get it to work. I have a geforce card as well and you will get as far as compiling and loading the nvidia kernel module but as soon as you start mythfrontend, the screen flickers and you get a memory error. I think others have tried as well and encountered the same roadblock.> > > mail/dns/dhcp/web server on FC5 (I know, old...) >Will work fine in domUs. I haven''t tried an internet accessible webserver yet. I use centos 5.1 for dns/dhcp and ubuntu for qmail. All of my domUs have their own webservers. Also try a separate mysql server just for fun.> > > multi-purpose/storage machine (FC9) >I have pcibacked a combo SATA/PATA pci express card and exported it via nfs. This is running in the mythbackend domU. In my case, it was necessary as the jmicron card will not run in dom0 (dmesg reports it as disabled) possibly because It conflicts with my onboard SATA/IDE controller.> > > Windows XP machine - some windows utils, Nero burning, etc >I believe you need VT enabled hardware for this.> > > > > Some of these would need direct access to PCI cards. mythtv needs access > > to three tuner cards. > > > > Not sure I would try the myth frontend machine. Could I have a domU have > > direct access to a specific video card? (nvidia fx5200) > > > > Windows XP would need direct access to DVD-RW drives. Or at least be > > able to use them as writers. Possible? > > > > Of course I have to get the "boss" to approve, but I''m thinking about > > this hardware: > > > > Motherboard: > > > http://www.ecost.com/Detail/MOTHERNOARDS/GIGA-BYTE/GA-P35-S3G/40399167.aspx > > > > Processor: > > http://www.ecost.com/Detail/Processors/Intel/BX80562Q6600/34990428.aspx > > > > Then I would add a couple SATA hard drives and 4 gig of RAM (2x2048), > > allowing for an additional 4 gig later. > > > > Am I nuts or could this work? > > > > Oh yeah, couple things I forgot. What about sound and USB devices from > domU''s? Not something I even think about in my work environment.This can be done as well. I have pcibacked usb devices (/sbin/lspci devices) for use in domUs. So far I have managed to get usb printers working, an X10 usb automation device, a bluetooth usb device. I''ve also used a usb to parallel port and usb to serial port device in a domU. Only the usb printers needed a bit of tweakage and I could only get it to work in a Centos domU. You will have to have the source kernel installed and edit usblp.c to reduce memory from 8192 to 4096, recompile usblp and use that to replace the current module. The information is on a list somewhere. Also , it seems that late pciback binding is not possible for usb devices. Therefore, you will have to create a initrd which preloads pciback. Good Luck. Please post your successful configuration. I would love to hear from other mythtv xen users. I dont think there are very many of us out there. Chris _______________________________________________ Xen-users mailing list Xen-users@lists.xensource.com http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users
Just wanted to pipe in and say that the burning aspect is easily achieved. Block device exports may not allow it, but a iscsi setup will (try rocketdivision iscsi for windows for good support of remote dvd-rw/ram). However, I don''t think anybody has managed a usefull domu+pciback+x setup, some have come close (myself included), but nothing really useable. _____ From: xen-users-bounces@lists.xensource.com [mailto:xen-users-bounces@lists.xensource.com] On Behalf Of Christopher Isip Sent: July 12, 2008 11:13 PM To: James Pifer Cc: Xen List Subject: Re: [Xen-users] Consolidating machines using xen On Sat, Jul 12, 2008 at 8:51 PM, James Pifer <jep@obrien-pifer.com> wrote: On Sat, 2008-07-12 at 20:40 -0400, James Pifer wrote:> I''ve been using xen at work for several months and pretty happy with it. > I''m currently running several machines at home and I''m thinking about > picking up some new hardware and consolidating them. > > The machines I have are: > myth backend on FC9I dont think it is possible to have s FC9 domU at this point. From what I''ve read, it is in transition and pciback is not working. I have tried an FC8 domU but I couldn''t get pciback working there as well. I have an Ubuntu 8.04 domU running mythbackend and that seems to be working fine except for ivtv DMA timeouts here and there in dmesg. I am not sure that the DMA timeouts are a xen issue though. I am hoping that someone will come up with an error free mythbackend domU setup using pvr 250s and pvr 500s one day and post how they did it. Also, you will need to play with swiotlb a bit to get everything working. Increasing swiotlb memory allowed me to increase mpeg buffer memory as well to prevent dropped frames from "Not reading fast enough" errors.> myth frontend on MythDora (FC8)You can run a mythfrontend in dom0. The newest nvidia drivers will compile in a xen kernel if you specify a particular environment variable. Go a bit further and load up on nvidia specific driver options in xorg.conf to reduce xorg cpu usage to near zero. I just figured this out the other night. If you need the info, I can post it here. I managed to reduce xorg cpu utilization to <10 %. I tried to setup a mythfrontend domU but couldn''t get it to work. I have a geforce card as well and you will get as far as compiling and loading the nvidia kernel module but as soon as you start mythfrontend, the screen flickers and you get a memory error. I think others have tried as well and encountered the same roadblock.> mail/dns/dhcp/web server on FC5 (I know, old...)Will work fine in domUs. I haven''t tried an internet accessible webserver yet. I use centos 5.1 for dns/dhcp and ubuntu for qmail. All of my domUs have their own webservers. Also try a separate mysql server just for fun.> multi-purpose/storage machine (FC9)I have pcibacked a combo SATA/PATA pci express card and exported it via nfs. This is running in the mythbackend domU. In my case, it was necessary as the jmicron card will not run in dom0 (dmesg reports it as disabled) possibly because It conflicts with my onboard SATA/IDE controller.> Windows XP machine - some windows utils, Nero burning, etcI believe you need VT enabled hardware for this.> > Some of these would need direct access to PCI cards. mythtv needs access > to three tuner cards. > > Not sure I would try the myth frontend machine. Could I have a domU have > direct access to a specific video card? (nvidia fx5200) > > Windows XP would need direct access to DVD-RW drives. Or at least be > able to use them as writers. Possible? > > Of course I have to get the "boss" to approve, but I''m thinking about > this hardware: > > Motherboard: >http://www.ecost.com/Detail/MOTHERNOARDS/GIGA-BYTE/GA-P35-S3G/40399167.aspx> > Processor: > http://www.ecost.com/Detail/Processors/Intel/BX80562Q6600/34990428.aspx > > Then I would add a couple SATA hard drives and 4 gig of RAM (2x2048), > allowing for an additional 4 gig later. > > Am I nuts or could this work? >Oh yeah, couple things I forgot. What about sound and USB devices from domU''s? Not something I even think about in my work environment. This can be done as well. I have pcibacked usb devices (/sbin/lspci devices) for use in domUs. So far I have managed to get usb printers working, an X10 usb automation device, a bluetooth usb device. I''ve also used a usb to parallel port and usb to serial port device in a domU. Only the usb printers needed a bit of tweakage and I could only get it to work in a Centos domU. You will have to have the source kernel installed and edit usblp.c to reduce memory from 8192 to 4096, recompile usblp and use that to replace the current module. The information is on a list somewhere. Also , it seems that late pciback binding is not possible for usb devices. Therefore, you will have to create a initrd which preloads pciback. Good Luck. Please post your successful configuration. I would love to hear from other mythtv xen users. I dont think there are very many of us out there. Chris _______________________________________________ Xen-users mailing list Xen-users@lists.xensource.com http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users
[resend to list] On 13/07/2008 05:12, Christopher Isip wrote:> I dont think it is possible to have s FC9 domU at this point. From what > I''ve read, it is in transition and pciback is not working.You can have an F9 domU, but as you point out it can''t do pci passthrough, you can''t have an F9 dom0 at at all A CentOS 5.2 domU with the centosplus kernel will have the V4L drivers that a mythbackend will require> I have an > Ubuntu 8.04 domU running mythbackend and that seems to be working fine > except for ivtv DMA timeouts here and there in dmesg. I am not sure > that the DMA timeouts are a xen issue though.Sounds a familiar tale, I had to build a centosplus kernel with my the saa7134 module enabled, and fix an mmio bug, but unfortunately I have a DMA related kernel panic, it used to strike within minutes on FC8 dom0 + xen3.1, now it will last about 24 hours on Centos5.2 dom0 + xen 3.2 I keep looking through the xen/v4l code for clues, but not got past sprinkling in a few prinkt()s so far.> I am hoping that someone > will come up with an error free mythbackend domU setup using pvr 250s > and pvr 500s one day and post how they did it. Also, you will need to > play with swiotlb a bit to get everything working. Increasing swiotlb > memory allowed me to increase mpeg buffer memory as well to prevent > dropped frames from "Not reading fast enough" errors.Actually now I don''t need to use swiotlb or dom0_mem settings at all, and when mine works, it works well, i.e. 3 concurrent recording per tuner, no problems with dropping data at all, if I choose programs on the same mux it''ll record for 24h at a stretch, the DMA issue seems to occur when the mythbackend is tuning to a different mux, and every now and then this changes to a different set of buffers which xen isn''t happy to do DMA with.> hear from other mythtv xen users. I dont think there are very many of > us out there.mythusers[xen]++; _______________________________________________ Xen-users mailing list Xen-users@lists.xensource.com http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users
I actually not stuck on the versions of linux these machines are currently running. I''m ok with fedora core, CentOS, opensuse, or SLES. Any machine I bring up as dom''s will be new installs. As far as VT capable (for windows), the hardware I''m looking at is VT, except I have to make the sure the motherboard allows it. I have an HP slim desktop under my desk with a VT capable processor, but for some reason HP chose not to make it an option. Either just making the bios not support it, or the mother board itself doesn''t support it. Doing some search on the subject it sounds like HP chose not to make it available. Would be great to be able to use a machine I already have to try some of this out! Thanks for all the input. I don''t think I''m anywhere close to being able to try it, but I''d really like to. James _______________________________________________ Xen-users mailing list Xen-users@lists.xensource.com http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users
On Sunday 13 July 2008, James Pifer wrote:> I''ve been using xen at work for several months and pretty happy with it. > I''m currently running several machines at home and I''m thinking about > picking up some new hardware and consolidating them. > > The machines I have are: > myth backend on FC9 > myth frontend on MythDora (FC8) > mail/dns/dhcp/web server on FC5 (I know, old...) > multi-purpose/storage machine (FC9) > Windows XP machine - some windows utils, Nero burning, etc > > Some of these would need direct access to PCI cards. mythtv needs access > to three tuner cards.Well, that''s generally doable under Xen as long as the PCI cards don''t show any driver bugs when they''re used in a VM!> Not sure I would try the myth frontend machine. Could I have a domU have > direct access to a specific video card? (nvidia fx5200)Not easily, no.> Windows XP would need direct access to DVD-RW drives. Or at least be > able to use them as writers. Possible?Not easily, no. VirtualBox can do that, I think, although I don''t know how solidly / generally it works (never tried it). Not straightforward to do under Xen.> Of course I have to get the "boss" to approve, but I''m thinking about > this hardware: > > Motherboard: > http://www.ecost.com/Detail/MOTHERNOARDS/GIGA-BYTE/GA-P35-S3G/40399167.aspx > > Processor: > http://www.ecost.com/Detail/Processors/Intel/BX80562Q6600/34990428.aspx > > Then I would add a couple SATA hard drives and 4 gig of RAM (2x2048), > allowing for an additional 4 gig later. > > Am I nuts or could this work?Yes, could work. Rather depends on what you''re doing though / what you''re trying to achieve. Things to look out for: If your myth backend is encoding 3 streams from TV tuners, it''s surely going to be fairly CPU hungry? You''ll need to bear in mind that it needs *enough* CPU sufficiently *often* to encode without drop-outs. This may affect the number of virtual machines that can share the box with it successfully, or at least it should inform the scheduler setup you do. Giving graphics cards to domains other than dom0 is currently a bit hairy still. The situation is improving (and hardware advances are helping) but I wouldn''t suggest you necessarily do it unless you''re willing to spend some extra time hacking at trying to make it work! If you were using VT-d capable hardware you could, in theory, pass the primary graphics card to a HVM domU - possibly depending on the make of the graphics card (some have had issues working in this way). Interacting with Windows over the SDL or VNC viewers is not especially snappy, so you may want to consider trying out the Open Source rdesktop tool... For the storage machine - although this should work well under Xen (and you could either use a generic Linux distro or install something like OpenFiler or Zumastor on there to make it behave more like a "real" filer) - another option would be to get a special purpose box like an NSLU2 (just an idea). Good luck anyhow, hope you have fun whatever you do. Cheers, Mark -- Push Me Pull You - Distributed SCM tool (http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~maw48/pmpu/) _______________________________________________ Xen-users mailing list Xen-users@lists.xensource.com http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users
On Sunday 13 July 2008, Christopher Isip wrote: <snip>> > Oh yeah, couple things I forgot. What about sound and USB devices from > > domU''s? Not something I even think about in my work environment. > > This can be done as well. I have pcibacked usb devices (/sbin/lspci > devices) for use in domUs. So far I have managed to get usb printers > working, an X10 usb automation device, a bluetooth usb device. I''ve also > used a usb to parallel port and usb to serial port device in a domU. Only > the usb printers needed a bit of tweakage and I could only get it to work > in a Centos domU. You will have to have the source kernel installed and > edit usblp.c to reduce memory from 8192 to 4096, recompile usblp and use > that to replace the current module. The information is on a list > somewhere. Also , it seems that late pciback binding is not possible for > usb devices. Therefore, you will have to create a initrd which preloads > pciback.I think some people have made the virtual soundcard emulation work - sound comes out of the ioemu process in dom0. It''s SB16 emulation, I think. USB passthrough of individual dom0 devices to a domU should be possible in theory, however I''ve heard varying reports of how well this works so YMMV. The approach of PCI-passthrough-ing a USB controller mentioned above works fine, though. Cheers, Mark -- Push Me Pull You - Distributed SCM tool (http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~maw48/pmpu/) _______________________________________________ Xen-users mailing list Xen-users@lists.xensource.com http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users