Xen users - Jun 2008 - xm shutdown of HVM DomU kills it instantly

Recently installed a box using Ubuntu 8.04 for the Dom0.

Problem I have is when I do a "xm shutdown" of a HVM DomU where it
powers
off instantly.
The DomU is a Trixbox installation running CentOS.

Anyone experienced similar issues or have a clue of where to start
troubleshooting. Can it be related to xend or something with the DomU, maybe
ACPI?

My need to run HVM is not that strong, so I have only tried with this one so
far. But I guess for troubleshooting I should have a go and install another
one.

Any suggestions are more than welcome.


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>Problem I have is when I do a "xm shutdown" of a HVM DomU where it
powers off instantly.
You would need some alterative method of allowing Dom0  to communicate with the
HVM.
Only PV guests can gracefully receive that signal and execute it.

jlc

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So you are saying this is not working by default?
That would be a surprise. I have seen this referenced from many people using
HVMs so I assumed it to work out of the box.

//Daniel

On Mon, Jun 2, 2008 at 1:39 AM, Joseph L. Casale
<JCasale@activenetwerx.com>
wrote:
> >Problem I have is when I do a "xm shutdown" of a HVM DomU
where it powers
> off instantly.
>
> You would need some alterative method of allowing Dom0  to communicate with
> the HVM.
> Only PV guests can gracefully receive that signal and execute it.
>
> jlc
>
>

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>So you are saying this is not working by default?
>That would be a surprise. I have seen this referenced from many people using
HVMs so I assumed it to work out of the box.
Yup, it doesn''t work. I have never seen a reference to it suggesting
otherwise?
jlc

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Earlier I was running Debian as Dom0 and I believed it was working then. But
as I don''t care a lot about running HVMs, I did it more as a test, I
didn''t
document it, so I''m not 100% sure. But I thought I would have noticed
if the
VM disappeared instantly after executing "xm shutdown".

I have seen references when people use xm shutdown with HVM DomUs and they
claim it works properly. Will try to confirm this with some of them.

//Daniel

On Mon, Jun 2, 2008 at 9:12 AM, Joseph L. Casale
<JCasale@activenetwerx.com>
wrote:
> >So you are saying this is not working by default?
> >That would be a surprise. I have seen this referenced from many people
> using HVMs so I assumed it to work out of the box.
>
> Yup, it doesn''t work. I have never seen a reference to it
suggesting
> otherwise?
> jlc
>

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I know nothing about Xen HVM, but I practiced VMWare.
It is the same behaviour with VMWare VMs (a shutdown kills the VM
immediatly) unless you install the "WMWare tools" on the guest. I
think it
should be the same in xen : a HVM host cannot communicate with its dom0 (so
it cannot be shut down cleanly) as it is not aware it is virtual, unless you
install on it something special to let it know it is virtual.

So IMHO the question should be: does it exist with xen HVM something similar
to the VMWare "VMWare tools" ?

Thanks for answers.

Alain.

2008/6/2 Daniel Asplund <danielsaori@gmail.com>:
> Earlier I was running Debian as Dom0 and I believed it was working then.
> But as I don''t care a lot about running HVMs, I did it more as a
test, I
> didn''t document it, so I''m not 100% sure. But I thought I
would have noticed
> if the VM disappeared instantly after executing "xm shutdown".
>
> I have seen references when people use xm shutdown with HVM DomUs and they
> claim it works properly. Will try to confirm this with some of them.
>
> //Daniel
>
>
> On Mon, Jun 2, 2008 at 9:12 AM, Joseph L. Casale <
> JCasale@activenetwerx.com> wrote:
>
>> >So you are saying this is not working by default?
>> >That would be a surprise. I have seen this referenced from many
people
>> using HVMs so I assumed it to work out of the box.
>>
>> Yup, it doesn''t work. I have never seen a reference to it
suggesting
>> otherwise?
>> jlc
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Xen-users mailing list
> Xen-users@lists.xensource.com
> http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users
>

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On Mon, Jun 02, 2008 at 09:59:15AM +0200, Daniel Asplund wrote:
> I have seen references when people use xm shutdown with HVM DomUs and they
> claim it works properly. Will try to confirm this with some of them.
They probably have the PV drivers installed for their domU.

It''s not clear why Xen doesn''t just simulate a power-button
press like
other v12n solutions.

regards
john

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Thanks for your answers.
I can see the logic and it makes sense.

Just sent a few mails to people to confirm how they use xm shutdown together
with HVM.



On Mon, Jun 2, 2008 at 2:25 PM, John Levon <levon@movementarian.org>
wrote:
> On Mon, Jun 02, 2008 at 09:59:15AM +0200, Daniel Asplund wrote:
>
> > I have seen references when people use xm shutdown with HVM DomUs and
> they
> > claim it works properly. Will try to confirm this with some of them.
>
> They probably have the PV drivers installed for their domU.
>
> It''s not clear why Xen doesn''t just simulate a
power-button press like
> other v12n solutions.
>
> regards
> john
>

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On June 2, 2008 01:58 am Alain Barthe wrote:
> I know nothing about Xen HVM, but I practiced VMWare.
> It is the same behaviour with VMWare VMs (a shutdown kills the VM
> immediatly) unless you install the "WMWare tools" on the guest. I
think
> it should be the same in xen : a HVM host cannot communicate with its
> dom0 (so it cannot be shut down cleanly) as it is not aware it is
> virtual, unless you install on it something special to let it know it
> is virtual.
xend doesn''t send the ACPI Shutdown (which would simulate a "power
button
push" event in the ACPI-aware OS) command to the QEmu monitor for the 
HVM?  Not sure what the exact qemu command is (can never seem to get 
the ''help'' command in the qemu monitor to show just one page
of help
topics).

Using KVM (which uses the same or similar qemu support) you can issue a 
shutdown command in the qemu monitor, or via the host, and it will show 
as an acpi shutdown request in the guest OS, and it will (if ACPI support 
works in the guest) do a graceful shutdown.

-- 
Freddie Cash
fjwcash@gmail.com

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virsh shutdown <domain id> does graceful shutdown. The problem is that
xend
remembers the domain id. I want to be able to use the same domain id for the
same virtual machine. I tried to flush the domain id memory by doing a
"service xend restart" but it still would resort to incrementing the
domain
id number even though the previous domain id had been shutdown.

On Mon, Jun 2, 2008 at 11:39 AM, Freddie Cash <fjwcash@gmail.com> wrote:
> On June 2, 2008 01:58 am Alain Barthe wrote:
> > I know nothing about Xen HVM, but I practiced VMWare.
> > It is the same behaviour with VMWare VMs (a shutdown kills the VM
> > immediatly) unless you install the "WMWare tools" on the
guest. I think
> > it should be the same in xen : a HVM host cannot communicate with its
> > dom0 (so it cannot be shut down cleanly) as it is not aware it is
> > virtual, unless you install on it something special to let it know it
> > is virtual.
>
> xend doesn''t send the ACPI Shutdown (which would simulate a
"power button
> push" event in the ACPI-aware OS) command to the QEmu monitor for the
> HVM?  Not sure what the exact qemu command is (can never seem to get
> the ''help'' command in the qemu monitor to show just one
page of help
> topics).
>
> Using KVM (which uses the same or similar qemu support) you can issue a
> shutdown command in the qemu monitor, or via the host, and it will show
> as an acpi shutdown request in the guest OS, and it will (if ACPI support
> works in the guest) do a graceful shutdown.
>
> --
> Freddie Cash
> fjwcash@gmail.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> Xen-users mailing list
> Xen-users@lists.xensource.com
> http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users
>

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On June 2, 2008 08:53 am Henok Mikre wrote:
> virsh shutdown <domain id> does graceful shutdown. The problem is
that
> xend remembers the domain id. I want to be able to use the same domain
> id for the same virtual machine. I tried to flush the domain id memory
> by doing a "service xend restart" but it still would resort to
> incrementing the domain id number even though the previous domain id
> had been shutdown.
I don''t think that''s possible, as the domain ID is incremented
everytime a
VM is created, for the life of xend (or possibly the life of the 
hypervisor).  This was something that was really annoying, as there was 
no way (that we found while testing) to lock a VM to a particular domain 
ID.  That, along with the broken (not working) 
auto-set-vnc-port-to-domain-id in Xen 3.1+, made using the domain ID for 
anything quite useless.

The only time I ever saw the domain ID reset to 1 was when the server was 
rebooted.

-- 
Freddie Cash
fjwcash@gmail.com

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