Hi, Has anyone compared XEN against (vmware) GSX Server? My boss wants to use GSX server because he said that it''s more stable and has a good administration interface. I don''t want to use GSX server but I need a very good argument to convince him. Thanks, -- Lucas de Souza Santos - 7F8050A6 @ http://subkeys.pgp.net _______________________________________________ Xen-users mailing list Xen-users@lists.xensource.com http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users
diga pra ele que se o vmware der pau, voce vai ter que entrar em suporte com a vmware e o suporte deles, é pago. o vmware é mais lento que o xen. diga seu chefe que ele comprando um processador com suporte a virtualizacao (intel vt ou amd pacifica) ele poderá rodar tanto o linux quanto windows na mesma maquina utilizando-se o xen xen é free vmware é pago. _______________________________________________ Xen-users mailing list Xen-users@lists.xensource.com http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users
Yo, I''m a sometime Xen developer so you might want to take what I say with a pinch of salt - I''m biased! ;-)>Has anyone compared XEN against (vmware) GSX Server?Were you aware VMware are releasing a free (as in beer) GSX-based product? You still have to pay if you want support. Beta release here: http://www.vmware.com/products/server/ Quick bullet points of some of the most important pros and cons (there are others): Xen + Distro support is present, and is getting better over time. + Maturing; has been around for a few years now, and has a good number of big name contributors (IBM, Redhat, Novell, and others) + Very fast for running Xen-aware OSes + Live migration - Still not a great solution for running production Windows machines. - May have to patch your kernel (although various distros have Xen-aware kernels now) GSX + Mature product + Runs Windows well - Not so fast - You have to pay for it, but this''ll be fixed by VMware server>My boss wants to use GSX server because he said that it''s more stable >and has a good administration interface.There''s always XenOptimiser for administering a Xen box, plus there are other administration interfaces (both open and closed source) likely to be released in the future. How much the administration interface really matters does depend, to a certain extent, on how many systems your managing. If there''s just one then I imagine that the admin interface is less important.>I don''t want to use GSX server but I need a very good argument to >convince him.Hope that helps. Even if GSX suits you better right now, you should keep an eye on future Xen developments as its functionality develops further. Cheers, Mark _______________________________________________ Xen-users mailing list Xen-users@lists.xensource.com http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users
"comprar um processador com suporte a virtualizacao" ?!? Negativo... Até agora não tive problema algum com minhas VMs rodando em processadores simples... Não gastei sequer $1 cents com tecnologia especial, e tenho resultados muitos satisfatórios. Sds, -- Leonardo Pinto listas#openlogic dot com br On Thu, 16 Mar 2006 14:44:21 -0300, Itamar Reis Peixoto wrote> diga pra ele que se o vmware der pau, voce vai ter que entrar em > suporte com a vmware e o suporte deles, é pago. > > o vmware é mais lento que o xen. > > diga seu chefe que ele comprando um processador com suporte a > virtualizacao > (intel vt ou amd pacifica) ele poderá rodar tanto o linux quanto > windows na mesma maquina utilizando-se o xen > > xen é free > > vmware é pago._______________________________________________ Xen-users mailing list Xen-users@lists.xensource.com http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users
Lucas de Souza Santos wrote:> Hi, > > Has anyone compared XEN against (vmware) GSX Server? > > My boss wants to use GSX server because he said that it''s more stable > and has a good administration interface. > > I don''t want to use GSX server but I need a very good argument to > convince him.i''ve tryed both of them, and sorry yes Xen doesnt look stable for me ... my expirience with Xen 3 +performance improvemnt +handling dom0 Bridge and VMs -memory consuming task (Java,..) are crashing not only the unprivileged Dom my expirience with GSX 3 +VMs are portable between even different HostSystems (Win, Lin) +VMs dont crash HostSystem -performance not as gppd as im Xen -GuestSystem time sometimes steps much slower than real time (problem on timebased applications ...) there''s no killer Argument for Xen and non for GSX. Both do sometimes let you know that you dont have a real machine. If i should argument for one of them i would ask my boss if he wants someone to blame if something goes wrong and improvements by droping in cash, or maybe no real person to blame but improvments an more people to ask than VMWare can ever have. the Administration Interface is not a point your boss can hook on, cause you just need to deploy a webinterface which triggers your Xen commands and theres no need to deploy a Software Package like with VMWare. If he just doesnt want a commandline Interface he just needs some WebDesigner to wrap Pictures and many JavaScript and many .... around it ;) Greetz mIke> > Thanks, > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Xen-users mailing list > Xen-users@lists.xensource.com > http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users_______________________________________________ Xen-users mailing list Xen-users@lists.xensource.com http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users
>i''ve tryed both of them, and sorry yes Xen doesnt look stable for me ... >my expirience with Xen 3 > > +performance improvemnt > +handling dom0 Bridge and VMs > -memory consuming task (Java,..) are crashing not only the > unprivileged DomI vaguely remember this problem (or something like it) coming up on the mailing list... Memory hogs in domUs should not be able to effect Xen/dom0 in any way. If they can then that''s a fairly horrible bug... Were you able to file a bugzilla for it? Does it occur on 3.0.1 or in -unstable? Cheers, Mark>my expirience with GSX 3 > > +VMs are portable between even different HostSystems (Win, Lin) > +VMs dont crash HostSystem > -performance not as gppd as im Xen > -GuestSystem time sometimes steps much slower than real time > (problem on timebased applications ...) > >there''s no killer Argument for Xen and non for GSX. Both do sometimes >let you know that you dont have a real machine. > >If i should argument for one of them i would ask my boss if he wants >someone to blame if something goes wrong and improvements by droping in > cash, or maybe no real person to blame but improvments an more people >to ask than VMWare can ever have. > >the Administration Interface is not a point your boss can hook on, cause > you just need to deploy a webinterface which triggers your Xen >commands and theres no need to deploy a Software Package like with >VMWare. If he just doesnt want a commandline Interface he just needs >some WebDesigner to wrap Pictures and many JavaScript and many .... >around it ;) > >Greetz mIke > >> >> Thanks, >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Xen-users mailing list >> Xen-users@lists.xensource.com >> http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users > > >_______________________________________________ >Xen-users mailing list >Xen-users@lists.xensource.com >http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users >_______________________________________________ Xen-users mailing list Xen-users@lists.xensource.com http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users
On Thursday 16 March 2006 19:37, Michael Lang wrote:> Lucas de Souza Santos wrote: > > i''ve tryed both of them, and sorry yes Xen doesnt look stable for me ... > my expirience with Xen 3 > > +performance improvemnt > +handling dom0 Bridge and VMs > -memory consuming task (Java,..) are crashing not only the > unprivileged Dom > > my expirience with GSX 3 > > +VMs are portable between even different HostSystems (Win, Lin) > +VMs dont crash HostSystemI''m not sure how much difference there is between GSX and VMWare workstation, but it''s used at my work for testing purposes and I''ve had the host crash (full freeze, requiring hard reset) on occasion because of a problem in the Guest. This happens with only VMWare running. I have seen some problems with Xen, but the performance of a single CPU system running Xen with 9 domains (not counting Domain-0) feels alot better then on a dual CPU system with twice the memory running VMWare. The few problems I''m experiencing (LVM snapshots not being able to be removed) can be worked around while the developers manage to get this working. -- Joost _______________________________________________ Xen-users mailing list Xen-users@lists.xensource.com http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users
Well, as much as I would like to run XEN I have been unsuccessful. Apparently the problem I''m having is not all that uncommon as there is discussion of it in the archives, but no solutions so I have had to give up for now. I''m continuing to watch the lists for when XEN matures enough to be a production system. I tried the VMWare server beta and it worked perfectly first time and I have experienced no problems (I have not done much stress testing yet). The management interface is really neat as you can remotely attach to a machine running VMWare server and connect to any of the consoles of the virtual machine. You can even do things like attach to the floppy that''s on your workstation running the client and load the OS or any application remotely from there (I did this were I was loading the OS from the CD on my laptop at home to a VM on a machine in the datacenter!) My personal belief is that in the long run, XEN will be better/faster, but I also don''t think it''s there yet (though it may already be faster). My plan is to use VMWare and watch XEN closely and some time in the future dump VMWare in favor of XEN. I also believe that VMWare is making the new server free because of XEN and User mode Linux. I think they believe they can prove that their management tools are better and get people to upgrade to their premium GSX server to get some enhanced features. In the long run I believe that XEN will win that one. I really hope the XEN developers keep true enterprise management in mind AND document the "Control APIs" well so that others (maybe like me) can develop software to manage XEN based systems without having to pour through all the XEN source to see how things work. Just my thoughts and opinions Dennis Lucas de Souza Santos wrote:>Hi, > >Has anyone compared XEN against (vmware) GSX Server? > >My boss wants to use GSX server because he said that it''s more stable >and has a good administration interface. > >I don''t want to use GSX server but I need a very good argument to >convince him. > >Thanks, > > > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >_______________________________________________ >Xen-users mailing list >Xen-users@lists.xensource.com >http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users >-- ---------------------------------- Dennis Willson mailto:taz@taz-mania.com http://www.taz-mania.com _______________________________________________ Xen-users mailing list Xen-users@lists.xensource.com http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users
> I also believe that VMWare is making the new server free because of XEN > and User mode Linux. I think they believe they can prove that their > management tools are better and get people to upgrade to their premium > GSX server to get some enhanced features.I was told by an EMC rep that Free server (GSX) was introduced to defuse microsoft''s VM Solution. They said it sets the street price on High Overhead VM''s to zero. The more advanced (and Xen like) ESX Server costs money as well as their management tools. ESX (much higher overhead than xen currently) will also support VT in what they say is the near future. Afaik Microsoft does not have a low overhead solution for their VM''s.. But I would imagine they will eventually also support VT... If they don''t now how long will it take Bill to move a couple billion into that effort?> In the long run I believe that > XEN will win that one. I really hope the XEN developers keep true > enterprise management in mind AND document the "Control APIs" well so > that others (maybe like me) can develop software to manage XEN based > systems without having to pour through all the XEN source to see how > things work.I think that in the end Enterprises will go with EMC (just as they do now) because of the management and control API''s and you will see more innovative solutions coming from people/companies/maybe-small-enterprises who use/deploy/develop XEN. To an enterprise "high price" is only really high if it doesn''t support an ROI model. They look for solutions typically that are proven. _Scott _______________________________________________ Xen-users mailing list Xen-users@lists.xensource.com http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users
M.A. Williamson schrieb:>> i''ve tryed both of them, and sorry yes Xen doesnt look stable for me ... >> my expirience with Xen 3 >> >> +performance improvemnt >> +handling dom0 Bridge and VMs >> -memory consuming task (Java,..) are crashing not only the >> unprivileged Dom > > I vaguely remember this problem (or something like it) coming up on > the mailing list... Memory hogs in domUs should not be able to effect > Xen/dom0 in any way. If they can then that''s a fairly horrible bug... > > Were you able to file a bugzilla for it? Does it occur on 3.0.1 or in > -unstable?Versions used: Centos 4.2 xen-3.0-x86_32-rhel4.1.src xen-3.0-x86_32-rhel4.1.bin CPU Athlon 2200+ 1GB Ram 160 IDE Disk the Machine was running before and is for Testing purpose. It was configured with Apache and mod_python for RRD Graphing, Nagios with checks triggering mod_python SOAP Services, Sendmail, and all the other default things. I created a VM with 1GB Root Disk and 20GB Data Disk (all on LVM). inside the VM there was nothing running except SSH and mldonkey. Then i wanted create a second VM to move the dom0 Services inside, but when i started moving one service inside and running the other still outside the machine starts getting load until nothing was working anymore. (nagios and apache where in pole position for this task) I cant reproduce this behavior right now as the Machine is used for something else now. for me it looks like ide and swaping and more (2) VMs and services in dom0 a confusing the scheduler so load gets raised until no timeslice is left... Greetz mIke> > Cheers, > Mark > >> my expirience with GSX 3 >> >> +VMs are portable between even different HostSystems (Win, Lin) >> +VMs dont crash HostSystem >> -performance not as gppd as im Xen >> -GuestSystem time sometimes steps much slower than real time >> (problem on timebased applications ...) >> >> there''s no killer Argument for Xen and non for GSX. Both do sometimes >> let you know that you dont have a real machine. >> >> If i should argument for one of them i would ask my boss if he wants >> someone to blame if something goes wrong and improvements by droping >> in cash, or maybe no real person to blame but improvments an more >> people to ask than VMWare can ever have. >> >> the Administration Interface is not a point your boss can hook on, >> cause you just need to deploy a webinterface which triggers your Xen >> commands and theres no need to deploy a Software Package like with >> VMWare. If he just doesnt want a commandline Interface he just needs >> some WebDesigner to wrap Pictures and many JavaScript and many .... >> around it ;) >> >> Greetz mIke >> >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Xen-users mailing list >>> Xen-users@lists.xensource.com >>> http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Xen-users mailing list >> Xen-users@lists.xensource.com >> http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users >>_______________________________________________ Xen-users mailing list Xen-users@lists.xensource.com http://lists.xensource.com/xen-users