Hi, We would like to stream some of our content as OGG Vorbis. We've currently managed to hack liveice and icecast to stream over HTTP and play that with ogg123. But from reading the dev list, I see that's also been done here, probably in a more elegant way - can anyone point me at the right place to see the current state of this? For now we'll probably just be doing this internally for testing, but in future we want to stream proper. We're definitely interested in actually doing this as soon as possible, although we probably won't advertise it until end-user playback is a bit more smooth (our audience is quite large, and an extremely high proportion are non-technical) and of course all streaming issues with the format are worked out (I'll list those later just in case you're not tired of running the list through your head :). Another main reason for this mail: Looking through the dev list, I see no current work on plugins for RealPlayer or Windows Media Player. Unfortunately, this would be pretty much essential before we could properly announce, as they're the only things we can rely on users having. Both have a plugin architecture, and both can apparantly be told (with SMIL for RealPlayer and asx for WMP) where to get a plugin for a new format. Is anyone working on either of these, or would anyone like to? When we have a few more resource, we will probably look at this ourselves, but for now we're pretty loaded down with other projects. If anyone has looked at this I'd love to hear from them. Streaming requirements & more questions: * CBR - I know this is coming... * Low bitrates - also coming, but is it trivial to generate codebooks for 32/16Kbps? Maybe even as low as 8 - would be interesting to hear if taking it that low competes with Real codecs. * Multiple bitrates (would be nice) - I imagine this is something that would have to be hacked into icecast. ISTR reading somewhere that taking high bitrate vorbis and outputting low was easy because of the format, but that might have been /. mutterings. What's the real story? Those aside, I'd love to get even 64Kbps VBR Vorbis streaming Radio 1 to the world even if it were only people on this list that knew about it while it was being developed. Hope someone can offer insight, especially on the icecast & plugins fronts, Thanks, ..ciaran -- Ciaran Anscomb <ciarana@rd.bbc.co.uk> BBC Internet Services, Kingswood Warren. x39515 --- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ Ogg project homepage: http://www.xiph.org/ogg/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'vorbis-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered.
> Looking through the dev list, I see no current work on plugins for > RealPlayer or Windows Media Player. Unfortunately, this would be > pretty much essential before we could properly announce, as they're the > only things we can rely on users having. Both have a plugin > architecture, and both can apparantly be told (with SMIL for RealPlayer > and asx for WMP) where to get a plugin for a new format.WMP probably uses the ACM (Audio Compression Manager) for compression.. (not sure..but it would be the way to go) Integration into it would allow use from any app using the ACM. Since you would give it away, I am sure MS would bundle it, ship it with future systems... They would have mixed feelings.. ..but you could shame them into it. My opinion, this integration is very critical to Vorbis success.. Regards, Tom --- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ Ogg project homepage: http://www.xiph.org/ogg/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'vorbis-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered.
On Wed, 13 Sep 2000, Ciaran Anscomb wrote:> We've currently managed to hack liveice and icecast to stream over HTTP > and play that with ogg123. But from reading the dev list, I see that's > also been done here, probably in a more elegant way - can anyone point > me at the right place to see the current state of this?When I did this a while back I had heard rumors that icecast were going to support ogg properly, possibly using rtsp/rtp protocols. However I have not seen or heard anything more on this subject, has anyone else? If this is not going to happen, what choices are there regarding ogg streaming servers?. HTTP streaming would be a great start and would certanly allow people currently who use real/mpeg a choice.> Looking through the dev list, I see no current work on plugins for > RealPlayer or Windows Media Player.Real are usually pretty good when it comes to plugins, they usually provide a plugin fairly soon after the format starts being used, however as there does not seem to be much activity on the ogg streaming front (at least publicly viewable) it's unlikly they will motivate themselves to produce the plugin. MS on the other hand... who knows. As I said before I would really like to see some HTTP servers for ogg, is there anything in the pipeline? Tim. --- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ Ogg project homepage: http://www.xiph.org/ogg/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'vorbis-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered.
Here are two references at RealNetworks, they are quite responsive: Ken Moore Software Development Engineer (206) 892-6029 kmoore@real.com Gary Cowan RealJukebox product manager RealNetworks 2601 Elliott Ave. Seattle WA 98121 (206) 892 6150 RAUL LOPEZ IZAHI>From: Ciaran Anscomb <ciarana@rd.bbc.co.uk> >Reply-To: vorbis@xiph.org >To: vorbis@xiph.org >Subject: Re: [vorbis] Hacking up streaming - we want to >Date: Fri, 15 Sep 2000 14:34:43 +0100 > >Sgrifennodd Tim Hurman: > >Hi Tim :) > > >On Wed, 13 Sep 2000, Ciaran Anscomb wrote: > > > >> Looking through the dev list, I see no current work on plugins for > >> RealPlayer or Windows Media Player. > > > >Real are usually pretty good when it comes to plugins, they usually > >provide a plugin fairly soon after the format starts being used, however > >as there does not seem to be much activity on the ogg streaming front (at > >least publicly viewable) it's unlikly they will motivate themselves to > >produce the plugin. MS on the other hand... who knows. > >Well, I've written to MS asking for pointers to their plugin >API. So far my mail's been forwarded to "Product Support and Services >group". We'll see what happens. I wouldn't personally like to get myself >involved in Windows coding, and I doubt any of the team here would either. > >Maybe it's worth talking to Real about this now and seeing if they >have a position on it yet? > >..ciaran > >--- >8 ---- >List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ >Ogg project homepage: http://www.xiph.org/ogg/ >To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'vorbis-request@xiph.org' >containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. >Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered._________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. Share information about yourself, create your own public profile at http://profiles.msn.com. --- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ Ogg project homepage: http://www.xiph.org/ogg/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'vorbis-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered.