Syslinux - Mar 2017 - "isolinux.bin missing or corrupt" when booting USB flash drive in old PC

On 03/18/2017 04:15 PM, Ady Ady via Syslinux wrote:
>
>> On 03/18/2017 01:18 AM, Ady Ady via Syslinux wrote:
>>> _ With the USB device connected to (one of) the problematic
>>> computer(s), power up the system and get into the BIOS setup. In
>>> the BIOS setup screen(s), change the boot order in such way that
>>> the USB device is recognized as first boot device. Other devices
>>> such as CD-ROM and your local HDD should be listed after the USB
>>> device in the boot order (as second/third boot devices). Then
>>> save the BIOS settings and try booting with the USB device.
>>
>> I have adjusted the boot order in BIOS setup, but it is unnecessary
>> -- the only other drive is a CD/DVD-RW drive, and it does not
>> contain a disc.
>
> You probably mean in addition to a HDD, right?
The computer has a HDD mobile rack.  I removed the HDD when testing the
Debian installer image on a USB flash drive.  So, the only drive other
than the USB flash drive under test was the optical drive.

>>> _ If the BIOS setup includes some "fast (POST) boot" or
"quick
>>> (POST) boot" (or similar) option, disable it.
>>
>> Already done.
...
> What exactly was "done"?
BIOS SETUP UTILITY -> Boot:

- Silent Boot is Disabled

- Intel(R) Rapid BIOS Boot is Disabled

> Which USB modes this BIOS supports? USB-AUTO? USB-HDD?...
Please see previous post for USB settings.  That's all that is available
-- there is no "USB-AUTO", "USB-HDD", etc..


David

> On 03/18/2017 04:15 PM, Ady Ady via Syslinux wrote:
> >
> >> On 03/18/2017 01:18 AM, Ady Ady via Syslinux wrote:
> >>> _ With the USB device connected to (one of) the problematic
> >>> computer(s), power up the system and get into the BIOS setup.
In
> >>> the BIOS setup screen(s), change the boot order in such way
that
> >>> the USB device is recognized as first boot device. Other
devices
> >>> such as CD-ROM and your local HDD should be listed after the
USB
> >>> device in the boot order (as second/third boot devices). Then
> >>> save the BIOS settings and try booting with the USB device.
> >>
> >> I have adjusted the boot order in BIOS setup, but it is
unnecessary
> >> -- the only other drive is a CD/DVD-RW drive, and it does not
> >> contain a disc.
> >
> > You probably mean in addition to a HDD, right?
> 
> The computer has a HDD mobile rack.  I removed the HDD when testing the
> Debian installer image on a USB flash drive.  So, the only drive other
> than the USB flash drive under test was the optical drive.
> 
> 
> >>> _ If the BIOS setup includes some "fast (POST) boot"
or "quick
> >>> (POST) boot" (or similar) option, disable it.
> >>
> >> Already done.
> ...
> > What exactly was "done"?
> 
> BIOS SETUP UTILITY -> Boot:
> 
> - Silent Boot is Disabled
> 
> - Intel(R) Rapid BIOS Boot is Disabled
> 
> 
> > Which USB modes this BIOS supports? USB-AUTO? USB-HDD?...
> 
> Please see previous post for USB settings.  That's all that is
available
> -- there is no "USB-AUTO", "USB-HDD", etc..
> 
> 
> David
 
 
During POST, there should be some option to press some key, in order to 
select a (different) boot device. This is usually done by users when 
they want to use a different boot device just one time, instead of 
modifying the boot order in the BIOS setup screen(s).

After pressing such key (specific to each system, as I described in a 
prior email), there might be different "USB" options, typically 
"USB-AUTO", "USB-HDD", "USB-ZIP",
"USB-FLOPPY", among others.

As I mentioned in a prior email, using an older version of ISOLINUX 
(and related packages) would probably give you an "isolinux.bin" file 
smaller than 32KiB, which is one of the possible solutions (if its 
current size happens to be the source for failure).

In another email, you mentioned your desire to use USB devices instead 
of optical ones. You do not need to build ISO images just for USB 
devices. As I explained before, there is an alternative method, better 
suited for broader compatibility than using isohybrid images. Instead 
of learning how to build ISO images just so you can burn them on a USB 
device, I would suggest learning how to use SYSLINUX. And, again, there 
are auxiliary tools that would simplify the procedure even further.

BTW, the ISO image of memtest86+ is not isohybrid. In fact, it is a 
floppy-emulation ISO image. There is an image for USB devices, but it 
is not an ISO image. So, using dd for memtest86+ doesn't mean "the same
procedure". Or, perhaps we are talking about a different
"memtest"?

Once again, I would suggest searching for some auxiliary tool (e.g. 
RUFUS under Windows, there are many others, including those for Linux), 
or learning how to do it manually. It would certainly simplify things 
when you want to customize a/your own Linux distribution (considering 
that isohybrid is, for the most part, read-only, while using SYSLINUX 
allows for writing).

Regarding distros for older computers, there are several. The problem, 
at least at this point, is bootability. Although Antix is for older 
computers, it is also based on Debian and the latest ISOLINUX will also 
be bigger than 32KiB. Perhaps Knoppix or some (of the many) PuppyLinux 
would still use ISOLINUX 4.xx or older. SUSE derivatives also use v. 
4.xx. Slackware derivatives too. DSL used to provide a floppy-emulation 
ISO image, but it is no longer maintained and not suitable for USB 
either.

So, to sum up, if you learn how to use SYSLINUX instead of ISOLINUX, 
or, even simpler than that, search for an auxiliary tool that performs 
(all) the steps for you, you could have a USB device with whichever 
Linux distribution (for x86) you would want to customize for these 
systems.

Regards,
Ady.
 
 
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> 
> The computer has a HDD mobile rack.  I removed the HDD when testing the
> Debian installer image on a USB flash drive.  So, the only drive other
> than the USB flash drive under test was the optical drive.
> 
> 
In my last email, I forgot to emphasize the following generic 
procedure.

In the BIOS setup screen(s), one set of options are intended for 
sorting the boot order according to type of devices (CD-ROM, HDD, 
floppy...).

There is _another_ set of options, usually on the first (or the main) 
setup screen. The BIOS detects a list of devices currently connected to 
each PATA/IDE/SATA port. The detection also varies, depending on 
additional settings such as "legacy/raid/ahci/sata", or even
"pio/dma"
mode, meaning that the same devices might be detected and _listed_ 
within the BIOS main screen when using some of these settings, whereas 
they won't be listed while using different BIOS settings.

With your USB device connected and the computer powered off (as in 
completely shut down), power up and get into the BIOS setup screen. In 
the main screen, the first device, connected to the first, detected 
(P)ATA/IDE port, should be your USB device, as if it were to be 
identified as a regular HDD. This is different than the boot _order_ 
screen.

If the main screen in your BIOS can list the USB device as the first 
device in the list, and it can also be set as the first device in the 
boot order settings, then  the chances of booting successfully can 
increase.

This procedure is independent of the potential 32KiB limitation for 
isolinux.bin for certain BIOS implementations. This potential 
additional issue can still be an impediment to boot in certain systems 
anyway. The same goes for other potential issues.

Yet, if the BIOS cannot list / detect the USB device as if it was a 
common HDD (UNrelated to the boot order, just in addition to it), then 
the chances for a successful boot are diminished.

Regards,
Ady.

On 03/19/2017 01:12 AM, Ady Ady via Syslinux wrote:
> During POST, there should be some option to press some key, in order to
> select a (different) boot device. This is usually done by users when
> they want to use a different boot device just one time, instead of
> modifying the boot order in the BIOS setup screen(s).
>
> After pressing such key (specific to each system, as I described in a
> prior email), there might be different "USB" options, typically
> "USB-AUTO", "USB-HDD", "USB-ZIP",
"USB-FLOPPY", among others.
The key is F10:

Please select boot device:

ADATA USB Flash Drive 0.00

> As I mentioned in a prior email, using an older version of ISOLINUX
> (and related packages) would probably give you an "isolinux.bin"
file
> smaller than 32KiB, which is one of the possible solutions (if its
> current size happens to be the source for failure).
I would consider older software if it is still supported.  Is it?  If 
so, please provide a URL.  If not, no thanks.

> In another email, you mentioned your desire to use USB devices instead
> of optical ones. You do not need to build ISO images just for USB
> devices. As I explained before, there is an alternative method, better
> suited for broader compatibility than using isohybrid images. Instead
> of learning how to build ISO images just so you can burn them on a USB
> device, I would suggest learning how to use SYSLINUX. And, again, there
> are auxiliary tools that would simplify the procedure even further.
Please provide a URL for documentation that explains how to build a 
bootable USB flash drive equivalent to debian-8.7.1-i386-xfce-CD-1.iso.

> BTW, the ISO image of memtest86+ is not isohybrid. In fact, it is a
> floppy-emulation ISO image. There is an image for USB devices, but it
> is not an ISO image. So, using dd for memtest86+ doesn't mean "the
same
> procedure". Or, perhaps we are talking about a different
"memtest"?
My point was to prove that the computer is capable of booting from a USB 
flash drive.  I do not expect that the Memtest86+ or FreeBSD bootable 
USB flash drives use Linux or anything else in 
debian-8.7.1-i386-xfce-CD-1.iso.

> Once again, I would suggest searching for some auxiliary tool (e.g.
> RUFUS under Windows, there are many others, including those for Linux),
> or learning how to do it manually. It would certainly simplify things
> when you want to customize a/your own Linux distribution (considering
> that isohybrid is, for the most part, read-only, while using SYSLINUX
> allows for writing).
Please provide a URL for documentation that explains how to build a 
bootable USB flash drive equivalent to debian-8.7.1-i386-xfce-CD-1.iso.

> Regarding distros for older computers, there are several. The problem,
> at least at this point, is bootability. Although Antix is for older
> computers, it is also based on Debian and the latest ISOLINUX will also
> be bigger than 32KiB. Perhaps Knoppix or some (of the many) PuppyLinux
> would still use ISOLINUX 4.xx or older. SUSE derivatives also use v.
> 4.xx. Slackware derivatives too. DSL used to provide a floppy-emulation
> ISO image, but it is no longer maintained and not suitable for USB
> either.
If anyone knows of a Linux distribution targeted at 32-bit hardware, 
please say so.

> So, to sum up, if you learn how to use SYSLINUX instead of ISOLINUX,
> or, even simpler than that, search for an auxiliary tool that performs
> (all) the steps for you, you could have a USB device with whichever
> Linux distribution (for x86) you would want to customize for these
> systems.
Please provide a URL for documentation that explains how to build a 
bootable USB flash drive equivalent to debian-8.7.1-i386-xfce-CD-1.iso.


David

On 03/19/2017 02:03 AM, Ady Ady via Syslinux wrote:
> In my last email, I forgot to emphasize the following generic
> procedure.
>
> In the BIOS setup screen(s), one set of options are intended for
> sorting the boot order according to type of devices (CD-ROM, HDD,
> floppy...).
>
> There is _another_ set of options, usually on the first (or the main)
> setup screen. The BIOS detects a list of devices currently connected to
> each PATA/IDE/SATA port. The detection also varies, depending on
> additional settings such as "legacy/raid/ahci/sata", or even
"pio/dma"
> mode, meaning that the same devices might be detected and _listed_
> within the BIOS main screen when using some of these settings, whereas
> they won't be listed while using different BIOS settings.
>
> With your USB device connected and the computer powered off (as in
> completely shut down), power up and get into the BIOS setup screen. In
> the main screen, the first device, connected to the first, detected
> (P)ATA/IDE port, should be your USB device, as if it were to be
> identified as a regular HDD. This is different than the boot _order_
> screen.
The BIOS SETUP UTILITY -> Advanced -> Drive Configuration screen only 
lists SATA and PATA devices that are connected to the associated port. 
If nothing is connected, the entry is listed as "Not Detected".  I
have
never seen USB flash drives listed on this screen; doing so would make 
no sense.  USB flash drives are controlled by the CMOS settings I have 
already posted.

> If the main screen in your BIOS can list the USB device as the first
> device in the list, and it can also be set as the first device in the
> boot order settings, then  the chances of booting successfully can
> increase.
>
> This procedure is independent of the potential 32KiB limitation for
> isolinux.bin for certain BIOS implementations. This potential
> additional issue can still be an impediment to boot in certain systems
> anyway. The same goes for other potential issues.
>
> Yet, if the BIOS cannot list / detect the USB device as if it was a
> common HDD (UNrelated to the boot order, just in addition to it), then
> the chances for a successful boot are diminished.
Please refer to Chapter 4 of the Intel ? Desktop Board D865GBF/D865GLC 
Technical Product Specification if you want to see everything that is 
available via the "BIOS SETUP UTILITY":

http://www.intel.com/content/dam/support/us/en/documents/motherboards/desktop/d865gbf/d865gbf_d865glc_techprodspec.pdf


David