I''m using a habtm self referential (below). When I work with it in the console, if I do this: memberA.friends[0] = memberB memberA.save Nothing actually gets saved to the join table. (memberA and memberB are previously saved objects). If, however, I do this: memberA.friends[0] = Member.new // the new object here is the difference memberA.save the relationship Does get saved to the join table. Anyone have a clue as to why this is? And how I can get changes to previously saved objects to save to the sql join table? Thanks! -- Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.