I''m looking for a skilled Ruby on Rails developer to pick up some slack on one of my company''s most interesting projects. Knowledge of SQL and javascript, and significant web-development experience are a must. In addition to your wage, there''s a potential for profit- sharing and long-term work. Right now, we can guarantee a minimum of 100 hours. Please contact Josh at 773.363.0820 or through email at cinekin-Re5JQEeQqe9fmgfxC/sS/w@public.gmane.org This project is time-sensitive; only serious developers need apply. Thanks, Josh Berg President Promethean Ventures, LLC --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Talk" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-talk?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
On Wed, May 28, 2008 at 06:12:56AM -0700, Josh.B wrote:> > I''m looking for a skilled Ruby on Rails developer to pick up some > slack on one of my company''s most interesting projects. Knowledge of > SQL and javascript, and significant web-development experience are a > must. In addition to your wage, there''s a potential for profit- > sharing and long-term work. Right now, we can guarantee a minimum of > 100 hours. Please contact Josh at 773.363.0820 or through email at > cinekin-Re5JQEeQqe9fmgfxC/sS/w@public.gmane.org This project is time-sensitive; only serious > developers need apply.Right. You want "significant web-development experience" including "[k]nowledge of SQL and JavaScript" and you want to pay $25-$50/hour for it, presumably with no additional benefits. If you''re *very* lucky you''ll find someone competent and experienced who, somehow, undervalues him-/herself. Much more likely is that you will find someone who will gladly claim to have the experience and knowledge you want and will do a mediocre job. At least as likely is that you will find no one willing to work for that chicken feed at all. I''m not responding because I''m insulted or offended. It is important, however, not to allow the work we do to be undervalued; $50/hour is on the very low end of plausible payment for contract web development work by an experienced programmer.> Thanks, > Josh Berg > President > Promethean Ventures, LLC--Greg --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Talk" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-talk?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
A chinese Rails programmer is OK? On Wed, May 28, 2008 at 9:12 PM, Josh.B <Cinekin-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> wrote:> > I''m looking for a skilled Ruby on Rails developer to pick up some > slack on one of my company''s most interesting projects. Knowledge of > SQL and javascript, and significant web-development experience are a > must. In addition to your wage, there''s a potential for profit- > sharing and long-term work. Right now, we can guarantee a minimum of > 100 hours. Please contact Josh at 773.363.0820 or through email at > cinekin-Re5JQEeQqe9fmgfxC/sS/w@public.gmane.org This project is time-sensitive; only serious > developers need apply. > > Thanks, > Josh Berg > President > Promethean Ventures, LLC > > >--~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Talk" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-talk?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
Wow... I must live in a real cheap area then, because *nobody* here pays anywhere near $50/hour for any programming work whatsoever - about $25-30 is all I''ve seen, and around the same range for fulltime employment wanting similar experienced programmers. And about $25/ hour is considered high paying for programmers. I''m only still a beginner with RoR so I''m not qualified for the original request (or I doubt I am, at any rate). I''m just intrigued that $50/hour (at 100 hours, thats 5 grand) is considered very low for an experienced programmer. - Wayne On May 28, 2008, at 10:27 AM, Gregory Seidman wrote:> $50/hour is on the > very low end of plausible payment for contract web development work > by an > experienced programmer.--~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Talk" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-talk?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
Using the rule of thirds (1/3 for taxes, 1/3 for expenses, and 1/3 take home), that $50/hour gig really is only $16.50 an hour, which is barely enough to eat on. $25 is only $8.25. I wouldn''t expect to find any good programmers for less than $75/hour, minimum. On May 28, 9:51 am, Wayne Molina <wayne.mol...-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> wrote:> Wow... I must live in a real cheap area then, because *nobody* here > pays anywhere near $50/hour for any programming work whatsoever - > about $25-30 is all I''ve seen, and around the same range for fulltime > employment wanting similar experienced programmers. And about $25/ > hour is considered high paying for programmers. > > I''m only still a beginner with RoR so I''m not qualified for the > original request (or I doubt I am, at any rate). I''m just intrigued > that $50/hour (at 100 hours, thats 5 grand) is considered very low for > an experienced programmer. > > - Wayne > > On May 28, 2008, at 10:27 AM, Gregory Seidman wrote: > > > $50/hour is on the > > very low end of plausible payment for contract web development work > > by an > > experienced programmer.--~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Talk" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-talk?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
I must just live in a shit area then - At one point I was looking for contract at about $55/hour (knowing full-well that I would need to do my own benefits and taxes and whatnot) and I some people flat-out laugh at me for wanting so much money. "That''s over $100,000 a year! Nobody will pay that for development!" Most contract gigs I see, especially through recruiters, pay about $30 although the recruiter takes taxes and provides benefits, so I guess in that case it evens out. - Wayne On May 28, 2008, at 11:17 AM, John Yerhot wrote:> > Using the rule of thirds (1/3 for taxes, 1/3 for expenses, and 1/3 > take home), that $50/hour gig really is only $16.50 an hour, which is > barely enough to eat on. $25 is only $8.25. I wouldn''t expect to find > any good programmers for less than $75/hour, minimum. > > On May 28, 9:51 am, Wayne Molina <wayne.mol...-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> wrote: >> Wow... I must live in a real cheap area then, because *nobody* here >> pays anywhere near $50/hour for any programming work whatsoever - >> about $25-30 is all I''ve seen, and around the same range for fulltime >> employment wanting similar experienced programmers. And about $25/ >> hour is considered high paying for programmers. >> >> I''m only still a beginner with RoR so I''m not qualified for the >> original request (or I doubt I am, at any rate). I''m just intrigued >> that $50/hour (at 100 hours, thats 5 grand) is considered very low >> for >> an experienced programmer. >> >> - Wayne >> >> On May 28, 2008, at 10:27 AM, Gregory Seidman wrote: >> >>> $50/hour is on the >>> very low end of plausible payment for contract web development work >>> by an >>> experienced programmer. > >--~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Talk" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-talk?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
On 28 May 2008, at 16:17, John Yerhot wrote:> > Using the rule of thirds (1/3 for taxes, 1/3 for expenses, and 1/3 > take home), that $50/hour gig really is only $16.50 an hour, which is > barely enough to eat on. $25 is only $8.25. I wouldn''t expect to find > any good programmers for less than $75/hour, minimum. >And there''s always a (sizable) difference between what you would pay a salaried worker and what you''d pay a contractor Fred> On May 28, 9:51 am, Wayne Molina <wayne.mol...-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> wrote: >> Wow... I must live in a real cheap area then, because *nobody* here >> pays anywhere near $50/hour for any programming work whatsoever - >> about $25-30 is all I''ve seen, and around the same range for fulltime >> employment wanting similar experienced programmers. And about $25/ >> hour is considered high paying for programmers. >> >> I''m only still a beginner with RoR so I''m not qualified for the >> original request (or I doubt I am, at any rate). I''m just intrigued >> that $50/hour (at 100 hours, thats 5 grand) is considered very low >> for >> an experienced programmer. >> >> - Wayne >> >> On May 28, 2008, at 10:27 AM, Gregory Seidman wrote: >> >>> $50/hour is on the >>> very low end of plausible payment for contract web development work >>> by an >>> experienced programmer. > >--~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Talk" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-talk?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
On 28 May 2008, at 17:22, Wayne Molina wrote:> I must just live in a shit area then - At one point I was looking for > contract at about $55/hour (knowing full-well that I would need to do > my own benefits and taxes and whatnot) and I some people flat-out > laugh at me for wanting so much money. "That''s over $100,000 a year! > Nobody will pay that for development!" Most contract gigs I see, > especially through recruiters, pay about $30 although the recruiter > takes taxes and provides benefits, so I guess in that case it evens > out.Benefits? In that case you''re a temp salaried employee of the recruiter and not a genuine contractor with a business on his/her own terms. --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Talk" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-talk?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
On May 28, 2008, at 11:22 AM, Wayne Molina wrote:> I must just live in a shit area then - At one point I was looking for > contract at about $55/hour (knowing full-well that I would need to do > my own benefits and taxes and whatnot) and I some people flat-out > laugh at me for wanting so much money. "That''s over $100,000 a year! > Nobody will pay that for development!" Most contract gigs I see, > especially through recruiters, pay about $30 although the recruiter > takes taxes and provides benefits, so I guess in that case it evens > out. > > - WayneSure, $55/hr * 40hr/wk * 52wk/yr > $100,000 but you''re comparing contract with salary. There are problems with this line of thought: 1) Salaried personnel are paid all the time, contractors/consultants only when you need them 2) Acquisition costs of a new employee (W-2) can easily be $15-$20K, for a contractor (1099) this is almost certainly less than $1000 (and might be just a few hundred, but it is *not* zero because someone is still making sure that the new contractor will be paid, right?) 3) As John said, the taxes and other expenses which are built into the contractor''s rate are "hidden" in the salary. To get a comparison, you have to factor health insurance, employment taxes, sick/vacation time, 401(k) matching funds, etc. into the salaried number to get an equivalent hourly cost to the company. I have four clients right now that could not afford to hire me full time and quite frankly don''t have the work to keep me busy at a level approaching full time. That''s something else that factors into the employee v. contractor decision. While all my clients have at some point (usually at the beginning of the relationship) had nearly complete use of my time, it has simply not been sustainable for any of them (well, OK, so two of them could/can potentially have kept me busy 100% for an extended period of time, but those are the minority). -Rob Rob Biedenharn http://agileconsultingllc.com Rob-xa9cJyRlE0mWcWVYNo9pwxS2lgjeYSpx@public.gmane.org --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Talk" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-talk?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
Oh, I know that. I''m just re-iterating what I was flat-out told by a recruiter when I told him my desired rate for contracting. On May 28, 2008, at 12:54 PM, Rob Biedenharn wrote:> > On May 28, 2008, at 11:22 AM, Wayne Molina wrote: >> I must just live in a shit area then - At one point I was looking for >> contract at about $55/hour (knowing full-well that I would need to do >> my own benefits and taxes and whatnot) and I some people flat-out >> laugh at me for wanting so much money. "That''s over $100,000 a year! >> Nobody will pay that for development!" Most contract gigs I see, >> especially through recruiters, pay about $30 although the recruiter >> takes taxes and provides benefits, so I guess in that case it evens >> out. >> >> - Wayne > > > Sure, $55/hr * 40hr/wk * 52wk/yr > $100,000 but you''re comparing > contract with salary. > > There are problems with this line of thought: > 1) Salaried personnel are paid all the time, contractors/consultants > only when you need them > 2) Acquisition costs of a new employee (W-2) can easily be $15-$20K, > for a contractor (1099) this is almost certainly less than $1000 (and > might be just a few hundred, but it is *not* zero because someone is > still making sure that the new contractor will be paid, right?) > 3) As John said, the taxes and other expenses which are built into the > contractor''s rate are "hidden" in the salary. To get a comparison, > you have to factor health insurance, employment taxes, sick/vacation > time, 401(k) matching funds, etc. into the salaried number to get an > equivalent hourly cost to the company. > > I have four clients right now that could not afford to hire me full > time and quite frankly don''t have the work to keep me busy at a level > approaching full time. That''s something else that factors into the > employee v. contractor decision. While all my clients have at some > point (usually at the beginning of the relationship) had nearly > complete use of my time, it has simply not been sustainable for any of > them (well, OK, so two of them could/can potentially have kept me busy > 100% for an extended period of time, but those are the minority). > > -Rob > > Rob Biedenharn http://agileconsultingllc.com > Rob-xa9cJyRlE0mWcWVYNo9pwxS2lgjeYSpx@public.gmane.org > > > > >--~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Talk" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-talk?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
On Wed, May 28, 2008 at 10:51:51AM -0400, Wayne Molina wrote:> Wow... I must live in a real cheap area then, because *nobody* here > pays anywhere near $50/hour for any programming work whatsoever - > about $25-30 is all I''ve seen, and around the same range for fulltime > employment wanting similar experienced programmers. And about $25/ > hour is considered high paying for programmers. > > I''m only still a beginner with RoR so I''m not qualified for the > original request (or I doubt I am, at any rate). I''m just intrigued > that $50/hour (at 100 hours, thats 5 grand) is considered very low for > an experienced programmer.It''s worth noting that I am specifically talking about contract work, which includes no benefits and leaves the contractor responsible for his/her own health insurance, retirement plan, payroll taxes, and (I think) additional social security and medicare payments. Contractors also have to cover any desired (or forced by a lack of available work) vacation time with money saved from billable hours. Earning $25-$50 as an employee at a company is different, if that''s what you were thinking of.> - Wayne--Greg> On May 28, 2008, at 10:27 AM, Gregory Seidman wrote: > > > $50/hour is on the > > very low end of plausible payment for contract web development work > > by an > > experienced programmer. > > > > >--~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Talk" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-talk?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
On Wed, May 28, 2008 at 01:18:43PM -0400, Wayne Molina wrote:> Oh, I know that. I''m just re-iterating what I was flat-out told by a > recruiter when I told him my desired rate for contracting.Just to be clear, recruiters are not reliable sources of information. They do not have your best interests at heart. They get paid when they fill a job slot, not when you are happy. While there are certainly recruiters out there with integrity, competence, and a good track record they are hard to pick out of the haystack. You may find this post helpful in dealing with recruiters: http://weblog.raganwald.com/2006/08/three-tips-for-getting-job-through.html Note that I am talking about third-party recruiters rather than recruiters employed by a company to fill jobs at that company. --Greg> On May 28, 2008, at 12:54 PM, Rob Biedenharn wrote: > > > > > On May 28, 2008, at 11:22 AM, Wayne Molina wrote: > >> I must just live in a shit area then - At one point I was looking for > >> contract at about $55/hour (knowing full-well that I would need to do > >> my own benefits and taxes and whatnot) and I some people flat-out > >> laugh at me for wanting so much money. "That''s over $100,000 a year! > >> Nobody will pay that for development!" Most contract gigs I see, > >> especially through recruiters, pay about $30 although the recruiter > >> takes taxes and provides benefits, so I guess in that case it evens > >> out. > >> > >> - Wayne > > > > > > Sure, $55/hr * 40hr/wk * 52wk/yr > $100,000 but you''re comparing > > contract with salary. > > > > There are problems with this line of thought: > > 1) Salaried personnel are paid all the time, contractors/consultants > > only when you need them > > 2) Acquisition costs of a new employee (W-2) can easily be $15-$20K, > > for a contractor (1099) this is almost certainly less than $1000 (and > > might be just a few hundred, but it is *not* zero because someone is > > still making sure that the new contractor will be paid, right?) > > 3) As John said, the taxes and other expenses which are built into the > > contractor''s rate are "hidden" in the salary. To get a comparison, > > you have to factor health insurance, employment taxes, sick/vacation > > time, 401(k) matching funds, etc. into the salaried number to get an > > equivalent hourly cost to the company. > > > > I have four clients right now that could not afford to hire me full > > time and quite frankly don''t have the work to keep me busy at a level > > approaching full time. That''s something else that factors into the > > employee v. contractor decision. While all my clients have at some > > point (usually at the beginning of the relationship) had nearly > > complete use of my time, it has simply not been sustainable for any of > > them (well, OK, so two of them could/can potentially have kept me busy > > 100% for an extended period of time, but those are the minority). > > > > -Rob > > > > Rob Biedenharn http://agileconsultingllc.com > > Rob-xa9cJyRlE0mWcWVYNo9pwxS2lgjeYSpx@public.gmane.org > > > > > > > > > > > > > >--~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Talk" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-talk?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
> It''s worth noting that I am specifically talking about contract work, which > includes no benefits and leaves the contractor responsible for his/her own > health insurance, retirement plan, payroll taxes, and (I think) additional > social security and medicare payments. Contractors also have to cover any > desired (or forced by a lack of available work) vacation time with money > saved from billable hours.Don''t forget you pay for your own office space (even if it''s a home office), office furniture, computer hardware, internet access, cell phone, software, books, training, business insurance, etc. etc. etc. I''ve read that the annual business cost for an employee can be anywhere from 1.5 to 2.0 times the employee''s salary. --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Talk" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-talk?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
Wayne, I sympathize with what you are saying. I totally believe that is what people are telling you where you live. And the others are also correct at the same time that it is too low. In my experience, I have found that the work of developers (and engineers) is generally undervalued and under appreciated. The same people who would not hesitate to spend $300+ per hour on an attorney to nothing more than push paper, will refuse to spend $50 or more on engineer. Contracting by the hour is very tough way to make a living. Good luck to you. On May 28, 8:22 am, Wayne Molina <wayne.mol...-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> wrote:> I must just live in a shit area then - At one point I was looking for > contract at about $55/hour (knowing full-well that I would need to do > my own benefits and taxes and whatnot) and I some people flat-out > laugh at me for wanting so much money. "That''s over $100,000 a year! > Nobody will pay that for development!" Most contract gigs I see, > especially through recruiters, pay about $30 although the recruiter > takes taxes and provides benefits, so I guess in that case it evens out. > > - Wayne > > On May 28, 2008, at 11:17 AM, John Yerhot wrote: > > > > > Using the rule of thirds (1/3 for taxes, 1/3 for expenses, and 1/3 > > take home), that $50/hour gig really is only $16.50 an hour, which is > > barely enough to eat on. $25 is only $8.25. I wouldn''t expect to find > > any good programmers for less than $75/hour, minimum. > > > On May 28, 9:51 am, Wayne Molina <wayne.mol...-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> wrote: > >> Wow... I must live in a real cheap area then, because *nobody* here > >> pays anywhere near $50/hour for any programming work whatsoever - > >> about $25-30 is all I''ve seen, and around the same range for fulltime > >> employment wanting similar experienced programmers. And about $25/ > >> hour is considered high paying for programmers. > > >> I''m only still a beginner with RoR so I''m not qualified for the > >> original request (or I doubt I am, at any rate). I''m just intrigued > >> that $50/hour (at 100 hours, thats 5 grand) is considered very low > >> for > >> an experienced programmer. > > >> - Wayne > > >> On May 28, 2008, at 10:27 AM, Gregory Seidman wrote: > > >>> $50/hour is on the > >>> very low end of plausible payment for contract web development work > >>> by an > >>> experienced programmer.--~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Talk" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-talk-unsubscribe-/JYPxA39Uh5TLH3MbocFFw@public.gmane.org For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-talk?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---