Without wanting to sound too pushy, I'm wondering if there is any update on the status of Mate now that Centos 8 has been released? I would love to jump on C8 and start playing with it, but the lack of Mate is kind of a showstopper for me at the moment. -- MELVILLE THEATRE ~ Real D 3D Digital Cinema ~ www.melvilletheatre.com
On Tue, 24 Sep, 2019 at 13:41:08 -0600, Frank Cox wrote:> Without wanting to sound too pushy, I'm wondering if there is any update on the status of Mate now that Centos 8 has been released? > > I would love to jump on C8 and start playing with it, but the lack of Mate is kind of a showstopper for me at the moment. >If the availability of a particular desktop environment is a showstopper, then perhaps RHEL and CentOS are not the best choice for you. RHEL 8 has dropped KDE, never mind Mate. Providing and maintaining alternative desktop environments over the (long) life cycle of CentOS 8 will require a?sustained effort by volunteers over many years. I wouldn't count on $PREFERRED_DESKTOP_ENVIRONMENT continuing to be available over that time frame.
Liam O'Toole wrote:> On Tue, 24 Sep, 2019 at 13:41:08 -0600, Frank Cox wrote: > >> Without wanting to sound too pushy, I'm wondering if there is any >> update on the status of Mate now that Centos 8 has been released? >> >> I would love to jump on C8 and start playing with it, but the lack of >> Mate is kind of a showstopper for me at the moment. >> > If the availability of a particular desktop environment is a > showstopper, then perhaps RHEL and CentOS are not the best choice for you. > RHEL 8 has dropped KDE, never mind Mate. Providing and maintainingWHAT?!?!?! I *loathe* gnome, and it just keeps getting more bloated and worse. When I'm ready to install 8, I'll have to see if icewm is updated for it. mark
On Tue, 24 Sep 2019 21:27:07 +0100 Liam O'Toole wrote:> If the availability of a particular desktop environment is a > showstopper, then perhaps RHEL and CentOS are not the best choice for > you.That may be, but in view of the fact that you can even get a version of CDE that works (very well) on Centos 7 (https://github.com/dcantrell/cderpm if you're interested), I find it difficult to believe that a widely used and mature desktop like Mate will just disappear on a widely used and mature Linux distribution like Centos. And since I've been using Centos for everything for a lot of years I'm not in a hurry to change to something else if I can avoid it.> Providing and maintaining > alternative desktop environments over the (long) life cycle of CentOS 8 > will require a?sustained effort by volunteers over many years.If that isn't being organized by someone at this time, I would be frankly surprised. -- MELVILLE THEATRE ~ Real D 3D Digital Cinema ~ www.melvilletheatre.com
On Tue, 24 Sep 2019 at 15:41, Frank Cox <theatre at sasktel.net> wrote:> > Without wanting to sound too pushy, I'm wondering if there is any update on the status of Mate now that Centos 8 has been released? > > I would love to jump on C8 and start playing with it, but the lack of Mate is kind of a showstopper for me at the moment. >Nothing has changed since the September 16 answer I gave: This is more of a question for the EPEL lists versus here. The current status is that desktops are harder to package up in EL8 and only a less feature version is available at the moment. At the moment the only one I know of is KDE is half implemented in EPEL Playground and will be reimplemented as a module when EPEL gains the ability to do modules. At that point interested people can also do the work to make Mate/Cinnamon/etc available. -- Stephen J Smoogen.
On Tue, 24 Sep 2019 16:55:19 -0400 Stephen John Smoogen wrote:> Nothing has changed since the September 16 answer I gave: > > This is more of a question for the EPEL lists versus here. The current > status is that desktops are harder to package up in EL8 and only a > less feature version is available at the moment. At the moment the > only one I know of is KDE is half implemented in EPEL Playground and > will be reimplemented as a module when EPEL gains the ability to do > modules. At that point interested people can also do the work to make > Mate/Cinnamon/etc available.Thanks ever so much for the update, even though as you say nothing much has changed. Perhaps now that more people have their hands on Centos 8 and can work with it the folks who know what they're doing for getting desktops running on EL8 (and I'm definitely not one of them) will be able to make further progress. I sincerely appreciate the update, though. Since Mate is widely used, I suspect other folks who follow this mailing list would also be interested progress reports and release announcements when and if something becomes available. -- MELVILLE THEATRE ~ Real D 3D Digital Cinema ~ www.melvilletheatre.com
On 24/09/2019 21:55, Stephen John Smoogen wrote:> On Tue, 24 Sep 2019 at 15:41, Frank Cox <theatre at sasktel.net> wrote: >> Without wanting to sound too pushy, I'm wondering if there is any update on the status of Mate now that Centos 8 has been released? >> >> I would love to jump on C8 and start playing with it, but the lack of Mate is kind of a showstopper for me at the moment. >> > Nothing has changed since the September 16 answer I gave: > > This is more of a question for the EPEL lists versus here. The current > status is that desktops are harder to package up in EL8 and only a > less feature version is available at the moment. At the moment the > only one I know of is KDE is half implemented in EPEL Playground and > will be reimplemented as a module when EPEL gains the ability to do > modules. At that point interested people can also do the work to make > Mate/Cinnamon/etc available. > > > > -- > Stephen J Smoogen. > _______________________________________________ > CentOS mailing list > CentOS at centos.org > https://eur01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.centos.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fcentos&data=02%7C01%7Ch.toms%40qmul.ac.uk%7Cb1eb2e3f4b5344b873d808d74131a14f%7C569df091b01340e386eebd9cb9e25814%7C0%7C0%7C637049553727380141&sdata=Rtr1GSd2ut%2BFLDHayci6bTnMHcu5IwZ5VGbf%2BGqkLDI%3D&reserved=0FWIW icewm (uses an XWayland session) is available in EPEL-testing for CentOS 8. I've tried it out and it seems very stable, I've had no issues with it. -- regards H
On 9/24/19 10:55 PM, Stephen John Smoogen wrote:> On Tue, 24 Sep 2019 at 15:41, Frank Cox <theatre at sasktel.net> wrote: >> >> Without wanting to sound too pushy, I'm wondering if there is any update on the status of Mate now that Centos 8 has been released? >> >> I would love to jump on C8 and start playing with it, but the lack of Mate is kind of a showstopper for me at the moment. >> > > Nothing has changed since the September 16 answer I gave: > > This is more of a question for the EPEL lists versus here. The current > status is that desktops are harder to package up in EL8 and only a > less feature version is available at the moment. At the moment the > only one I know of is KDE is half implemented in EPEL Playground and > will be reimplemented as a module when EPEL gains the ability to do > modules. At that point interested people can also do the work to make > Mate/Cinnamon/etc available.As of now, I have a working MATE DM on CentOS 8. It's a hack though, I used Fedora repositories. But that means compiling MATE in EPEL should be straightforward, just recompile Fedora 28 packages. I used Fedora 28 repo file and Fedora 28 GPG keys (links are bellow), unpacked then to proper directory and in Fedora repo files I changed "$releasever" to "28". I also installed yum-plugin-priorities and in all CentOS repo's added "priority=1" and in all Fedora repos added "priority=2". Then I ran following commands (something like this, I experimented some): yum install python2-six yum install mate* -x mate*devel* -x mate-menu yum groupinstall "MATE" --skip-broken yum groupinstall "MATE Desktop" --skip-broken echo "exec /usr/bin/mate-session" >> ~/.xinitrc reboot and then selected MATE in login screen. Links to rpm's: https://ftp-stud.hs-esslingen.de/pub/Mirrors/archive.fedoraproject.org/fedora/linux/releases/28/Everything/x86_64/os/Packages/f/fedora-repos-28-1.noarch.rpm and https://ftp-stud.hs-esslingen.de/pub/Mirrors/archive.fedoraproject.org/fedora/linux/releases/28/Everything/x86_64/os/Packages/f/fedora-gpg-keys-28-1.noarch.rpm List of installed packages from Fedora 28: https://pastebin.com/VXL03Uqj> > > > -- > Stephen J Smoogen. > _______________________________________________ > CentOS mailing list > CentOS at centos.org > https://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos >-- Ljubomir Ljubojevic (Love is in the Air) PL Computers Serbia, Europe StarOS, Mikrotik and CentOS/RHEL/Linux consultant
On 9/24/19 2:41 PM, Frank Cox wrote:> Without wanting to sound too pushy, I'm wondering if there is any update on the status of Mate now that Centos 8 has been released? > > I would love to jump on C8 and start playing with it, but the lack of Mate is kind of a showstopper for me at the moment. >Is gnome3 really that bad :D I decided to just bite the bullet and shift to real gnome3 (and not the classic) about 4 years ago. It waas different and took some time to learn .. BUT .. I can do everything I need to do now. I like both mate and cinnamon .. so I am not knocking either one. I just think people might be well server switching to a 'supported' desktop in the longer run. Again .. don't get me wrong .. it's open source, so do what makes you happy :D -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 198 bytes Desc: OpenPGP digital signature URL: <http://lists.centos.org/pipermail/centos/attachments/20191017/343f5a2a/attachment-0002.sig>
On Thu, Oct 17, 2019 at 09:08:28AM -0500, Johnny Hughes wrote:> On 9/24/19 2:41 PM, Frank Cox wrote: > > Without wanting to sound too pushy, I'm wondering if there is any update on the status of Mate now that Centos 8 has been released? > > > > I would love to jump on C8 and start playing with it, but the lack of Mate is kind of a showstopper for me at the moment. > > > > Is gnome3 really that bad :D > > I decided to just bite the bullet and shift to real gnome3 (and not the > classic) about 4 years ago. It waas different and took some time to > learn .. BUT .. I can do everything I need to do now. > > I like both mate and cinnamon .. so I am not knocking either one. I just > think people might be well server switching to a 'supported' desktop in > the longer run. > > Again .. don't get me wrong .. it's open source, so do what makes you > happy :D >Johnny, I'm sure it can be learned, apparently lots of people have done so and are now happy(for some values of happy) with it. That is just something I don't feel like doing. I'm not against change, but the changes in Gnome 3 seemed to me to be needlessly adding pain and difficulty to what had been a perfectly usable desktop. Every time I install a new CentOS I grit my teeth at having to remember/figure out enough of it to get me thru to the point where I can use a friendly UI. Yes, I should stop being a luddite and learn it. but, y'know, I just can't bring myself to deal with the pain. As a geezer, I guess I'm kinda set in my ways. :) Just to get the Mate installed on C8 (as was posted here recently where/how to do it) was more pain that I enjoyed going through. Now, I'm sure there are simple solutions to these issues, but I just don't want to have to stop what I'm doing to google for them... anyway, I had firefox open and wanted a terminal window. couldn't figure out how to set it up so I could see both at the same time. Once I maximized FF I couldn't figure out how to get it to not eat the entire screen--no clicky buttons on the top-right of the window, so I ended up using the left-most item at the top of the window (forget what it is named...) to choose which window I wanted in front. tedious but livable. but now I don't have to do that 'cause Mate works great! And thanks to you, Johnny, and your companions/associates for all the many YEARS of work you've all put in on CentOS. Even though I gripe and complain about Gnome3, I really do appreciate all you've done! Fred -- ---- Fred Smith -- fredex at fcshome.stoneham.ma.us ----------------------------- The Lord is like a strong tower. Those who do what is right can run to him for safety. --------------------------- Proverbs 18:10 (niv) -----------------------------
Le 17/10/2019 ? 16:08, Johnny Hughes a ?crit?:> Is gnome3 really that bad :DThere's an easy way to figure that out. Our local school has been 100 % GNU/Linux since 2010 (when we first installed CentOS 5 on desktops and servers). On the latest count, I have a hundred users there. Over the years, I've tried a variety of desktop environments, from GNOME 2.x on CentOS 5.x and CentOS 6.x to a beefed-up Xfce. Then we tested GNOME 3 on CentOS 7.x, and it was a mild disaster. Next was KDE, and everyone loved it, since most of my users come from a Windows background, and the basic usability is vaguely similar. When Red Hat decided to drop KDE for the subsequent release, I decided to switch the desktop clients to OpenSUSE Leap KDE. The servers are still running CentOS (and will always be running CentOS I guess). I guess everyone's happy now, because no one complains. :o) Cheers, Niki -- Microlinux - Solutions informatiques durables 7, place de l'?glise - 30730 Montpezat Site : https://www.microlinux.fr Mail : info at microlinux.fr T?l. : 04 66 63 10 32 Mob. : 06 51 80 12 12
On 10/17/19 7:08 AM, Johnny Hughes wrote:> On 9/24/19 2:41 PM, Frank Cox wrote: >> Without wanting to sound too pushy, I'm wondering if there is any update on the status of Mate now that Centos 8 has been released? >> >> I would love to jump on C8 and start playing with it, but the lack of Mate is kind of a showstopper for me at the moment. >> > Is gnome3 really that bad :D:) As much as I was tempted to try Mate, I decided using Gnome might be better in the long run. Using Gnome 3 "classic" with a "startx" start which has issues in terms of everything working right as opposed to gdm, but, well, this is what I wanted to do. I just wish Gnome 3.28 was more configurable without a lot of work.> > I decided to just bite the bullet and shift to real gnome3 (and not the > classic) about 4 years ago. It waas different and took some time to > learn .. BUT .. I can do everything I need to do now. > > I like both mate and cinnamon .. so I am not knocking either one. I just > think people might be well server switching to a 'supported' desktop in > the longer run. > > Again .. don't get me wrong .. it's open source, so do what makes you > happy :D > > > _______________________________________________ > CentOS mailing list > CentOS at centos.org > https://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Johnny Hughes <johnny at centos.org> wrote:> Is gnome3 really that bad :DIt's better than Microsoft Bob, I suppose. -- Yves Bellefeuille <yan at storm.ca>
On 10/17/19 4:08 PM, Johnny Hughes wrote:> On 9/24/19 2:41 PM, Frank Cox wrote: >> Without wanting to sound too pushy, I'm wondering if there is any update on the status of Mate now that Centos 8 has been released? >> >> I would love to jump on C8 and start playing with it, but the lack of Mate is kind of a showstopper for me at the moment. >> > > Is gnome3 really that bad :DYes, it is. My main reason is this (it has to do with me starting with Windows 3.1 and those functionalities are in Windows even today I have to use and support at work): 1. All tray icons are visible so I can see if message or mail comes without need to move more then eyeball. 2. I can put icon on a desktop, document or link to app. 3. I can easily see all open apps and swith to them using mouse 4. I can put links to panel in top/bottom of the screen, visible and easily accessible. 5. I want easily visible and accessible multiple workspaces I can switch to. I like separate opened apps several per workspace custered for a specifig (simultanious) job/task, Firefox in one Krusader in another, VM i third, something else in forth...Then I can switch between apps IN THAT workspace, I do not have to choose from dozes of windows (like with Alt+Tab) If Gnome 3 (Classic) can be configured to do such things in one go (chosing a theme "Gnome 2") I would switch to it.> > I decided to just bite the bullet and shift to real gnome3 (and not the > classic) about 4 years ago. It waas different and took some time to > learn .. BUT .. I can do everything I need to do now. > > I like both mate and cinnamon .. so I am not knocking either one. I just > think people might be well server switching to a 'supported' desktop in > the longer run. > > Again .. don't get me wrong .. it's open source, so do what makes you > happy :D > > > _______________________________________________ > CentOS mailing list > CentOS at centos.org > https://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos >-- Ljubomir Ljubojevic (Love is in the Air) PL Computers Serbia, Europe StarOS, Mikrotik and CentOS/RHEL/Linux consultant