Greetings, I thought this was supposed to be a list for educated people to discuss serious development of the ogg vorbis project. In light of that, it is amazing to see the level Mr. Segher Boessenkool drops down to in the last posts. More or less calling people insane and accusing them of being on crack and what not. I didn't want to post this on the list, for there is no reason to promote further flaming, but _someone_ should take action against Mr. Boessenkool; this is rather absurd in my oppinion. -- Sune Foldager DIKU - Department of Computer Science, University of Copenhagen. --- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ Ogg project homepage: http://www.xiph.org/ogg/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'vorbis-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered.
Segher can call people child-murdering sheep-lovers for all I care as long as we get peelable oggs ASAP. ;-) Someone declared on a public forum that he knew all about Segher's motivations and proceded to rubish them. Either Segher let these claims remain unchallenged, spend a good deal of his time working through these claims point-by-point, or make a throwaway response which basically meant "You're talking rubbish but I can't be bothered to argue it with you.". If someone went off telling everyone what they thought I was thinking I'd probably do much the same thing as he did. Now get off his back and let him get on with those peeling oggs. :-) M. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month! http://sbc.yahoo.com --- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ Ogg project homepage: http://www.xiph.org/ogg/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'vorbis-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered.
Segher can call people child-murdering sheep-lovers for all I care as long as we get peelable oggs ASAP. ;-) Someone declared on a public forum that he knew all about Segher's motivations and proceded to rubish them. Either Segher let these claims remain unchallenged, spend a good deal of his time working through these claims point-by-point, or make a throwaway response which basically meant "You're talking rubbish but I can't be bothered to argue it with you.". If someone went off telling everyone what they thought I was thinking I'd probably do much the same thing as he did. Now get off his back and let him get on with those peeling oggs. :-) M. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month! http://sbc.yahoo.com --- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ Ogg project homepage: http://www.xiph.org/ogg/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'vorbis-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered.
Graham Mitchell sent in reply to another post on Friday, July 04, 2003 13:30:>>> Most of the folks on the list don't care about such things... >> Of the people that posted, more people cared than didn't care.GM> Certainly. Such is the nature of the beast.>> I don't think you can honestly speak for the silent majority.GM> You are correct. I am just making an assumption about those GM> who didn't participate in the discussion based on my own experience. My experience matches your assumption GM> Perhaps I'm wrong, and perhaps I'm not. You are not wrong in my case, I will add my $.02 here ( and a little more) I was part of the silent group. (This is directed to those that wish to impose "standard tags") <p> I do not care about "tags." If I cared, I would embed vorbis streams in a NON.ogg format that uses a fixed tagging system. I won't use tags - ever - Even IF the OGG format is officially replaced by a fixed tagging system. I like _my_ comments - done _my_way_. I don't give a rats back-end about anyone else's commenting methods. No one should give a rats back-end about MY comments done MY way either. <p>A summary of one of my wife's psychology texts: [picture of several young children in a fenced park] ...behaviour of juveniles in a limited space clearly identifies the maturity levels attained... ...children that attempt to enforce behaviour controls on the others are quickly alienated... ...children that repeatedly attempt to enforce controls are soon perceived as a threat... ...passive resistance {the use of silence or avoidance} and violence is noted in dealing with threatening individuals.... The "Recommendations" consistently appear as "behaviour control". Since human psychology dictates that behaviour control is a perceived threat, I fully expect to see reactions of resistance (silence) or violence (flame wars anyone?). No matter how noble the reasons, the recommendations proposed - by their very nature - will be actively resisted. To everyone in the USA: have a great long weekend. -Myles Buckley <p><p>--- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ Ogg project homepage: http://www.xiph.org/ogg/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'vorbis-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered.
Sune Foldager wrote:> I thought this was supposed to be a list for educated people to discuss > serious development of the ogg vorbis project. In light of that, it is > amazing to see the level Mr. Segher Boessenkool drops down to in the[...] It seems that you aren't subscribed to this mailing list for years, yet. I tried to argue with Jonathan in reasonable ways and at least I didn't get abused the second time anymore... it's pointless. And it pops up every few months. Same laments over and over again. Despite the very unfriendly tone right from the beginning, the Xiph tagging standard has been extended by the developers with some useful proposals by Jonathan, like the PERFORMER tag and others, but he fails to see that and won't shut up until Xiph officially endorses his standard completely, or adapts it in its entirety. This will not happen, so we have to live with this coming up every now and then, with the same old arguments, stubbornness, etc pp. I've stated my own opinion and arguments over and over again during the last years, and instead of repeating them once again I'll just point to the archives ... :-/ Bashing anyone for being very annoyed about all this is uncalled for, no matter what it looks like. <p>Moritz --- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ Ogg project homepage: http://www.xiph.org/ogg/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'vorbis-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered.
Nathan I. Sharfi (ns) Sent on Saturday, July 05, 2003 14:26: mb>> I like _my_ comments - done _my_way_. I don't give a rats back-end about mb>> anyone else's commenting methods. No one should give a rats back-end about mb>> MY comments done MY way either. mb>> ns>And yet, I'm somewhat curious how you tag your files. You might have a good ns>idea worth adopting--or at least it'd be a decent starting point for a ns>discussion of music tastes. my tags are as follows: oktodelete=0 or oktodelete=1 if my 'sound' partition drops below 5% free, I have a script that runs through my oggs looking for files that are oktodelete (1). If the scrips finds the value=0, or no comment field it keeps it for first pass. If hdd space is still below 5% after the first pass, it starts deleting files without any comment tag set. Once its done, it sends me an email with the status of free space. The only files that I set give oktodelete=0 are the ones I want to keep above all else. (my flacs and .oggs that are garftuned at Q=7.0 or higher are ALWAYS set as oktodelete=0) As you can see it has NO relevance to musical tastes. :) -Myles Buckley --- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ Ogg project homepage: http://www.xiph.org/ogg/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'vorbis-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered.
Benjamin Weste Pearre (bp) Sent on Saturday, July 05, 2003 02:23
mb>> A summary of one of my wife's psychology texts:
-blahblahblah removed
bp> How much of psychology is anything other than identifying
bp> and pigeonholing various behaviours?
As far as I could grok, its all pigeonholing, and fluff too.
bp> What level of maturity is demonstrated by such "name-calling"?
Dunno - it just struck me as funny that is seemeds so relevant.
bp> And, in fact, it must be noted that usually "maturity" is
bp> defined by how the author wishes adults would behave more often,
bp> not how they actually do.
True, it would be nice if adults DID behave better more often, for
example, my children are much better behaved than many of my co-workers.
If I wrote a psychology text, I would most certainly base my observations
and recomendations on the flaws of adults around me.
bp>In other words, flagrant disregard for the scientific method.
Perhaps that's why psychology is a "soft science" - it cannot be
confirmed by the scientific method (as opposed to chemistry for example,
which can be confirmed using the scientific method - it doesn't change
based on point of view - unless your a cold-fusion idiot.)
bp>It's late. I'm just having fun. But it was fun :)
0139hr while typing this reply to your 0223hr post - yep - fun it is.
mb>>No matter how noble the reasons, the recommendations proposed -
mb>>by their very nature - will be actively resisted.
bp>[sounds like you might already agree with what I'm about to say,
bp> but others may not, and I'm replying anyway, so what the hell]
bp>The silence is not the problem. Obviously (at least, I thought it
bp>was obvious), the tags are optional. If you don't want to play
bp>with us, you can go play by yourself. What we object to is certain
bp>people who not only don't want to play with us, but who want to make
bp>sure that we can't play either.
yes, that is it precisely - "play my way or not at all" is how it has
appeared to me, (I cannot speak for the intent, only my interpretation)
hence why it seemed so relevant to the psychology bits I've read.
bp>It's natural for the individual to feel threatened by groups, but
bp>please make sure that the group is out to get you before you try to
bp>kill it. If Jonathan had gone around saying "If you don't use my
bp>tags, I will burn down your fish" then I too would have attacked him.
bp>Anyway, maybe I'll remember to reason this through and write it up
bp>better on the morrow. G'nite all!
don't bother re-writing, It came out just fine at 0223hr, and looks
fine at 0143hr as well.
-Myles
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