Rails - Feb 2007 - Evaluating Web Development Frameworks: Rails and Django

hi y''all,
fyi
i''ve posted the first in a series of blog articles,
Evaluating Web Development Frameworks: Rails and Django
at http://www.vaporbase.com/postings/91
:)




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Rails and Django - Project and Community (part 2/15) has been posted
http://www.vaporbase.com/postings/92


On Feb 25, 1:15 pm, Jonathan Linowes
<lino...-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
wrote:
> hi y''all,
> fyi
> i''ve posted the first in a series of blog articles,
> Evaluating Web Development Frameworks: Rails and Django
> athttp://www.vaporbase.com/postings/91
> :)

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fyi
Current posting discusses Ruby vs Python
    Rails and Django - Programming Language (part 3/15)
    http://www.vaporbase.com/postings/93


The article series starts here:
    Evaluating Web Development Frameworks: Rails and Django
    http://www.vaporbase.com/postings/91


On Feb 27, 12:06 pm, "linoj"
<lino...-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
wrote:
> Rails and Django - Project and Community (part 2/15) has been
postedhttp://www.vaporbase.com/postings/92
>
> On Feb 25, 1:15 pm, Jonathan Linowes
<lino...-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> wrote:
>
> > hi y''all,
> > fyi
> > i''ve posted the first in a series of blog articles,
> > Evaluating Web Development Frameworks: Rails and Django
> > athttp://www.vaporbase.com/postings/91
> > :)

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for anyone following along, the latest post:
Rails and Django - Framework Concept (part 4/15)
http://www.vaporbase.com/postings/94


On Mar 1, 10:09 am, "linoj"
<lino...-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
wrote:
> fyi
> Current posting discusses Ruby vs Python
>     Rails and Django - Programming Language (part 3/15)
>    http://www.vaporbase.com/postings/93
>
> The article series starts here:
>     Evaluating Web Development Frameworks: Rails and Django
>    http://www.vaporbase.com/postings/91
>
> On Feb 27, 12:06 pm, "linoj"
<lino...-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> wrote:
>
> > Rails and Django - Project and Community (part 2/15) has been
postedhttp://www.vaporbase.com/postings/92
>
> > On Feb 25, 1:15 pm, Jonathan Linowes
<lino...-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> wrote:
>
> > > hi y''all,
> > > fyi
> > > i''ve posted the first in a series of blog articles,
> > > Evaluating Web Development Frameworks: Rails and Django
> > > athttp://www.vaporbase.com/postings/91
> > > :)

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On 3/4/07, linoj <linojon-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
wrote:
>
> for anyone following along, the latest post:
> Rails and Django - Framework Concept (part 4/15)
> http://www.vaporbase.com/postings/94
Jumping late here (on vacation), but doesn''t this line:

"Disclaimer: While I come at this with a significant level of
experience, this report is the result of my review without the benefit
of having built a real project with either framework."

kind of torpedo your entire argument? I don''t know enough about Django
beyond the
fact that it is well respected, but without serious experience in
either field I think you
would be doing a disservice to either framework. In fact your
evaluation matrix is too
fine-grained, and quite suspect in many places:

I don''t think that anybody can make an unbiased rating of whether Ruby
is a better
or worse language than Python, yet it''s your first criteria.

By and large rating-by-numbers is dangerous. I tend to prefer
PASS/FAIL and PASS+
to indicate relative superiority. It just hits the nail on the head better.

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Hi, I must agree with Richard in regards to his statements concerning
the evaluation of frameworks without having built anything with them.
Also, I feel that most people on this mailing list is devoted to using
Rails and I''m sure that the same goes for Django on its associated
mailing list.  Thus, I feel that you should think about how to best
evaluate these frameworks.

For example, if I had relatively detail specification for building an
e-commerce site, how does each of these frameworks fair in this
regard?

Now, I''m sure that you may be able to enlist volunteers from both the
Rails and Django camps to assist with implementation and statistics
gathering.  Then you can extend the framework evaluation to others
like ASP.Net (C#), J2EE, Symfony, Zend Framework, and so on.

In short, it seems that it might be a better to evalutate a framework
if you actually use it in the context of a project.

-Conrad

On 3/5/07, Richard Conroy
<richard.conroy-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
wrote:
>
> On 3/4/07, linoj <linojon-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
wrote:
> >
> > for anyone following along, the latest post:
> > Rails and Django - Framework Concept (part 4/15)
> > http://www.vaporbase.com/postings/94
>
> Jumping late here (on vacation), but doesn''t this line:
>
> "Disclaimer: While I come at this with a significant level of
> experience, this report is the result of my review without the benefit
> of having built a real project with either framework."
>
> kind of torpedo your entire argument? I don''t know enough about
Django
> beyond the
> fact that it is well respected, but without serious experience in
> either field I think you
> would be doing a disservice to either framework. In fact your
> evaluation matrix is too
> fine-grained, and quite suspect in many places:
>
> I don''t think that anybody can make an unbiased rating of whether
Ruby
> is a better
> or worse language than Python, yet it''s your first criteria.
>
> By and large rating-by-numbers is dangerous. I tend to prefer
> PASS/FAIL and PASS+
> to indicate relative superiority. It just hits the nail on the head better.
>
> >
>
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On Mar 5, 8:13 pm, "Conrad Taylor"
<conra...-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> wrote:
> In short, it seems that it might be a better to evalutate a framework
> if you actually use it in the context of a project.
NO! So you are saying we should spend 1 month learning rails and 1
month
learning django.. buy all the books .. do some sort of quick sketch of
the
project we want to develop then .. ask questions solve problem and
then
evaluate rails/django..

Hmmm.. Hate to disagree I don''t have that much time..Sorry

1. All the review we will see on the net between the two are biased
one way or
another. Everyone is selling something ..
2. No matter what we say here in the forum Both has its plus and minus
at the end its
a matter of preference and knowledge of python or ruby plays a big
role.

I think linoj''s attempt is a good attempt to find out what he wants to
find out and I for
one would like to know that no matter what his conclusion is.

Cheers

>
> -Conrad
>
> On 3/5/07, Richard Conroy
<richard.con...-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On 3/4/07, linoj
<lino...-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> wrote:
>
> > > for anyone following along, the latest post:
> > > Rails andDjango- Framework Concept (part 4/15)
> > >http://www.vaporbase.com/postings/94
>
> > Jumping late here (on vacation), but doesn''t this line:
>
> > "Disclaimer: While I come at this with a significant level of
> > experience, this report is the result of my review without the benefit
> > of having built a real project with either framework."
>
> > kind of torpedo your entire argument? I don''t know enough
aboutDjango
> > beyond the
> > fact that it is well respected, but without serious experience in
> > either field I think you
> > would be doing a disservice to either framework. In fact your
> > evaluation matrix is too
> > fine-grained, and quite suspect in many places:
>
> > I don''t think that anybody can make an unbiased rating of
whether Ruby
> > is a better
> > or worse language than Python, yet it''s your first criteria.
>
> > By and large rating-by-numbers is dangerous. I tend to prefer
> > PASS/FAIL and PASS+
> > to indicate relative superiority. It just hits the nail on the head
better.

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