Rails - Oct 2005 - Multi languages in rails

hey,

i want my site in more than 1 language, ex english, dutch, frence, german.

how must i accomplish this???

cuz i have always somehting like this

def index                =>> this is with the index.rhtml
//some code
end

and depending on the language the user want an other rhtml must be loaded
like
def index_en  ==>> index_en.rhtml
def index_nl  ==>> index_nl.rhtml
=> put the problem here is the code in the defs are the same :s:s:s

isnt there another way to do this???

Nick Brutyn wrote:
> hey,
> 
> i want my site in more than 1 language, ex english, dutch, frence, german.
> 
> how must i accomplish this???
> 
> cuz i have always somehting like this
> 
> def index                =>> this is with the index.rhtml
> //some code
> end
> 
> and depending on the language the user want an other rhtml must be loaded
> like
> def index_en  ==>> index_en.rhtml
> def index_nl  ==>> index_nl.rhtml
> => put the problem here is the code in the defs are the same :s:s:s
> 
> isnt there another way to do this???
My own "Using Gettext To Translate Your Rails Application" might be of
help: http://manuals.rubyonrails.com/read/chapter/105

Also, you might want to check Multilingual Rails.
http://www.tuxsoft.se/sv/oss/rails/multilingual

Also, there is preliminary support for l10n in Edge Rails, which is nice 
for starters. Lots of important stuff missing though. But good enough 
for 80% of the cases.

Sascha Ebach

hey, thanks for the info, i am pretty new at this.

i dont quite understand this http://manuals.rubyonrails.com/read/chapter/105

do u have a working example of some sort???

thanks in advance

>From: Sascha Ebach
<se-eFwX6J65rk9VioaHkBSlcw02NpfuEekPhC4ANOJQIlc@public.gmane.org>
>Reply-To: rails-1W37MKcQCpIf0INCOvqR/iCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org
>To: rails-1W37MKcQCpIf0INCOvqR/iCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org
>Subject: Re: [Rails] Multi languages in rails
>Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2005 12:49:13 +0100
>
>Nick Brutyn wrote:
>>hey,
>>
>>i want my site in more than 1 language, ex english, dutch, frence,
german.
>>
>>how must i accomplish this???
>>
>>cuz i have always somehting like this
>>
>>def index                =>> this is with the index.rhtml
>>//some code
>>end
>>
>>and depending on the language the user want an other rhtml must be
loaded
>>like
>>def index_en  ==>> index_en.rhtml
>>def index_nl  ==>> index_nl.rhtml
>>=> put the problem here is the code in the defs are the same :s:s:s
>>
>>isnt there another way to do this???
>
>My own "Using Gettext To Translate Your Rails Application" might
be of
>help: http://manuals.rubyonrails.com/read/chapter/105
>
>Also, you might want to check Multilingual Rails.
>http://www.tuxsoft.se/sv/oss/rails/multilingual
>
>Also, there is preliminary support for l10n in Edge Rails, which is nice 
>for starters. Lots of important stuff missing though. But good enough for 
>80% of the cases.
>
>Sascha Ebach
>_______________________________________________
>Rails mailing list
>Rails-1W37MKcQCpIf0INCOvqR/iCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org
>http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails

Hi Nick,
> hey, thanks for the info, i am pretty new at this.
> 
> i dont quite understand this 
> http://manuals.rubyonrails.com/read/chapter/105
> 
> do u have a working example of some sort???
you would have to be more specific about that. The guide is pretty much 
a step-by-step thing. What is it that you don''t understand? A sample
can
be found in the Ruby-Gettext Package. Just have a look at it.

Sascha

On 31-Oct-05, at 3:49 AM, Sascha Ebach wrote:
> Also, there is preliminary support for l10n in Edge Rails, which is 
> nice for starters. Lots of important stuff missing though. But good 
> enough for 80% of the cases.
Where can I read more about this preliminary support?

Thanks,
Peter

Peter Michaux wrote:
> 
> On 31-Oct-05, at 3:49 AM, Sascha Ebach wrote:
> 
>> Also, there is preliminary support for l10n in Edge Rails, which is 
>> nice for starters. Lots of important stuff missing though. But good 
>> enough for 80% of the cases.
> 
> 
> Where can I read more about this preliminary support?
Use the source, Luke.

http://dev.rubyonrails.org/browser/plugins/localization

I subscribe to the commit log, so I am always current with the news.

Sascha

I would like to ask about 
http://dev.rubyonrails.org/browser/plugins/localization plugin. I have 
read documentation but havent found any info on how to change language 
preference per user/request. Default language is stored in Controller but 
how to change it per user?

Thanks for any hint,
David Marko





Sascha Ebach
<se-eFwX6J65rk9VioaHkBSlcw02NpfuEekPhC4ANOJQIlc@public.gmane.org>
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Re: [Rails] Multi languages in rails






Peter Michaux wrote:
> 
> On 31-Oct-05, at 3:49 AM, Sascha Ebach wrote:
> 
>> Also, there is preliminary support for l10n in Edge Rails, which is 
>> nice for starters. Lots of important stuff missing though. But good 
>> enough for 80% of the cases.
> 
> 
> Where can I read more about this preliminary support?
Use the source, Luke.

http://dev.rubyonrails.org/browser/plugins/localization

I subscribe to the commit log, so I am always current with the news.

Sascha
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> My own "Using Gettext To Translate Your Rails Application" might
be of
> help: http://manuals.rubyonrails.com/read/chapter/105
Great for the code part with subpart of text, a pain in the ass for
large pages without code.

You wouldn''t want to use gettext to translate a full book, as much as
you wouldn''t want to use it to translate your pages.

Fabien Penso wrote:
>>My own "Using Gettext To Translate Your Rails Application"
might be of
>>help: http://manuals.rubyonrails.com/read/chapter/105
> 
> 
> Great for the code part with subpart of text, a pain in the ass for
> large pages without code.
> 
> You wouldn''t want to use gettext to translate a full book, as much
as
> you wouldn''t want to use it to translate your pages.
You are absolutely right, and I think this is what I am also saying in 
the manual. For complete pages of text you might want to include 
different templates based on requested language. With a lot of text your 
translation work will most likely be non-automated. Which is a fancy way 
of saying "You will have to do it all be hand".

Sascha Ebach

> For complete pages of text you might want to include
> different templates based on requested language. With a lot of text your
> translation work will most likely be non-automated. Which is a fancy way
> of saying "You will have to do it all be hand".
That''s why I''d like to have it all automated.

I posted ideas on the list without any feedbacks.

We want multilanguages pages, stored in a way than Apache/Multiviews
can handle them (so we still can serve static pages), and we don''t
want to write a single line of code for that purpose.

1. Views files could be named views/action.en.rhtml, views/action.fr.rhtml, etc.

2. You could call urls with domain.com/controller/action.en.html to
force rails to use that specific languages for the views.

3. Rails would choose the language based on the url, then if not
specified to the browser header languages. If nothing has been
supplied, we would use the default language defined in the rails
environment.

I see only benefits of such a way to handle multi languages websites.
I''ll implement it for myself at least.

Fabien Penso wrote:
>>For complete pages of text you might want to include
>>different templates based on requested language. With a lot of text your
>>translation work will most likely be non-automated. Which is a fancy way
>>of saying "You will have to do it all be hand".
> 
> 
> That''s why I''d like to have it all automated.
> 
> I posted ideas on the list without any feedbacks.
> 
> We want multilanguages pages, stored in a way than Apache/Multiviews
> can handle them (so we still can serve static pages), and we don''t
> want to write a single line of code for that purpose.
> 
> 1. Views files could be named views/action.en.rhtml, views/action.fr.rhtml,
etc.
> 
> 2. You could call urls with domain.com/controller/action.en.html to
> force rails to use that specific languages for the views.
> 
> 3. Rails would choose the language based on the url, then if not
> specified to the browser header languages. If nothing has been
> supplied, we would use the default language defined in the rails
> environment.
> 
> I see only benefits of such a way to handle multi languages websites.
> I''ll implement it for myself at least.
This should be fairly simple to do in your controller, maybe a two- or 
three-liner. Also I don''t think it is very wise to rely on 
Apache-specific behaviour when you can just do it in your controller.

Also, you might want to check out Mulitlingual Rails which already does 
something similiar to what you are suggesting.

http://www.tuxsoft.se/sv/oss/rails/multilingual

Sascha

> This should be fairly simple to do in your controller, maybe a two- or
> three-liner. Also I don''t think it is very wise to rely on
> Apache-specific behaviour when you can just do it in your controller.
Yes you do because you want to still be able to use caches_page and
the multi language system to work under your httpd when serving static
pages.
> Also, you might want to check out Mulitlingual Rails which already does
> something similiar to what you are suggesting.
>
> http://www.tuxsoft.se/sv/oss/rails/multilingual
It does a little (finding the right view file) but I don''t think it
handles the serving of different language depending of the language
submit through the browser header.

I''ve read your ideas with interest (I''m in the early stage of
implementing
an i18n and l10n rails site (r7e)). I have to say that I like the Gettext
approach better (only my opinion though). Creating as many pages as
languages in your system is also a pain in the ass and hardly possible when
your site have to handle 50 different languages (it''s not my case but
to
generalize an approach you should also think about these cases).

I''d like much more to have a sort of ''key'' in my page
that would be
automatically translated to the right string depending on the user''s
language. What do you think?

Matthieu Riou.

On 11/2/05, Fabien Penso
<fabienpenso-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
wrote:
>
> > For complete pages of text you might want to include
> > different templates based on requested language. With a lot of text
your
> > translation work will most likely be non-automated. Which is a fancy
way
> > of saying "You will have to do it all be hand".
>
> That''s why I''d like to have it all automated.
>
> I posted ideas on the list without any feedbacks.
>
> We want multilanguages pages, stored in a way than Apache/Multiviews
> can handle them (so we still can serve static pages), and we don''t
> want to write a single line of code for that purpose.
>
> 1. Views files could be named views/action.en.rhtml,
> views/action.fr.rhtml, etc.
>
> 2. You could call urls with
domain.com/controller/action.en.html<http://domain.com/controller/action.en.html>to
> force rails to use that specific languages for the views.
>
> 3. Rails would choose the language based on the url, then if not
> specified to the browser header languages. If nothing has been
> supplied, we would use the default language defined in the rails
> environment.
>
> I see only benefits of such a way to handle multi languages websites.
> I''ll implement it for myself at least.
> _______________________________________________
> Rails mailing list
> Rails-1W37MKcQCpIf0INCOvqR/iCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org
> http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails
>

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On 11/2/05, Matthieu Riou
<matthieu.riou-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
wrote:
> I''ve read your ideas with interest (I''m in the early
stage of implementing
> an i18n and l10n rails site (r7e)). I have to say that I like the Gettext
> approach better (only my opinion though). Creating as many pages as
> languages in your system is also a pain in the ass and hardly possible when
> your site have to handle 50 different languages (it''s not my case
but to
> generalize an approach you should also think about these cases).
>
>  I''d like much more to have a sort of ''key'' in
my page that would be
> automatically translated to the right string depending on the
user''s
> language. What do you think?

Both approach are fine. Gettext is ok for text included in code part
of the site, or short sentences. But if you want to translate that :

http://templeet.org/

which includes lots of text and no code (that''s an example),
it''s
_much_ easier to copy the view file and translate it completly.

On 2-nov-2005, at 8:22, Fabien Penso wrote:
>> This should be fairly simple to do in your controller, maybe a  
>> two- or
>> three-liner. Also I don''t think it is very wise to rely on
>> Apache-specific behaviour when you can just do it in your controller.
>
> Yes you do because you want to still be able to use caches_page and
> the multi language system to work under your httpd when serving static
> pages.
>
>> Also, you might want to check out Mulitlingual Rails which already  
>> does
>> something similiar to what you are suggesting.
>>
>> http://www.tuxsoft.se/sv/oss/rails/multilingual
>
> It does a little (finding the right view file) but I don''t think
it
> handles the serving of different language depending of the language
> submit through the browser header.
It''s not very difficult to implement this yourself.

-- 
Julian "Julik" Tarkhanov

> http://templeet.org/
> 
> which includes lots of text and no code (that''s an example),
it''s
> _much_ easier to copy the view file and translate it completly.
Yes, you are right. I think in the case of templeet.org you might want
to build a translation system around those static pages. I imagine
something like this:

You would fetch your pages with an URL like this:

/page/language/name-of-page-or-id (or the other way around )
for example
/page/en/download
/page/fr/download
...
or
/page/download (defaults to en)
/page/download/en
/page/download/fr

Than create a dynamic rule in your routes.rb.

app/controllers/page.rb:
class Page
   def whatever
     # fetch page of whatever language is passed
   end
end

Sorry for not being more specific. I am a little time pressed today.

Sascha

On 11/2/05, Sascha Ebach
<se-eFwX6J65rk9VioaHkBSlcw02NpfuEekPhC4ANOJQIlc@public.gmane.org>
wrote:
> > http://templeet.org/
(...)
> You would fetch your pages with an URL like this:
>
> /page/language/name-of-page-or-id (or the other way around )
> for example
> /page/en/download
> /page/fr/download
> ...
> or
> /page/download (defaults to en)
> /page/download/en
> /page/download/fr
Sure, I could do it myself. I just mean it should be included by
default into rails because many people will need such a system, and
it''s not very difficult to implement. I guess I''ll do my own.

About your idea. Sure it will work, but then I won''t be able to use
caches_page, still deliver _static_ pages through Apache and have the
language detection working. (apache/multiviews will search for
.en.html .fr.html etc but maybe this could be tuned to search for
page/en/page.html etc).

Fabien Penso wrote:
> Sure, I could do it myself. I just mean it should be included by
> default into rails because many people will need such a system, and
> it''s not very difficult to implement. I guess I''ll do my
own.
I get your sentiment. L10n is just starting to get implemented in Rails 
because it is not of massive importance to the core team. Otherwise we 
would have seen support for it long ago. So, something like this will 
eventually find its way into Rails, we just have to be a little more 
patient. I am guessing before 1.5.
> About your idea. Sure it will work, but then I won''t be able to
use
> caches_page, still deliver _static_ pages through Apache and have the
> language detection working. (apache/multiviews will search for
> .en.html .fr.html etc but maybe this could be tuned to search for
> page/en/page.html etc).
I don''t know enough about Apache multiviews. I would probably try to to
caching in Rails. I wouldn''t want that much logic in the webserver.
This
has bitten me before. What if you decide to upgrade to lighttpd 
tommorow? It will only make it more difficult.

Just me 2c

Sascha

On 11/2/05, Matthieu Riou
<matthieu.riou-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
wrote:
> I''ve read your ideas with interest (I''m in the early
stage of implementing
> an i18n and l10n rails site (r7e)).
What are l10n and r7e?
>  Matthieu Riou.
Sincerely,

Tom Lieber
tom-V0YqjHVuocLQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org
http://AllTom.com/

l10n stands for localization (or localisation depending where you come from)
and r7e was a very bad pun to shorten "rails site". Shame on me :)

Cheers,

Matthieu.

On 11/2/05, Tom Lieber <alltom-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
wrote:
>
> On 11/2/05, Matthieu Riou
<matthieu.riou-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> wrote:
> > I''ve read your ideas with interest (I''m in the early
stage of
> implementing
> > an i18n and l10n rails site (r7e)).
>
> What are l10n and r7e?
>
> > Matthieu Riou.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Tom Lieber
> tom-V0YqjHVuocLQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org
> http://AllTom.com/
> _______________________________________________
> Rails mailing list
> Rails-1W37MKcQCpIf0INCOvqR/iCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org
> http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails
>

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