Hi everyone, What do people think of JBoss Seam? The architect of it admits Ruby on Rails was the catalyst for this new "integration framework that seamlessly ties together the Java presentation layer and the transactional/database layer". Here''s an article about it. http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1759,1861003,00.asp?kc=EWRSS03119TX1K0000594 -Frank
Hi Frank, I''ve ported over ~50% of the app (registration, login, hotel search/view done, bookings missing) to rails in 3 hours on the evening when the TSS article came out. No, I''m far from being a Rails pro. Yeah, I was using the rails book heavily meanwhile. Yeah, it was 3 hours really from the start and I only reused the xhtml templates. Gonna finish it some time.. Kristof Frank Kim wrote:> Hi everyone, > > What do people think of JBoss Seam? The architect of it admits Ruby > on Rails was the catalyst for this new "integration framework that > seamlessly ties together the Java presentation layer and the > transactional/database layer". > > Here''s an article about it. > http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1759,1861003,00.asp?kc=EWRSS03119TX1K0000594 > > -Frank > _______________________________________________ > Rails mailing list > Rails-1W37MKcQCpIf0INCOvqR/iCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org > http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails
I read the JBoss marketing blurb on the Seam page, didn''t mention Ruby at all imagine that! Those guys are so brilliant they thought of this stuff years ago they just weren''t able to do it right then. Personally I think they are scared they''re going to loose potential customers and you know what they should be. On 9/21/05, Kristof Jozsa <dyn-Lj6TOhj6PqOT9ig0jae3mg@public.gmane.org> wrote:> > Hi Frank, > > I''ve ported over ~50% of the app (registration, login, hotel search/view > done, > bookings missing) to rails in 3 hours on the evening when the TSS article > came out. > > No, I''m far from being a Rails pro. Yeah, I was using the rails book > heavily > meanwhile. Yeah, it was 3 hours really from the start and I only reused > the > xhtml templates. > > Gonna finish it some time.. > > Kristof > > Frank Kim wrote: > > Hi everyone, > > > > What do people think of JBoss Seam? The architect of it admits Ruby > > on Rails was the catalyst for this new "integration framework that > > seamlessly ties together the Java presentation layer and the > > transactional/database layer". > > > > Here''s an article about it. > > > http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1759,1861003,00.asp?kc=EWRSS03119TX1K0000594 > > > > -Frank > > _______________________________________________ > > Rails mailing list > > Rails-1W37MKcQCpIf0INCOvqR/iCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org > > http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails > > _______________________________________________ > Rails mailing list > Rails-1W37MKcQCpIf0INCOvqR/iCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org > http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails >_______________________________________________ Rails mailing list Rails-1W37MKcQCpIf0INCOvqR/iCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails
Fleury''s an ass, we have DHH. We win. On 9/22/05, Xavier Toth <txtoth-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> wrote:> I read the JBoss marketing blurb on the Seam page, didn''t mention Ruby at > all imagine that! Those guys are so brilliant they thought of this stuff > years ago they just weren''t able to do it right then. Personally I think > they are scared they''re going to loose potential customers and you know what > they should be. > > On 9/21/05, Kristof Jozsa <dyn-Lj6TOhj6PqOT9ig0jae3mg@public.gmane.org> wrote: > > Hi Frank, > > > > I''ve ported over ~50% of the app (registration, login, hotel search/view > done, > > bookings missing) to rails in 3 hours on the evening when the TSS article > came out. > > > > No, I''m far from being a Rails pro. Yeah, I was using the rails book > heavily > > meanwhile. Yeah, it was 3 hours really from the start and I only reused > the > > xhtml templates. > > > > Gonna finish it some time.. > > > > Kristof > > > > Frank Kim wrote: > > > Hi everyone, > > > > > > What do people think of JBoss Seam? The architect of it admits Ruby > > > on Rails was the catalyst for this new "integration framework that > > > seamlessly ties together the Java presentation layer and the > > > transactional/database layer". > > > > > > Here''s an article about it. > > > > http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1759,1861003,00.asp?kc=EWRSS03119TX1K0000594 > > > > > > -Frank > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Rails mailing list > > > Rails-1W37MKcQCpIf0INCOvqR/iCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org > > > http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Rails mailing list > > Rails-1W37MKcQCpIf0INCOvqR/iCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org > > http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Rails mailing list > Rails-1W37MKcQCpIf0INCOvqR/iCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org > http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails > > >
> > > Frank Kim wrote: > > > > Hi everyone, > > > > > > > > What do people think of JBoss Seam? The architect of it admits Ruby > > > > on Rails was the catalyst for this new "integration framework that > > > > seamlessly ties together the Java presentation layer and the > > > > transactional/database layer". > > > > > > > > Here''s an article about it. > > > > > > http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1759,1861003,00.asp?kc=EWRSS03119TX1K0000594"Fleury said that while he does not wish to make a comparison with the productivity-focused Ruby on Rails (RoR, pronounced "roar")" Does anyone actually call it ''roar''? -- rick http://techno-weenie.net
> "Fleury said that while he does not wish to make a comparison with the > productivity-focused Ruby on Rails (RoR, pronounced "roar")" > > Does anyone actually call it ''roar''?I usually just say ''rails'' if I''m looking to shorten it.
I can''t remember ever hearing ''roar'' refering to Ruby on Rails. I''ve obviously written RoR, but somehow I''ve always read (and vocalized) it as Rails or even Ruby on Rails ;) maybe i''ll start calling it "roar" when they start calling theirs'' "scream". cheers, Francois>"Fleury said that while he does not wish to make a comparison with the >productivity-focused Ruby on Rails (RoR, pronounced "roar")" > >Does anyone actually call it ''roar''? > > >-- >rick >http://techno-weenie.net >_______________________________________________ >Rails mailing list >Rails-1W37MKcQCpIf0INCOvqR/iCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org >http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails > > >
Why hasn''t Indonesia sued Sun for trademark infringement? <ducking> Rick Olson wrote:>Does anyone actually call it ''roar''? > >-- M. Edward (Ed) Borasky http://www.borasky-research.net/ http://borasky-research.blogspot.com/ http://pdxneurosemantics.com http://pdx-sales-coach.com http://algocompsynth.com
On Sep 22, 2005, at 10:10 AM, Francois Paul wrote:> I can''t remember ever hearing ''roar'' refering to Ruby on Rails.I keep seeing ''We develop, hear us RoR...''. adam
RoR (pronounced "R" "o" "R") On 9/22/05, M. Edward (Ed) Borasky <znmeb-2WxwdZd67h7R7s880joybQ@public.gmane.org> wrote:> > Why hasn''t Indonesia sued Sun for trademark infringement? > > <ducking> > > > > Rick Olson wrote: > > >Does anyone actually call it ''roar''? > > > > > -- > M. Edward (Ed) Borasky > > http://www.borasky-research.net/ > http://borasky-research.blogspot.com/ > > http://pdxneurosemantics.com > http://pdx-sales-coach.com > http://algocompsynth.com > > _______________________________________________ > Rails mailing list > Rails-1W37MKcQCpIf0INCOvqR/iCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org > http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails >_______________________________________________ Rails mailing list Rails-1W37MKcQCpIf0INCOvqR/iCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails
I don''t know why they just can''t say "That''s a good idea and we''re going to copy it." On 9/22/05, Josh Charles <josh.charles-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> wrote:> > > "Fleury said that while he does not wish to make a comparison with the > > productivity-focused Ruby on Rails (RoR, pronounced "roar")" > > > > Does anyone actually call it ''roar''? > > I usually just say ''rails'' if I''m looking to shorten it. > _______________________________________________ > Rails mailing list > Rails-1W37MKcQCpIf0INCOvqR/iCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org > http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails >_______________________________________________ Rails mailing list Rails-1W37MKcQCpIf0INCOvqR/iCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails
This is just getting silly. Gavin has been all over the message boards tipping his hat to RoR as the inspiration for Seam. Let''s not get all pissy. To me, Seam is more of an attempt to make web development as easy as, say, Delphi, where your JSF components and preserved application state -- you deal with Properties, Methods and Events, not requests and responses. Rails makes web development way easier, but I don''t see a huge similarity with it and Seam. There was actually a product in the Delphi world that let you write your web app as a Delphi app, and then it magically deployed as a web program. Perservation of state and use of PME was just automatically there -- an actual copy of the program was running on the web server and transmitting state, etc., transparently over the wire. That is the kind of thing we need more of. Even RoR is still, IMHO, still too ''webbish.'' Mike Pence
> > This is just getting silly. Gavin has been all over the message boards > tipping his hat to RoR as the inspiration for Seam. Let''s not get all > pissy. > > To me, Seam is more of an attempt to make web development as easy as, > say, Delphi, where your JSF components and preserved application state > -- you deal with Properties, Methods and Events, not requests and > responses. Rails makes web development way easier, but I don''t see a > huge similarity with it and Seam. > > There was actually a product in the Delphi world that let you write > your web app as a Delphi app, and then it magically deployed as a web > program. Perservation of state and use of PME was just automatically > there -- an actual copy of the program was running on the web server > and transmitting state, etc., transparently over the wire. That is the > kind of thing we need more of. Even RoR is still, IMHO, still too > ''webbish.'' >I agree with that kind of talking. I''m doing C++, .Net, Java, and Ruby (and xxx), just picking the right tool for the job. I''d love to see this list stay full of good spirit, rather than FUD or zealotry or things such as my language is better than your language (one of the things I dislike most). I really hope we will manage to do this. Thibaut _______________________________________________ Rails mailing list Rails-1W37MKcQCpIf0INCOvqR/iCwEArCW2h5@public.gmane.org http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails
Do you mean like borges (http://borges.rubyforge.org/) or the other seaside clones? Mike Pence wrote:>There was actually a product in the Delphi world that let you write >your web app as a Delphi app, and then it magically deployed as a web >program. Perservation of state and use of PME was just automatically >there -- an actual copy of the program was running on the web server >and transmitting state, etc., transparently over the wire. That is the >kind of thing we need more of. Even RoR is still, IMHO, still too >''webbish.'' > > >
Dude -- there is a Ruby port of Seaside?! Sweet! Thanks for the pointer.
> This is just getting silly. Gavin has been all over the message boards > tipping his hat to RoR as the inspiration for Seam. Let''s not get all > pissy. > > To me, Seam is more of an attempt to make web development as easy as, > say, Delphi, where your JSF components and preserved application state > -- you deal with Properties, Methods and Events, not requests and > responses. Rails makes web development way easier, but I don''t see a > huge similarity with it and Seam. > > There was actually a product in the Delphi world that let you write > your web app as a Delphi app, and then it magically deployed as a > web > program. Perservation of state and use of PME was just automatically > there -- an actual copy of the program was running on the web server > and transmitting state, etc., transparently over the wire. That is the > kind of thing we need more of. Even RoR is still, IMHO, still too > ''webbish.'' > >This is actually a pretty cool set of technologies working together (Seam), I got it and installed/deployed the demo app and ran through the code. My only problems with it are JBoss-marketing-speak related. The technical foundation is rather tight, the nonsense speak is annoying ("subversion of control", "roar" etc). For me in particular this appeared at just the right moment as we currently have a large project where the customer wants JSF (which generally sickens me), and I was trying to find a decent example of JSF which didn''t actually look like way too much effort, Seam really fits the bill here. It''s also nice to see annotations being used effectively, and for the first time EJB doesn''t look like a complete waste of everyone''s time (POJO + @Entity, why did it take so long, and why did we have to have 3 interfaces before?). Still there''s a problem with too much verbose xml, but it''s less than a ''traditional'' Java + framework + JSF app. And to think I only found out about Seam by reading the rails mailing list - serendipity hey? Kev