To everyone who spends time in #asterisk or #asterisk-bugs or basically anything with #asterisk in its name, I want to implore you to please treat new users with respect, and act as good representatives of the Asterisk community. Recently I have had more reports of new users being severely turned off of the project in general due to the comments, reactions and attitudes of a few members of the asterisk channels. The success of the Asterisk project depends upon users and developers, and remember that every one of you, even the most experienced Asterisk users were at one point a newbie and needed some hand holding from someone. Finally, I would also ask that the #asterisk channel in particular please stay as focused on Asterisk related topics as possible. Thanks! Mark
Mark Spencer wrote:> To everyone who spends time in #asterisk or #asterisk-bugs or basically > anything with #asterisk in its name, I want to implore you to please > treat new users with respect, and act as good representatives of the > Asterisk community. Recently I have had more reports of new users being > severely turned off of the project in general due to the comments, > reactions and attitudes of a few members of the asterisk channels.> > The success of the Asterisk project depends upon users and developers, > and remember that every one of you, even the most experienced Asterisk > users were at one point a newbie and needed some hand holding from >someone. Ok, then someone has to step up and make absolutely sure Asterisk has valid up-to-date documentation that newbies know how to find. Then the link(s) to that documentation should always show up in the topic of said IRC channels. In my book, respect is earned. They can earn respect by asking informed questions, but if the documentation is incorrect, what's the point? Jeremy McNamara
<SOAPBOX> Thank you, Jay. As the object of Jeremy's "lazy ass" response to that very question, I couldn't agree more. (Search the archives if you're not sure what I'm referring to.) I will not be giving Nufone any business due to his attitude. I myself am relatively new to Asterisk (using it about 4 months now), and occasionally I have "stupid" questions as well. Sometimes the answers were right in front of my face and I failed to find them. Fine. I'll admit it. But we are here supposedly as a community to promote and proliferate the *EXCELLENT* product called Asterisk. If we don't work together as a community, give support where it's needed, and handhold where we must, I'm afraid we can expect this project to go the way of so many other open source endeavors--to the bit bucket. I hope others share my opinions--that we should encourage questions, even those that seem obvious, or those whose answers could have been found in the wiki, for it only strengthens the community and furthers the success of Asterisk. </SOAPBOX> asterisk-users-admin@lists.digium.com wrote:> I think Mark's post dealt with attitude rather than information. For > example, if someone looked at the old nufone site and, unable to find > rate anywhere, sent a support request, you had three options: > > 1. Reply with information, such as "Xc/min to US48" > 2. Don't reply > 3. Reply with a fairly useless "Look harder" > > The first reply would have been ideal. The second option > wouldn't have > been good, but still better than the third option... but that was the > one you chose. No hard feelings (just don't count on getting me as a > customer) -- but my point is that if the questions bother you so much, > you have the choice not to answer them, rather than to > frustrate people > and turn them off to asterisk. By not answering questions you don't > want to answer, you'll save yourself a lot of time. > > I do agree with you on one point though: Respect IS earned. > You haven't > earned mine, but I would think couldn't care less about that. > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Jeremy McNamara [mailto:jj@nufone.net] >> Sent: Monday, July 26, 2004 4:52 PM >> To: asterisk-users@lists.digium.com >> Subject: Re: [Asterisk-Users] IRC Etiquette >> >> Ok, then someone has to step up and make absolutely sure Asterisk has >> valid up-to-date documentation that newbies know how to find. >> Then the >> link(s) to that documentation should always show up in the >> topic of said >> IRC channels. >> >> In my book, respect is earned. They can earn respect by >> asking informed >> questions, but if the documentation is incorrect, what's the point? >> >> Jeremy McNamara > > _______________________________________________ > Asterisk-Users mailing list > Asterisk-Users@lists.digium.com > http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users > To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit: > http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
> > 3. Reply with a fairly useless "Look harder"As a new list member, I'm going to burn a few bridges here, but I don't really care. I entered this list without an opinion on whether it is worthwhile to be here, and here's my observation: there's a problem here, and that's for certain. I've been subscribed to this list for less than a day, and I've already seen more than one post that talks down to people. None of us knows it *all*, and you people that write condescending replies have issues. What's the matter? Don't get enough respect at home so you have to try and demand it from people that are *simply asking for assitance*? If you don't like the question, the answer is obvious: don't answer it. Good or bad documentation is irrelevant. And before some of you start trying to bash me too, keep this in mind: I have well over 10 years of data networking experience with major installations (Pentagon, and other, 10,000 drop plus organizations), as well as what can easily be considered expert, near-expert or, at a minimum, advanced level skills with more than one operating system, including Linux, plus telephony experience (ala NEC). And I can easily see how some questions may have answers in the documentation, but that doesn't mean that they make sense to everyone. So here's a suggestion: chuck the attitude and help where you want, and keep quiet when you don't want to assist. Nobody's forcing anyone to do anything here. Talking down to people just makes you look like an ass, and does, in fact, turn others off not only from what is an *excellent* application, but from the community itself and that serves NOBODY. -Mark
Joseph Finley wrote:> Maybe someone can run a FAQ Bot in the channel > as other channels do. As soon as you join, the > Bot /msg's you a brief list of commands & > instructions on how to ask for help or > resourced to look for.Well, maybe you haven't been around for long enough to remember it, but we did have at least two different bots in #asterisk. It was fun for a while but in the end people got bored and annoyed and the bots were removed. I spent quite a bit of time feeding one of the bots with the sort of info you'd return to a newbie asking a FAQ, roughly 100 entries or so. Back then we didn't have the Wiki yet. In the end all that info went down with the removal of the bot. Today, with the Wiki in place, the time working on a bot would almost certainly better be spent updating the Wiki. rgds benjk -- Sunrise Telephone Systems Ltd 9F Shibuya Daikyo Bldg., 1-13-5 Shibuya, Shibuya-ku, Tokyo, Japan __________________________________________________ GANBARE! NIPPON! Yahoo! JAPAN?JOC OFFICIAL INTERNET PORTAL SITE http://mail.ganbare-nippon.yahoo.co.jp/