Rails spinoffs - Nov 2006 - Why Struts2 use dojo instead of Scriptaculous?

Hi,
I''m using prototype/Scriptaculous in my open source project
JSControlsTags
http://jscontrolstags.sourceforge.net/

I''m Struts user and in the new version Struts2, the framework integrate
AJAX
with dojo
and not with Prototype/Scriptaculous. I asked in the Struts forum, why
Struts2 integrate
by default dojo and not scriptaculous.

Here Struts answer :

------------------------

Prototype modifies some intrinsic Javascript objects.  Arrays for example
have some additional methods, among other things.  Some of this can
conceivably (and in practice sometimes) break other code that depends on
those intrinsic objects working a certain way.  Especially in a portlet
environment, where you aren''t in complete control of the full page,
this
can lead to some very unexpected consequences... it would really suck to
create a portlet that your company gives to its clients that you''ve
tested
every which way you can and found it to work, then find it breaks in your
clients'' portals because they have some portlet you don''t and
which
doesn''t play nice with these changes Prototype makes.

Another problem with Prototype is that it isn''t properly (or at least
fully) namespaced... for example, Prototype defines a Field and Form
object in global scope (well, it DID... I haven''t looked to see if
recent
versions may have corrected this).  Especially these two examples, which
are clearly pretty common names that other developers may choose as well,
can easily lead to conflicts.  Again, in a portal environment, where you
aren''t developing a complete page and therefore can''t be sure
what might
be present on the page at any given time, you can run into some big
problems because of this.

I don''t think anyone is saying Prototype is inherently bad... if you
are
writing a typical webapp where you are in control of the entire page, you
can quite easily work around these issues, or never run into them in the
first place, and be perfectly happy with Prototype, and to be sure, many
people are (as well as scriptaculous, and others that use Prototype).  In
a portal environment though, the rules of the game are quite different,
and Prototype can lead to issues because of these two points.

------------------------

I don''t know what I must answer to Struts forum to use scriptaculous.
I find that sriptaculous have a lot of effects (drag/drop) and widget (like
tafeltree) more pleasant than dojo.
But if there is not solutions with portlet environnment, I should use dojo,
and I find it''s shame.

Thank you for your answer.

Regards Angelo


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On 11/5/06, Angelo zerr
<angelo.zerr-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> wrote:
> > Again, in a portal environment, where you
> > aren''t developing a complete page and therefore
can''t be sure what might
> > be present on the page at any given time, you can run into some big
> > problems because of this.
This is very true.
> I don''t know what I must answer to Struts forum to use
scriptaculous.
They have compelling reason to use Dojo, and given their environment,
it is a good decision, IMHO. Prototype is not made for this kind of
usage.

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Thank you Martin for your answer.
I find Prototype very good, but it''s really shame that it cannot be
used
into portlet environnment.
I will study dojo to see, if it''s easy for me to migrate my
JSControlsTags
widget Scriptaculous into dojo.

Thank again.

regards Angelo

2006/11/5, Martin Bialasinski
<klingeling-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>:
>
>
> On 11/5/06, Angelo zerr
<angelo.zerr-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> wrote:
>
> > > Again, in a portal environment, where you
> > > aren''t developing a complete page and therefore
can''t be sure what
> might
> > > be present on the page at any given time, you can run into some
big
> > > problems because of this.
>
> This is very true.
>
> > I don''t know what I must answer to Struts forum to use
scriptaculous.
>
> They have compelling reason to use Dojo, and given their environment,
> it is a good decision, IMHO. Prototype is not made for this kind of
> usage.
>
> >
>

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> In a portal environment though, the rules of the game are quite different,
> and Prototype can lead to issues because of these two points.
I don''t agree with that. Yes prototype didn''t use scope for
it''s
objects BUT in any generic portal solution you must make choice of ONE
main javascript library. Why ? because If each portlet includes it''s
own libraries the portal will be a big mess with many code executing
and initialising many stuff.

So yes in theory that''s true and that''s a good reason. But in
real
life you have to pay attention to portlets in your portal if you don''t
want to have a slow and messy portal.
So you should not use different kind of "main" librairies.

Now Prototype + Scriptaculous or Dojo thats a good question ...





On 11/5/06, Angelo zerr
<angelo.zerr-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
wrote:
> Thank you Martin for your answer.
> I find Prototype very good, but it''s really shame that it cannot
be used
> into portlet environnment.
> I will study dojo to see, if it''s easy for me to migrate my
JSControlsTags
> widget Scriptaculous into dojo.
>
> Thank again.
>
> regards Angelo
>
> 2006/11/5, Martin Bialasinski
<klingeling-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>:
> >
> > On 11/5/06, Angelo zerr
<angelo.zerr-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> wrote:
> >
> > > > Again, in a portal environment, where you
> > > > aren''t developing a complete page and therefore
can''t be sure what
> might
> > > > be present on the page at any given time, you can run into
some big
> > > > problems because of this.
> >
> > This is very true.
> >
> > > I don''t know what I must answer to Struts forum to use
scriptaculous.
> >
> > They have compelling reason to use Dojo, and given their environment,
> > it is a good decision, IMHO. Prototype is not made for this kind of
> > usage.
> >
> >
> > > >
> >
>

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Am 05.11.2006 um 10:19 schrieb Angelo zerr:
> Especially in a portlet environment, where you aren''t in complete
> control of the full page, this can lead to some very unexpected  
> consequences...
Basically it boils down to the overall approach on developing web  
apps, that is a component-based approach or a custom code thing.  
Prototype, script.aculo.us (and Rails of course) are heavily  
optimized towards developer productivitiy and happyness when doing  
custom stuff.

To sum it up, one could say, "we need less time implementing custom  
code with these frameworks, than other people spend on configuring  
their components". Of course that might not always be true, but
we''re
trying hard to achieve that, and I think we''re successful with this. ;)

Best,
Thomas

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