ogg dev - Dec 2004 - streaming versus editing

On Thu, 25 Nov 2004 10:25:43 -0800, Ralph Giles <giles@xiph.org>
wrote:
> I think it would be better to say which formats are technically
> superiour for streaming (ogg and mpeg program streams) or
> editing (quicktime/matroska) or dead/obsolete (AVI, MCF?),
If video is recorded and saved in ogg/theora container/format, could it be
converted into matroska/theora container/format without loss of quality for
the purpose of editing, and then converted back into ogg/theora
container/format without loss of quality for streaming?  Would the advantage
that the matroska container has in editing make it worth the effort to do the
conversion?
John

On Wed, Dec 01, 2004 at 01:15:57PM -0600, John Kintree
wrote:
> On Thu, 25 Nov 2004 10:25:43 -0800, Ralph Giles <giles@xiph.org>
wrote:
> > I think it would be better to say which formats are technically
> > superiour for streaming (ogg and mpeg program streams) or
> > editing (quicktime/matroska) or dead/obsolete (AVI, MCF?),
> 
> If video is recorded and saved in ogg/theora container/format, could it be
> converted into matroska/theora container/format without loss of quality for
> the purpose of editing, and then converted back into ogg/theora
> container/format without loss of quality for streaming?  Would the
advantage
> that the matroska container has in editing make it worth the effort to do
the
> conversion?
LOL

Ok lets be perfectly clear here.

You can do everything with Ogg as you can with Matroska.  It's just done 
differently.  If you want to do lossless editing on the frame level, 
well, you need another codec for that.

We're not talking about the ability to edit.  We're talking about the 
container format's ability to store information about how to play 
content in an "edited way".  One could argue that such information 
belongs in an "effects" codec, rather than in the container itself.

-- 

"The question is no longer between violence and non-violence;
 It is between non-violence and non-existence." - Martin Luther King, Jr

On Wed, Dec 01, 2004 at 11:33:08AM -0800, Arc Riley wrote:
> > If video is recorded and saved in ogg/theora container/format, could
it be
> > converted into matroska/theora container/format without loss of
quality for
> > the purpose of editing, and then converted back into ogg/theora
> > container/format without loss of quality for streaming?  Would the
advantage
> > that the matroska container has in editing make it worth the effort to
do the
> > conversion?
Depends on what format your editor prefers really. As Arc says, there's 
not reason you can't write an editor that works with Ogg natively.
> We're not talking about the ability to edit.  We're talking about
the
> container format's ability to store information about how to play 
> content in an "edited way".  One could argue that such
information
> belongs in an "effects" codec, rather than in the container
itself.
Or in a separate file altogether. Kino uses SMIL for this, for example.

 -r