> > Hmm. I tried a windows laptop box (kinda slow) and indeed after about > > 30-40 minutes playback starts stuttering and eventually disconnects > > from the icecast server. > > > > Nothing else is running on this box. What gives? Why am I losing about > > 25% of the connections to this error? > > Are you using shout?Let me clarify here with the answer I've given everyone for almost a year now. This error is almost never a bug. It generally means exactly what it says. Your client can't receive data fast enough. It sometimes means the opposite, your client can't handle data this fast. Player have limited buffers. When they get full, they can't store more data. They stop requesting it. Icecast notices they it can't send anymore data, and drops the connection after a period of time. The normal cause is a slow client won't be getting data fast enough. Icecast does the same thing. Now normally you'd think this is the fault of bandwidth. That has something to do with it. In icecast the datarate of the stream is controlled by the source client. If it sends data too slow, clients won't get enough data, and things will sound weird. If it sends data too fast, it will fill up the buffer and missing audio will result. So the two causes are "not enough bandwidth" or "source client has bad timing". Shout has bad timing. That's why I completely rewrote the streaming core in libshout and made the timing pretty damn solid. Ices shouldn't exhibit these problems. Other source clients based on libshout shouldn't exhibit these problems. Liveice doesn't have this problem either, unless your having trouble with encoding too slow. Shoutcast DSP never has this problem for the same reason as liveice. it encodes everything on the fly in realtime, and so there's no need for timing at all. jack. --- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ icecast project homepage: http://www.icecast.org/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'icecast-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered.
On Wed, 4 Apr 2001, John Griffiths wrote:> i've set up an old 486 running debian 2.2r2 using the debian icecast packages (shout doing the streaming).As my sig points out, yes, it is possible. RiR is linux and icecast stripped to the bare necessities.> so far so good, with a bit of fiddling i had a stream that worked fine over the local networkAs I too have seen in practice :/ (I've not yet taken my project to the next level, which is actual deployment for clients on the internet. So far it has only been internal testing. )> remote users are unable to connect.I guess if we knew what your topology was (what kind of local lan, what kind of upstream, etc)> I understand that a better streamer might help. will such a streamer run on such an old machine?See above. Yes. However, be aware there are limitations (such as bandwidth available from the HW).> are there any binaries for such a newer streamer?What version is debian at with their packages? FWIW, RiR is at 1.3.10.> would re-encoding my mp3's to a lower bitrate help? whats a good bitrate for modem users?That's the bigger question, what bit rate are you sending out? Are you downsampling / forcing a smaller bit rate on your mp3's? Note, if you decided to use RiR (for whatever reason), most of those features are not config'd. You'll need to go into ~/tree/etc/icecast.conf and add in the additional values. Icecast.ref in ~ from the blownout tarball is the std icecast.conf file that ships with icecast. Pick and choose what you need out of there. Sean... -- A flute with no holes is not a flute. A donut with no hole is a danish. --Chevy Chase, Caddyshack _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_ www.rimboy.com <-- Your source for the crap you know you need. www.rimboy.com/rimdistro/rimiradio <-- Icecast server on a floppy! (i486+) --- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ icecast project homepage: http://www.icecast.org/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'icecast-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered.
Hi: Ok, a couple of thoughts on the clients being kicked problem. Firstly, icecast waits a certain amount of time for a client's buffer to clear. Well and good, except that the amount of time this takes will depend on the format of the data. For example, an 11khz stream will take longer to clear than a 22khz stream as there is longer audio for the same amount of data. This might be why tests of listening to higher bit rate streams didn't exhibit the same problems. Another idea - since it's taking over half an hour to occur, maybe the counter which keeps track on how long the server is waiting to send more data to the client is not being reset, so it slowly creeps up to being too high. Note that I'm not a C programmer so I haven't looked at any code, just brainsttorming here. Does icecast do any buffering of sources? If so, how much? If not, why not? Geoff. --- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ icecast project homepage: http://www.icecast.org/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'icecast-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered.
Ok here's what I'm hoping to do and I understand if i'm asking too much. I just want to stream a set of mp3 files so that folks on modems can hear them using winamp or (in a perfect world) RealPlayer. i've set up an old 486 running debian 2.2r2 using the debian icecast packages (shout doing the streaming). o far so good, with a bit of fiddling i had a stream that worked fine over the local network remote users are unable to connect. I understand that a better streamer might help. will such a streamer run on such an old machine? are there any binaries for such a newer streamer? would re-encoding my mp3's to a lower bitrate help? whats a good bitrate for modem users? orry about the low quality of my understanding. John --- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ icecast project homepage: http://www.icecast.org/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'icecast-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered.
> I just want to stream a set of mp3 files so that folks on modems can hear them using winamp or (in a perfect world) RealPlayer. > > i've set up an old 486 running debian 2.2r2 using the debian icecast packages (shout doing the streaming). > > so far so good, with a bit of fiddling i had a stream that worked fine over the local network > > remote users are unable to connect.What do you mean? 'Remote users are unable to connect" is a little to vague for us to help you. Do they not get anything, do they get something, but it's awful? jack. --- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ icecast project homepage: http://www.icecast.org/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'icecast-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered.
On Wed, 4 Apr 2001, John Griffiths wrote:> I just want to stream a set of mp3 files so that folks on modems can > hear them using winamp or (in a perfect world) RealPlayer.Should be not much problem.> i've set up an old 486 running debian 2.2r2 using the debian icecast > packages (shout doing the streaming).I would use Ices to do the streaming.> I understand that a better streamer might help. will such a streamer > run on such an old machine?Ices should run fine.> are there any binaries for such a newer streamer?Probably, I don't know debian though...> would re-encoding my mp3's to a lower bitrate help? whats a good > bitrate for modem users?YES. for modem users (56K) a 32kbps stream will work, 40kbps maybe, but not reliable. If you need slower modems (28K) you need to go down to 16kbps, but that will sound real crappy (IMO) unless maybe for talk and not music. Re-encode ahead of time, Ices has a feature so you could reencode on-the-fly but a 486 will not have the power to do that. Hope that helps. Harvey --- >8 ---- List archives: http://www.xiph.org/archives/ icecast project homepage: http://www.icecast.org/ To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to 'icecast-request@xiph.org' containing only the word 'unsubscribe' in the body. No subject is needed. Unsubscribe messages sent to the list will be ignored/filtered.