forgot to also ask about the maildir set up I have:
mail_location = maildir:~/var/mail/%u:LAYOUT=fs
for the following structure:
/var/mail/[user]/Drafts
Inbox
Sent
Spam
Trash
but should be wrong cause when I log in into roundcube I can't see the
stored emails. If I completely skip 'mail_location' then it does show
the mails which are already in!
Thank you
On Wed, Jul 11, 2018 at 11:51 PM, Larry Rosenman <larryrtx at gmail.com>
wrote:> Yep, you (probably) need to configure openSMTPD to listen on 587
>
> (I run exim, so I can't help with that).
>
> --
> Larry Rosenman http://www.lerctr.org/~ler
> Phone: +1 214-642-9640 E-Mail: larryrtx at gmail.com
> US Mail: 5708 Sabbia Drive, Round Rock, TX 78665-2106
>
> ?On 7/11/18, 4:50 PM, "Teno Deuter" <gvgter at
googlemail.com> wrote:
>
> I am using OpenSMTPD. The OpenBSD 6.3 default one.
>
> Also, when telnet to 127.0.0.1 25 I get a response! So must be
> something with 587?
>
> On Wed, Jul 11, 2018 at 11:47 PM, Larry Rosenman <larryrtx at
gmail.com> wrote:
> > What's your neomutt connecting to?
> >
> > For smtp?
> >
> > --
> > Larry Rosenman http://www.lerctr.org/~ler
> > Phone: +1 214-642-9640 E-Mail: larryrtx at gmail.com
> > US Mail: 5708 Sabbia Drive, Round Rock, TX 78665-2106
> >
> > ?On 7/11/18, 4:47 PM, "Teno Deuter" <gvgter at
googlemail.com> wrote:
> >
> > when using neomutt for the same system user, I can send and
receive
> > emails to everywhere
> >
> > Also, when installing roundcube, the test email function did
succeed!
> >
> > So my SMTP server should be fine?
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Jul 11, 2018 at 11:45 PM, Larry Rosenman <larryrtx
at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Your smtp server isn't listening.
> > >
> > > Is it running, and binding to 127.0.0.1?
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Larry Rosenman
http://www.lerctr.org/~ler
> > > Phone: +1 214-642-9640 E-Mail: larryrtx at
gmail.com
> > > US Mail: 5708 Sabbia Drive, Round Rock, TX 78665-2106
> > >
> > > ?On 7/11/18, 4:44 PM, "Teno Deuter" <gvgter
at googlemail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > connection refused! But why?
> > >
> > > On Wed, Jul 11, 2018 at 11:40 PM, Larry Rosenman
<larryrtx at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > What happens if you telnet 127.0.0.1 587?
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Larry Rosenman
http://www.lerctr.org/~ler
> > > > Phone: +1 214-642-9640 E-Mail:
larryrtx at gmail.com
> > > > US Mail: 5708 Sabbia Drive, Round Rock, TX
78665-2106
> > > >
> > > > ?On 7/11/18, 4:39 PM, "Teno Deuter"
<gvgter at googlemail.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > sorry forgot to mention the port in the
roundcube config file!
> > > >
> > > > $config['smtp_port'] = 587;
> > > >
> > > > On Wed, Jul 11, 2018 at 11:36 PM, Larry
Rosenman <larryrtx at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > What mail port are you expecting it
connect to on 127.0.0.1?
> > > > >
> > > > > Here's my config.
> > > > > $ grep -v "^//"
config.inc.php
> > > > > <?php
> > > > >
> > > > > /* Local configuration for Roundcube
Webmail */
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['mime_types'] =
'/usr/local/etc/apache22/mime.types';
> > > > > $config['db_dsnw'] =
'pgsql://roundcube:<elided>@localhost/roundcubemail';
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['default_host'] =
'tls://thebighonker.lerctr.org';
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['imap_timeout'] = 3600;
> > > > > $config['imap_vendor'] =
'dovecot';
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['smtp_server'] =
'tls://thebighonker.lerctr.org';
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['smtp_port'] = 587;
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['smtp_user'] =
'%u';
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['smtp_pass'] =
'%p';
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['support_url'] =
'mailto<elided>';
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['log_dir'] =
'logs/';
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['temp_dir'] =
'temp/';
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['login_lc'] = 0;
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['session_domain'] =
'.<elided>.org';
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['des_key'] =
'<elided>';
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['product_name'] =
'<elided>';
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['http_received_header']
= true;
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['plugins'] =
array('contextmenu','automatic_addressbook','thunderbird_labels','managesieve','jqueryui','attachment_reminder','hide_blockquote','markasjunk','vcard_attachments','enigma');
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['date_formats'] =
array('Y-m-d', 'd-m-Y', 'Y/m/d', 'm/d/Y',
'd/m/Y', 'd.m.Y', 'j.n.Y');
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['mime_param_folding'] =
0;
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['display_next'] =
false;
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['default_font'] =
'';
> > > > >
> > > > >
$config['message_cache_lifetime'] = '10d';
> > > > >
> > > > > $
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > Larry Rosenman
http://www.lerctr.org/~ler
> > > > > Phone: +1 214-642-9640
E-Mail: larryrtx at gmail.com
> > > > > US Mail: 5708 Sabbia Drive, Round Rock,
TX 78665-2106
> > > > >
> > > > > ?On 7/11/18, 4:29 PM, "dovecot on
behalf of Teno Deuter" <dovecot-bounces at dovecot.org on behalf of
gvgter at googlemail.com> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Dear list,
> > > > >
> > > > > in a box with the following setup:
> > > > >
> > > > > openbsd 6.3
> > > > > opensmtpd
> > > > > dovecot 2.2.34
> > > > > roundcubemail 1.3.5
> > > > > httpd web server
> > > > >
> > > > > when a system user is authenticated
via roundcubemail and tries to
> > > > > send an email, the following errors
pops in the roundcube log file:
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Connection refused (61)
> > > > > Failed to connect socket:
Connection refused ()
> > > > >
> > > > > here is my roundcube config file:
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['default_host'] =
'127.0.0.1';
> > > > > $config['smtp_server'] =
'tls://127.0.0.1';
> > > > > $config['smtp_server'] =
'tls://127.0.0.1';
> > > > > $config['smtp_user'] =
'%u';
> > > > > $config['smtp_pass'] =
'%p';
> > > > >
> > > > > and the dovecot config:
> > > > >
> > > > > mail_location =
maildir:~/var/mail/%u:LAYOUT=fs
> > > > > log_path = /var/log/dovecot.log
> > > > > info_log_path =
/var/log/dovecot-info.log
> > > > > ssl = yes
> > > > > ssl_cert = </etc/ssl/server.crt
> > > > > ssl_key = </etc/ssl/server.key
> > > > >
> > > > > the system users emails are in
maildir format and follow the below structure:
> > > > >
> > > > > /var/mail/[user]/Drafts
> > > > > Inbox
> > > > > Sent
> > > > > Spam
> > > > > Trash
> > > > >
> > > > > Thank you for your help
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
What does an ls -lr of /var/mail/<user> look like?
--
Larry Rosenman http://www.lerctr.org/~ler
Phone: +1 214-642-9640 E-Mail: larryrtx at gmail.com
US Mail: 5708 Sabbia Drive, Round Rock, TX 78665-2106
?On 7/11/18, 4:58 PM, "Teno Deuter" <gvgter at googlemail.com>
wrote:
forgot to also ask about the maildir set up I have:
mail_location = maildir:~/var/mail/%u:LAYOUT=fs
for the following structure:
/var/mail/[user]/Drafts
Inbox
Sent
Spam
Trash
but should be wrong cause when I log in into roundcube I can't see the
stored emails. If I completely skip 'mail_location' then it does
show
the mails which are already in!
Thank you
On Wed, Jul 11, 2018 at 11:51 PM, Larry Rosenman <larryrtx at
gmail.com> wrote:
> Yep, you (probably) need to configure openSMTPD to listen on 587
>
> (I run exim, so I can't help with that).
>
> --
> Larry Rosenman http://www.lerctr.org/~ler
> Phone: +1 214-642-9640 E-Mail: larryrtx at gmail.com
> US Mail: 5708 Sabbia Drive, Round Rock, TX 78665-2106
>
> ?On 7/11/18, 4:50 PM, "Teno Deuter" <gvgter at
googlemail.com> wrote:
>
> I am using OpenSMTPD. The OpenBSD 6.3 default one.
>
> Also, when telnet to 127.0.0.1 25 I get a response! So must be
> something with 587?
>
> On Wed, Jul 11, 2018 at 11:47 PM, Larry Rosenman <larryrtx at
gmail.com> wrote:
> > What's your neomutt connecting to?
> >
> > For smtp?
> >
> > --
> > Larry Rosenman http://www.lerctr.org/~ler
> > Phone: +1 214-642-9640 E-Mail: larryrtx at
gmail.com
> > US Mail: 5708 Sabbia Drive, Round Rock, TX 78665-2106
> >
> > ?On 7/11/18, 4:47 PM, "Teno Deuter" <gvgter at
googlemail.com> wrote:
> >
> > when using neomutt for the same system user, I can send
and receive
> > emails to everywhere
> >
> > Also, when installing roundcube, the test email function
did succeed!
> >
> > So my SMTP server should be fine?
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Jul 11, 2018 at 11:45 PM, Larry Rosenman
<larryrtx at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Your smtp server isn't listening.
> > >
> > > Is it running, and binding to 127.0.0.1?
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Larry Rosenman
http://www.lerctr.org/~ler
> > > Phone: +1 214-642-9640 E-Mail: larryrtx
at gmail.com
> > > US Mail: 5708 Sabbia Drive, Round Rock, TX 78665-2106
> > >
> > > ?On 7/11/18, 4:44 PM, "Teno Deuter"
<gvgter at googlemail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > connection refused! But why?
> > >
> > > On Wed, Jul 11, 2018 at 11:40 PM, Larry Rosenman
<larryrtx at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > What happens if you telnet 127.0.0.1 587?
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Larry Rosenman
http://www.lerctr.org/~ler
> > > > Phone: +1 214-642-9640 E-Mail:
larryrtx at gmail.com
> > > > US Mail: 5708 Sabbia Drive, Round Rock, TX
78665-2106
> > > >
> > > > ?On 7/11/18, 4:39 PM, "Teno
Deuter" <gvgter at googlemail.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > sorry forgot to mention the port in the
roundcube config file!
> > > >
> > > > $config['smtp_port'] = 587;
> > > >
> > > > On Wed, Jul 11, 2018 at 11:36 PM, Larry
Rosenman <larryrtx at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > What mail port are you expecting it
connect to on 127.0.0.1?
> > > > >
> > > > > Here's my config.
> > > > > $ grep -v "^//"
config.inc.php
> > > > > <?php
> > > > >
> > > > > /* Local configuration for
Roundcube Webmail */
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['mime_types'] =
'/usr/local/etc/apache22/mime.types';
> > > > > $config['db_dsnw'] =
'pgsql://roundcube:<elided>@localhost/roundcubemail';
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['default_host'] =
'tls://thebighonker.lerctr.org';
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['imap_timeout'] =
3600;
> > > > > $config['imap_vendor'] =
'dovecot';
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['smtp_server'] =
'tls://thebighonker.lerctr.org';
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['smtp_port'] = 587;
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['smtp_user'] =
'%u';
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['smtp_pass'] =
'%p';
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['support_url'] =
'mailto<elided>';
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['log_dir'] =
'logs/';
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['temp_dir'] =
'temp/';
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['login_lc'] = 0;
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['session_domain'] =
'.<elided>.org';
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['des_key'] =
'<elided>';
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['product_name'] =
'<elided>';
> > > > >
> > > > >
$config['http_received_header'] = true;
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['plugins'] =
array('contextmenu','automatic_addressbook','thunderbird_labels','managesieve','jqueryui','attachment_reminder','hide_blockquote','markasjunk','vcard_attachments','enigma');
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['date_formats'] =
array('Y-m-d', 'd-m-Y', 'Y/m/d', 'm/d/Y',
'd/m/Y', 'd.m.Y', 'j.n.Y');
> > > > >
> > > > >
$config['mime_param_folding'] = 0;
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['display_next'] =
false;
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['default_font'] =
'';
> > > > >
> > > > >
$config['message_cache_lifetime'] = '10d';
> > > > >
> > > > > $
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > Larry Rosenman
http://www.lerctr.org/~ler
> > > > > Phone: +1 214-642-9640
E-Mail: larryrtx at gmail.com
> > > > > US Mail: 5708 Sabbia Drive, Round
Rock, TX 78665-2106
> > > > >
> > > > > ?On 7/11/18, 4:29 PM, "dovecot
on behalf of Teno Deuter" <dovecot-bounces at dovecot.org on behalf of
gvgter at googlemail.com> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Dear list,
> > > > >
> > > > > in a box with the following
setup:
> > > > >
> > > > > openbsd 6.3
> > > > > opensmtpd
> > > > > dovecot 2.2.34
> > > > > roundcubemail 1.3.5
> > > > > httpd web server
> > > > >
> > > > > when a system user is
authenticated via roundcubemail and tries to
> > > > > send an email, the following
errors pops in the roundcube log file:
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Connection refused (61)
> > > > > Failed to connect socket:
Connection refused ()
> > > > >
> > > > > here is my roundcube config
file:
> > > > >
> > > > > $config['default_host']
= '127.0.0.1';
> > > > > $config['smtp_server']
= 'tls://127.0.0.1';
> > > > > $config['smtp_server']
= 'tls://127.0.0.1';
> > > > > $config['smtp_user'] =
'%u';
> > > > > $config['smtp_pass'] =
'%p';
> > > > >
> > > > > and the dovecot config:
> > > > >
> > > > > mail_location =
maildir:~/var/mail/%u:LAYOUT=fs
> > > > > log_path = /var/log/dovecot.log
> > > > > info_log_path =
/var/log/dovecot-info.log
> > > > > ssl = yes
> > > > > ssl_cert =
</etc/ssl/server.crt
> > > > > ssl_key =
</etc/ssl/server.key
> > > > >
> > > > > the system users emails are in
maildir format and follow the below structure:
> > > > >
> > > > > /var/mail/[user]/Drafts
> > > > > Inbox
> > > > > Sent
> > > > > Spam
> > > > > Trash
> > > > >
> > > > > Thank you for your help
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
drwxr-xr-x 5 512 Jun 26 21:41 Trash drwxr-xr-x 5 512 Jun 26 21:41 Spam drwxr-xr-x 5 512 Jun 26 21:41 Sent drwx------ 6 512 Jul 7 00:23 Inbox drwxr-xr-x 5 512 Jun 26 21:41 Drafts On Thu, Jul 12, 2018 at 12:00 AM, Larry Rosenman <larryrtx at gmail.com> wrote:> What does an ls -lr of /var/mail/<user> look like? > > > -- > Larry Rosenman http://www.lerctr.org/~ler > Phone: +1 214-642-9640 E-Mail: larryrtx at gmail.com > US Mail: 5708 Sabbia Drive, Round Rock, TX 78665-2106 > > ?On 7/11/18, 4:58 PM, "Teno Deuter" <gvgter at googlemail.com> wrote: > > forgot to also ask about the maildir set up I have: > > mail_location = maildir:~/var/mail/%u:LAYOUT=fs > > for the following structure: > > /var/mail/[user]/Drafts > Inbox > Sent > Spam > Trash > > but should be wrong cause when I log in into roundcube I can't see the > stored emails. If I completely skip 'mail_location' then it does show > the mails which are already in! > > Thank you > > On Wed, Jul 11, 2018 at 11:51 PM, Larry Rosenman <larryrtx at gmail.com> wrote: > > Yep, you (probably) need to configure openSMTPD to listen on 587 > > > > (I run exim, so I can't help with that). > > > > -- > > Larry Rosenman http://www.lerctr.org/~ler > > Phone: +1 214-642-9640 E-Mail: larryrtx at gmail.com > > US Mail: 5708 Sabbia Drive, Round Rock, TX 78665-2106 > > > > ?On 7/11/18, 4:50 PM, "Teno Deuter" <gvgter at googlemail.com> wrote: > > > > I am using OpenSMTPD. The OpenBSD 6.3 default one. > > > > Also, when telnet to 127.0.0.1 25 I get a response! So must be > > something with 587? > > > > On Wed, Jul 11, 2018 at 11:47 PM, Larry Rosenman <larryrtx at gmail.com> wrote: > > > What's your neomutt connecting to? > > > > > > For smtp? > > > > > > -- > > > Larry Rosenman http://www.lerctr.org/~ler > > > Phone: +1 214-642-9640 E-Mail: larryrtx at gmail.com > > > US Mail: 5708 Sabbia Drive, Round Rock, TX 78665-2106 > > > > > > ?On 7/11/18, 4:47 PM, "Teno Deuter" <gvgter at googlemail.com> wrote: > > > > > > when using neomutt for the same system user, I can send and receive > > > emails to everywhere > > > > > > Also, when installing roundcube, the test email function did succeed! > > > > > > So my SMTP server should be fine? > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Jul 11, 2018 at 11:45 PM, Larry Rosenman <larryrtx at gmail.com> wrote: > > > > Your smtp server isn't listening. > > > > > > > > Is it running, and binding to 127.0.0.1? > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > Larry Rosenman http://www.lerctr.org/~ler > > > > Phone: +1 214-642-9640 E-Mail: larryrtx at gmail.com > > > > US Mail: 5708 Sabbia Drive, Round Rock, TX 78665-2106 > > > > > > > > ?On 7/11/18, 4:44 PM, "Teno Deuter" <gvgter at googlemail.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > connection refused! But why? > > > > > > > > On Wed, Jul 11, 2018 at 11:40 PM, Larry Rosenman <larryrtx at gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > What happens if you telnet 127.0.0.1 587? > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > Larry Rosenman http://www.lerctr.org/~ler > > > > > Phone: +1 214-642-9640 E-Mail: larryrtx at gmail.com > > > > > US Mail: 5708 Sabbia Drive, Round Rock, TX 78665-2106 > > > > > > > > > > ?On 7/11/18, 4:39 PM, "Teno Deuter" <gvgter at googlemail.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > sorry forgot to mention the port in the roundcube config file! > > > > > > > > > > $config['smtp_port'] = 587; > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Jul 11, 2018 at 11:36 PM, Larry Rosenman <larryrtx at gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > What mail port are you expecting it connect to on 127.0.0.1? > > > > > > > > > > > > Here's my config. > > > > > > $ grep -v "^//" config.inc.php > > > > > > <?php > > > > > > > > > > > > /* Local configuration for Roundcube Webmail */ > > > > > > > > > > > > $config['mime_types'] = '/usr/local/etc/apache22/mime.types'; > > > > > > $config['db_dsnw'] = 'pgsql://roundcube:<elided>@localhost/roundcubemail'; > > > > > > > > > > > > $config['default_host'] = 'tls://thebighonker.lerctr.org'; > > > > > > > > > > > > $config['imap_timeout'] = 3600; > > > > > > $config['imap_vendor'] = 'dovecot'; > > > > > > > > > > > > $config['smtp_server'] = 'tls://thebighonker.lerctr.org'; > > > > > > > > > > > > $config['smtp_port'] = 587; > > > > > > > > > > > > $config['smtp_user'] = '%u'; > > > > > > > > > > > > $config['smtp_pass'] = '%p'; > > > > > > > > > > > > $config['support_url'] = 'mailto<elided>'; > > > > > > > > > > > > $config['log_dir'] = 'logs/'; > > > > > > > > > > > > $config['temp_dir'] = 'temp/'; > > > > > > > > > > > > $config['login_lc'] = 0; > > > > > > > > > > > > $config['session_domain'] = '.<elided>.org'; > > > > > > > > > > > > $config['des_key'] = '<elided>'; > > > > > > > > > > > > $config['product_name'] = '<elided>'; > > > > > > > > > > > > $config['http_received_header'] = true; > > > > > > > > > > > > $config['plugins'] = array('contextmenu','automatic_addressbook','thunderbird_labels','managesieve','jqueryui','attachment_reminder','hide_blockquote','markasjunk','vcard_attachments','enigma'); > > > > > > > > > > > > $config['date_formats'] = array('Y-m-d', 'd-m-Y', 'Y/m/d', 'm/d/Y', 'd/m/Y', 'd.m.Y', 'j.n.Y'); > > > > > > > > > > > > $config['mime_param_folding'] = 0; > > > > > > > > > > > > $config['display_next'] = false; > > > > > > > > > > > > $config['default_font'] = ''; > > > > > > > > > > > > $config['message_cache_lifetime'] = '10d'; > > > > > > > > > > > > $ > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > Larry Rosenman http://www.lerctr.org/~ler > > > > > > Phone: +1 214-642-9640 E-Mail: larryrtx at gmail.com > > > > > > US Mail: 5708 Sabbia Drive, Round Rock, TX 78665-2106 > > > > > > > > > > > > ?On 7/11/18, 4:29 PM, "dovecot on behalf of Teno Deuter" <dovecot-bounces at dovecot.org on behalf of gvgter at googlemail.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear list, > > > > > > > > > > > > in a box with the following setup: > > > > > > > > > > > > openbsd 6.3 > > > > > > opensmtpd > > > > > > dovecot 2.2.34 > > > > > > roundcubemail 1.3.5 > > > > > > httpd web server > > > > > > > > > > > > when a system user is authenticated via roundcubemail and tries to > > > > > > send an email, the following errors pops in the roundcube log file: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Connection refused (61) > > > > > > Failed to connect socket: Connection refused () > > > > > > > > > > > > here is my roundcube config file: > > > > > > > > > > > > $config['default_host'] = '127.0.0.1'; > > > > > > $config['smtp_server'] = 'tls://127.0.0.1'; > > > > > > $config['smtp_server'] = 'tls://127.0.0.1'; > > > > > > $config['smtp_user'] = '%u'; > > > > > > $config['smtp_pass'] = '%p'; > > > > > > > > > > > > and the dovecot config: > > > > > > > > > > > > mail_location = maildir:~/var/mail/%u:LAYOUT=fs > > > > > > log_path = /var/log/dovecot.log > > > > > > info_log_path = /var/log/dovecot-info.log > > > > > > ssl = yes > > > > > > ssl_cert = </etc/ssl/server.crt > > > > > > ssl_key = </etc/ssl/server.key > > > > > > > > > > > > the system users emails are in maildir format and follow the below structure: > > > > > > > > > > > > /var/mail/[user]/Drafts > > > > > > Inbox > > > > > > Sent > > > > > > Spam > > > > > > Trash > > > > > > > > > > > > Thank you for your help > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >