Hi all, Today I can finally announce that Dovecot Oy company has merged with Open-Xchange AG. This helps us to get more Dovecot developers, support people and so on. Most importantly, eventually it should allow me to get back to doing what I like the most: Designing new and interesting stuff for Dovecot and perfecting the old stuff :) OX is a great match to Dovecot going forward. They also really like open source and share our plans for the future. Nothing big will change as a result of this merger: Dovecot will stay Dovecot with its own name and release schedules. We're not going to force OX and Dovecot to be the same product, other than having a somewhat deeper integration between them. Here are the press release links about it: http://www.dovecot.fi/open-xchange-and-dovecot-announce-merger-to-create-worlds-leading-open-source-messaging-software-provider/ http://www.open-xchange.com/dovecot http://www.open-xchange.com/announcements/18
I find it extremely interesting that no one has commented on the merger of Dovecot Oy and Open-Xchange AG as announced by Timo on the 19th. Is this something that was known a long time ago and I missed? OK checked the on-line archive of the mailing list, no comments there - its not my email set-up - LOL. I am usually emotionally (at least) against of open-source projects loosing their independence to large corporations. Possibly due to bad experiences in the past when OSS were driven from Open to Obscure in the process of trying to make money out of them. I have several examples in mind but I will not give names. At least that is the impression I have which might be entirely wrong since when big companies begin to ask for large sums of money we just have to move away due to the small budget. Anyway this is not to about judging the move. Which I cannot do since I have no knowledge whatsover of the Dovecot enterprise internals and the difficulties that come with managing a leading software product. And, secondly, since I am (my employer ie) a non paying customer!! I was just struck by the fact that no one has commented on it. I wish Dovecot the best in the new environment. Andreas On 19/03/15 12:26, Timo Sirainen wrote:> Hi all, > > Today I can finally announce that Dovecot Oy company has merged with Open-Xchange AG. This helps us to get more Dovecot developers, support people and so on. Most importantly, eventually it should allow me to get back to doing what I like the most: Designing new and interesting stuff for Dovecot and perfecting the old stuff :) OX is a great match to Dovecot going forward. They also really like open source and share our plans for the future. Nothing big will change as a result of this merger: Dovecot will stay Dovecot with its own name and release schedules. We're not going to force OX and Dovecot to be the same product, other than having a somewhat deeper integration between them. > > Here are the press release links about it: > http://www.dovecot.fi/open-xchange-and-dovecot-announce-merger-to-create-worlds-leading-open-source-messaging-software-provider/ > http://www.open-xchange.com/dovecot > http://www.open-xchange.com/announcements/18-- Andreas Kasenides Senior IT Officer Dept. of Computer Science, University of Cyprus Tel: 22892714, Fax: 22892701 (5B4ANK)
I think everyone shares your concerns. But there are no rules that the outcome of this merger must get something bad, so let's see what happens. I hope that it's true what Timo said and that dovecot can evolve and get even better as it is today. Good luck guys! Regards, Adrian. On 23.03.15 15:08, Andreas Kasenides wrote:> I find it extremely interesting that no one has commented on the merger > of Dovecot Oy and Open-Xchange AG as announced by Timo on the 19th. Is > this something that was known a long time ago and I missed? OK checked > the on-line archive of the mailing list, no comments there - its not my > email set-up - LOL. > I am usually emotionally (at least) against of open-source projects > loosing their independence to large corporations. Possibly due to bad > experiences in the past when OSS were driven from Open to Obscure in the > process of trying to make money out of them. I have several examples in > mind but I will not give names. At least that is the impression I have > which might be entirely wrong since when big companies begin to ask for > large sums of money we just have to move away due to the small budget. > Anyway this is not to about judging the move. Which I cannot do since I > have no knowledge whatsover of the Dovecot enterprise internals and the > difficulties that come with managing a leading software product. And, > secondly, since I am (my employer ie) a non paying customer!! > I was just struck by the fact that no one has commented on it. > > I wish Dovecot the best in the new environment. > > Andreas > > On 19/03/15 12:26, Timo Sirainen wrote: >> Hi all, >> >> Today I can finally announce that Dovecot Oy company has merged with >> Open-Xchange AG. This helps us to get more Dovecot developers, support >> people and so on. Most importantly, eventually it should allow me to >> get back to doing what I like the most: Designing new and interesting >> stuff for Dovecot and perfecting the old stuff :) OX is a great match >> to Dovecot going forward. They also really like open source and share >> our plans for the future. Nothing big will change as a result of this >> merger: Dovecot will stay Dovecot with its own name and release >> schedules. We're not going to force OX and Dovecot to be the same >> product, other than having a somewhat deeper integration between them. >> >> Here are the press release links about it: >> http://www.dovecot.fi/open-xchange-and-dovecot-announce-merger-to-create-worlds-leading-open-source-messaging-software-provider/ >> >> http://www.open-xchange.com/dovecot >> http://www.open-xchange.com/announcements/18 > >
Am 23.03.2015 15:08 schrieb Andreas Kasenides:> I am usually emotionally (at least) against of open-source projects > loosing their independence to large corporations. Possibly due to bad > experiences in the past when OSS were driven from Open to Obscure in > the process of trying to make money out of them.2ct from me-- I put it this way: if dovecot would have been a "pure" OSS before getting bought OAX, then response might would've been different. But Dovecot OY is "making money out of it" for how long now? Five years - and that's not only "selling support". Nginx went the same path - I'd say even more aggressive, given feature set differences. Timo and his team has shown that they care about their OSS tree, e.g. do you really think all that replication and director "stuff" came from pure boredom? Show me OSS for cyrus, courier, .. on that level of "enterprisey". Timo clearly wrote that this company merge is about putting together the PAID services efforts (think hotlines and such) and not mangling OX and dovecot into some "blob" (well, might happen one day in the future, but you would never know about *any* OSS unless you find a crystal globe telling you). If my customers are reluctant to move IMAP servers to dovecot, because for now they have/had OX+whatever.. well, what better argument could one have then: Did you know that they are one company and have shared support now? .. Just thinkin' and sayin'.
On 3/19/2015 3:26 AM, Timo Sirainen wrote:> Hi all, > > Today I can finally announce that Dovecot Oy company has merged with Open-Xchange AG. This helps us to get more Dovecot developers, support people and so on. Most importantly, eventually it should allow me to get back to doing what I like the most: Designing new and interesting stuff for Dovecot and perfecting the old stuff :) OX is a great match to Dovecot going forward. They also really like open source and share our plans for the future. Nothing big will change as a result of this merger: Dovecot will stay Dovecot with its own name and release schedules. We're not going to force OX and Dovecot to be the same product, other than having a somewhat deeper integration between them. >My initial impression is...sounds great! Then, after further thought, and watching the flame war, I've changed my mind to...sounds great! I'm operating under the assumption that you are continuing to be in charge of Dovecot and will choose what and how to implement changes and fixes. I'm further operating under the assumption that you may choose to have certain features, appropriate for larger installations, that you will want to receive compensation for from your users. And I'm assuming that by having OX behind you, those initial assumptions remain - Dovecot remains your baby, you will grow it as you see fit - but now you've got some financial backing that allows you more freedom to continue to develop Dovecot for general-purpose use while reasonably having certain features developed to support the paid model. If I'm mistaken then please correct me - but I'm seeing nothing but upside. Certainly for you, and if you were to abandon open source Dovecot today (which I've seen absolutely no indication) you've already provided a tool that has a significant user base and you deserve to be rewarded for it. But based on your previous actions and your original post, and I have no reason not to take you at your word, this sounds like a win/win for Dovecot developers and users. Congratulations! -- Daniel
I hate to have started this, especially the "sister" thread that has dissented into a flame war of what is OSS. Let me say that I believe there is nothing wrong trying to make money on ones efforts. Actually it is a must. How can anyone continue to put efforts into a project when there is no reward? Especially when most of the effort is by a single individual. Secondly there comes a point in time when any project needs help to advance. Any one individual will be unable to manage all the things that need to be done. It will either become a team effort of individuals employed elsewhere or somehow enter the commercial sector in some form. Both of these models have many examples out there and in the mean time maintaining their OSS root and community. What I was mostly worried about was a sudden and rapid commercialization of the project in such a way that it completely disappears from the OSS community. I will give you an extreme example that we had the pleasure to be involved as payed customers and debugging contributors: KnowledgeTree DMS. If you do not know the story you will simply not find it. After years of the community contributing to the project a sudden shift to complete commercialization destroyed the project entirely: ie sourceforge project closed, source code disappeared, mailing lists vanished even the domain name name closed down. If it wasn't for third party storage/downloading sites the project source code would have been practically non-existent. I consider such behavior firstly immoral since a project's success is not only its design but largely also its debugging, mostly done by thousands of unknown helpers writing their experiences and problems in mailing lists. I hope Timo manages well, keeps the community going but also makes a living (or a ton of money ) out of Dovecot. He deserves it. It is not impossible, others have done so successfully. On 25/03/15 22:46, Daniel Miller wrote:> On 3/19/2015 3:26 AM, Timo Sirainen wrote: >> Hi all, >> >> Today I can finally announce that Dovecot Oy company has merged with >> Open-Xchange AG. This helps us to get more Dovecot developers, >> support people and so on. Most importantly, eventually it should >> allow me to get back to doing what I like the most: Designing new and >> interesting stuff for Dovecot and perfecting the old stuff :) OX is a >> great match to Dovecot going forward. They also really like open >> source and share our plans for the future. Nothing big will change as >> a result of this merger: Dovecot will stay Dovecot with its own name >> and release schedules. We're not going to force OX and Dovecot to be >> the same product, other than having a somewhat deeper integration >> between them. >> > > My initial impression is...sounds great! Then, after further thought, > and watching the flame war, I've changed my mind to...sounds great! > > I'm operating under the assumption that you are continuing to be in > charge of Dovecot and will choose what and how to implement changes > and fixes. I'm further operating under the assumption that you may > choose to have certain features, appropriate for larger installations, > that you will want to receive compensation for from your users. And > I'm assuming that by having OX behind you, those initial assumptions > remain - Dovecot remains your baby, you will grow it as you see fit - > but now you've got some financial backing that allows you more freedom > to continue to develop Dovecot for general-purpose use while > reasonably having certain features developed to support the paid model. > > If I'm mistaken then please correct me - but I'm seeing nothing but > upside. Certainly for you, and if you were to abandon open source > Dovecot today (which I've seen absolutely no indication) you've > already provided a tool that has a significant user base and you > deserve to be rewarded for it. But based on your previous actions and > your original post, and I have no reason not to take you at your word, > this sounds like a win/win for Dovecot developers and users. > Congratulations! >
On Mon, 2015-03-23 at 16:08 +0200, Andreas Kasenides wrote:> I am usually emotionally (at least) against of open-source projects > loosing their independence to large corporations. Possibly due to badOX-AG is a "large corporation"? Did I miss something? Kind regards, Bernd -- "I dislike type abstraction if it has no real reason. And saving on typing is not a good reason - if your typing speed is the main issue when you're coding, you're doing something seriously wrong." - Linus Torvalds