Karanbir Singh wrote:> And yea, working on setting up a sort of list to handle > much of this semi OT traffic. More news on that around > Wed next week, dint ask about it now.Off course people are going to ask. In my opinion as long as a topic is marked OT, it is preferable to one not marked but one in which the OP has not even done basic research on his problem. One distro had a "brainflash" a number of years ago - create a list for expert users and one for newbies. It didn't take long for the newbies to realise that there was no one to help and so flooded the "expert list". This put off the "experts". On some mailing lists, long time users are put off by the flood of posts by newbies who don't even conform to the list guidelines. Some pay back by not replying to those in violation without as much as a hint. Would a new list really solve anything or would it close one door and open another? Regards, Vandaman.
On Fri, Oct 3, 2008 at 4:33 PM, Vandaman <vandaman2002-rt at yahoo.co.uk> wrote:> Karanbir Singh wrote: > >> And yea, working on setting up a sort of list to handle >> much of this semi OT traffic. More news on that around >> Wed next week, dint ask about it now. > > Off course people are going to ask. In my opinion as long > as a topic is marked OT, it is preferable to one not marked > but one in which the OP has not even done basic research > on his problem. > > One distro had a "brainflash" a number of years ago - create > a list for expert users and one for newbies. It didn't take > long for the newbies to realise that there was no one to > help and so flooded the "expert list". This put off the > "experts". > > On some mailing lists, long time users are put off by the > flood of posts by newbies who don't even conform to the list > guidelines. Some pay back by not replying to those in violation > without as much as a hint. > > Would a new list really solve anything or would it close > one door and open another?A CentOS social list would allow the crumedgeon'ing to happen off the main list and for users looking for ISPs or other CentOS community recommended wares/services. I seriously doubt they would be talking newbie/expert lists, as I believe the whole purpose of the lists is to share your knowledge with the less knowledgable. If it were all experts there would be no traffic! -Ross
Vandaman wrote:> > Off course people are going to ask. In my opinion as long > as a topic is marked OT, it is preferable to one not marked > but one in which the OP has not even done basic research > on his problem. >It may be preferable to YOU, but marking something OT doesn't stop it wasting MY bandwidth or clogging up MY inbox does it? Your latter point is a separate issue that has no relevance to this discussion.
Vandaman wrote:> Karanbir Singh wrote: > >> And yea, working on setting up a sort of list to handle >> much of this semi OT traffic. More news on that around >> Wed next week, dint ask about it now. > > Off course people are going to ask.your email is just a rant about nonsense and assumption. You have no idea as to what is going to be proposed not why and how. So I suggest you hang tight and wait for it. -- Karanbir Singh : http://www.karan.org/ : 2522219 at icq
On Friday 03 October 2008 21:33:09 Vandaman wrote:> Karanbir Singh wrote: > > And yea, working on setting up a sort of list to handle > > much of this semi OT traffic. More news on that around > > Wed next week, dint ask about it now. > > Off course people are going to ask. In my opinion as long > as a topic is marked OT, it is preferable to one not marked > but one in which the OP has not even done basic research > on his problem. > > One distro had a "brainflash" a number of years ago - create > a list for expert users and one for newbies. It didn't take > long for the newbies to realise that there was no one to > help and so flooded the "expert list". This put off the > "experts". >Not true - if you mean Mandrake/Mandriva. For several years the newbie and expert lists worked well. People used the newbie list and quite a few knowledgeable people supported it. Then the OT stuff got out of hand and experts stopped reading it, so people started using the expert list for newbie questions. That was OK until the OT stuff got out of hand, then experts stopped reading it. There were, however, other issues as to why experts moved away, which are not relevant to this discussion.> On some mailing lists, long time users are put off by the > flood of posts by newbies who don't even conform to the list > guidelines. Some pay back by not replying to those in violation > without as much as a hint. >And that is rude and thoughtless. Newbies don't necessarily know how and where to look for help.> Would a new list really solve anything or would it close > one door and open another? >That would depend on whether the list is valued enough for people to respect it. Anne -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.centos.org/pipermail/centos/attachments/20081004/ebe2ba30/attachment-0003.html> -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 197 bytes Desc: This is a digitally signed message part. URL: <http://lists.centos.org/pipermail/centos/attachments/20081004/ebe2ba30/attachment-0003.sig>
On Sat, 2008-10-04 at 08:32 +0100, Anne Wilson wrote:> On Friday 03 October 2008 21:33:09 Vandaman wrote: > <snip>> > On some mailing lists, long time users are put off by the > > > flood of posts by newbies who don't even conform to the list > > > guidelines. Some pay back by not replying to those in violation > > > without as much as a hint. > > > > > And that is rude and thoughtless. Newbies don't necessarily know how > and where to look for help.Respectfully, I disagree. There is an expectation (apparently unreasonable in today's society) that newcomers will make themselves aware of the courtesies and protocols used on a given list. If they haven't done so, or choose to make no effort to conform, why should *our* valuable time be wasted on such? It is better to only waste the OPs time. Having said that, most denizens do make an effort to point the offender in the right direction and even help. But all have limits unique to them. Their time is not for others to waste. So, I don't consider it rude and inconsiderate. It is, IMO, very courteous and considerate when compared to some alternatives I've seen used. It is a matter of personal choice. Just as in the real world, there is certain behavior expected from those with whom I *choose* to interact. Rudeness tends to be POV-centric.> > > Would a new list really solve anything or would it close > > > one door and open another? > > > > > That would depend on whether the list is valued enough for people to > respect it.True, true. But as I know you've seen, there are those who respect nothing other than their own needs.> > Anne > <snip sig stuff>MHO -- Bill