asterisk users - May 2006 - PSTN Incoming call on real line disrupts VoIPcall over DSL circuit - EXPLAINED

DSL works by using the frequencies above 4k that were unused in POTS loops of
yesterday. Load Coils, Bridge Taps, and DC taps are all devices added to lines
to increase their reach and stability, unfortunately, they are DEADLY for DSL.
Other problems can effect DSL service, and cause it to be 'flaky'.

1	Temperature, in Florida the large black cables are constantly beaten down by
the sun, if the temperature change is gradual, the DSL modem, (Modulator/
Demodulator) can quickly and quietly 're-train' the line for the
changes. Rapid changes may cause the carrier to drop, (IE rain storm, cools off
the cable quickly and changes the resistance on the loop)

2	Shorts or grounds, When the line 'rings' it sends voltage down the
line if there is a short, or a ground open somewhere it changes the properties
on the line causing havoc with the line.

After reading this post, I feel that the problem is, a. Bad Westell, b. Bad
loop.

Bell will run a loop test from the DSLAM 'out' to your site. While they
are doing this, call from another phone to make sure the test fails, or shows
what the problem is.


> -----Original Message-----
> From: asterisk-users-bounces@lists.digium.com [mailto:asterisk-users-
> bounces@lists.digium.com] On Behalf Of Hadar Pedhazur
> Sent: Tuesday, May 09, 2006 2:18 PM
> To: Asterisk Users Mailing List - Non-Commercial Discussion
> Subject: Re: [Asterisk-Users] PSTN Incoming call on real line disrupts
> VoIPcall over DSL circuit - EXPLAINED
> 
> Juergen K. Zick wrote:
> > HI,
> >
> > well, that was what I expected in my posting yesterday. For me, your
> > wiring looks strange. Here in Germany, we have "spiltters"
connected to
> > the incoming line which have two outputs: A high pass filter output
for
> > the DSL signal and a low pass output with DC  pass-through for the
POTS
> > signal. the DSL output is being connected to the DSL-modem and the
POTS
> > output will feed your internal POTS wiring.
> 
> The only jack that has both a phone and the DSL connector indeed has a
> splitter on it, provided by Bellsouth.
> 
> > Therefore, there is _NO_ filter needed on each POTS outlet, because
> > there is nothing to be filtered out on your internal line anymore.
> 
> You may be correct. I am definitely _not_ familiar enough with DSL.
> However, 5 years ago, I had a DSL line in my apartment, and I was
> specifically told by the installation tech that I needed a filter on
> _any_ jack that had a real phone connected to it. That may not have been
> necessary, or perhaps isn't necessary any longer, or perhaps varies by
> provider, but that's what I was told at the time, and that's what I
did
> (with no problems).
> 
> The filters on the phone jacks that didn't have the modem connected
were
> not splitters, just single filters.
> 
> > Seen from my German wiring knowlegde, your cabling is wrong and causes
> > the interruptions on the DSL service.
> 
> That's definitely possible, just not my personal (single point!)
> experience.
> 
> > Don`t you have something like a "spiltter" available ? It
should be the
> > _ONLY_ filter on your incoming line and then the DSL-modem and the
POTS
> > phone should be connected to it ...
> 
> OK, it would be easy for him to remove the other filters temporarily and
> test again.
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> > --J?rgen
> 
> >> Replying to my own post (and my most recent follow-up). I have now
> >> confirmed 100% that the DSL modem gets a _new_ IP address every
time
> >> his "real" phone gets answered, or hung up! This (of
course) disrupts
> >> the audio coming from to him, since the sending machine (Asterisk
in
> >> my case), no longer has the correct IP address to send to him.
> >>
> >> I lowered his registration from the default 1 hour to 1 minute, so
> >> after we're disconnected, I can see that he's
re-registering with a
> >> new IP address, each and every time :-(.
> >>
> >> I told him to call Bellsouth and ask about a Static IP address,
but I
> >> don't know if they offer it, or how much they charge.
> >>
> >> While this one isn't "solved", it's at least
"explained".
> >>
> >> Thanks to everyone who responded!
> _______________________________________________
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> 
> Asterisk-Users mailing list
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BellSouth will provide Static IPs for home users, staring with the
Extreme product. (3MBit) and up.  No extra charge for this, included in
the package.


> -----Original Message-----
> From: asterisk-users-bounces@lists.digium.com [mailto:asterisk-users-
> bounces@lists.digium.com] On Behalf Of Andres
> Sent: Tuesday, May 09, 2006 2:32 PM
> To: Asterisk Users Mailing List - Non-Commercial Discussion
> Subject: Re: [Asterisk-Users] PSTN Incoming call on real line disrupts
> VoIPcall over DSL circuit - EXPLAINED
> 
> Forget about the static IP from BS.  They only provide that to
business
> accounts.  But now that you know the problem it will be easy to
explain
> it to BS and have them take a look at it.
> 
> There could be something wrong with the wiring in the house.  Maybe a
> short which causes a signal spike when the call is answered and
> interrupts the PPPoE session.
> 
> --
> Andres
> Technical Support
> http://www.telesip.net
> 
> _______________________________________________
> --Bandwidth and Colocation provided by Easynews.com --
> 
> Asterisk-Users mailing list
> To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit:
>    http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users

Alexander Lopez wrote:
>BellSouth will provide Static IPs for home users, staring with the
>Extreme product. (3MBit) and up.  No extra charge for this, included in
>the package.
>  
>
I have that product and last time I called they did not offer me static 
IPs.  Where did you read up on this?
>
>
>  
>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: asterisk-users-bounces@lists.digium.com [mailto:asterisk-users-
>>bounces@lists.digium.com] On Behalf Of Andres
>>Sent: Tuesday, May 09, 2006 2:32 PM
>>To: Asterisk Users Mailing List - Non-Commercial Discussion
>>Subject: Re: [Asterisk-Users] PSTN Incoming call on real line disrupts
>>VoIPcall over DSL circuit - EXPLAINED
>>
>>Forget about the static IP from BS.  They only provide that to
>>    
>>
>business
>  
>
>>accounts.  But now that you know the problem it will be easy to
>>    
>>
>explain
>  
>
>>it to BS and have them take a look at it.
>>
>>There could be something wrong with the wiring in the house.  Maybe a
>>short which causes a signal spike when the call is answered and
>>interrupts the PPPoE session.
>>
>>--
>>Andres
>>Technical Support
>>http://www.telesip.net
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>--Bandwidth and Colocation provided by Easynews.com --
>>
>>Asterisk-Users mailing list
>>To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit:
>>   http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
>>    
>>
>_______________________________________________
>--Bandwidth and Colocation provided by Easynews.com --
>
>Asterisk-Users mailing list
>To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit:
>   http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
>
>
>  
>

-- 
Andres
Technical Support
http://www.telesip.net

Andres wrote:
> Alexander Lopez wrote:
>
>> BellSouth will provide Static IPs for home users, staring with the
>> Extreme product. (3MBit) and up.  No extra charge for this, included in
>> the package.
>>  
>>
> I have that product and last time I called they did not offer me 
> static IPs.  Where did you read up on this?
>
Never mind. I just found it on the BS web page.  Its $14.95 for the IP 
if your not on the Extreme Package.  Thanks!
>>
>>
>>  
>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: asterisk-users-bounces@lists.digium.com
[mailto:asterisk-users-
>>> bounces@lists.digium.com] On Behalf Of Andres
>>> Sent: Tuesday, May 09, 2006 2:32 PM
>>> To: Asterisk Users Mailing List - Non-Commercial Discussion
>>> Subject: Re: [Asterisk-Users] PSTN Incoming call on real line
disrupts
>>> VoIPcall over DSL circuit - EXPLAINED
>>>
>>> Forget about the static IP from BS.  They only provide that to
>>>   
>>
>> business
>>  
>>
>>> accounts.  But now that you know the problem it will be easy to
>>>   
>>
>> explain
>>  
>>
>>> it to BS and have them take a look at it.
>>>
>>> There could be something wrong with the wiring in the house.  Maybe
a
>>> short which causes a signal spike when the call is answered and
>>> interrupts the PPPoE session.
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> Andres
>>> Technical Support
>>> http://www.telesip.net
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> --Bandwidth and Colocation provided by Easynews.com --
>>>
>>> Asterisk-Users mailing list
>>> To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit:
>>>   http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
>>>   
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> --Bandwidth and Colocation provided by Easynews.com --
>>
>> Asterisk-Users mailing list
>> To UNSUBSCRIBE or update options visit:
>>   http://lists.digium.com/mailman/listinfo/asterisk-users
>>
>>
>>  
>>
>
>

-- 
Andres
Technical Support
http://www.telesip.net

Once again, combining multiple responses. I have a suspicion
that this might be bad netiquette, but I hope no one minds
too much (just tell me if it is, and I'll stop!).

Alexander Lopez wrote:
 > After reading this post, I feel that the problem is,
 > a. Bad Westell, b. Bad loop.

 > Bell will run a loop test from the DSLAM 'out' to your
 > site. While they are doing this, call from another phone
 > to make sure the test fails, or shows what the problem is.

Good idea (specifically the part of calling while they are
testing!).

Juergen K. Zick wrote:
 > Well,

 > to avoid a misunderstanding see the following drawing:

 > 
/-------DSL-MODEM-----HT-----PC
 >                                            H|                      |
 >                                   +----------+ 
Inet-PHONE
 > from BellSouth (DSL over POTS) ---| SPLITTER |
 >                                   +----------+
 >                                            L|
 > 
\------------------------------
 >                                                         | 
      |
 >                                                     answering
 > POTS
 >                                                     machine
 > phone

 > (maybe you have to reformat it into COURIER font)

 > It's depending on the calling in your father`s flat but on
 > the incoming line you should have only _ONE_ device, the
 > SPLITTER !!!

Thanks Juergen. Now I see where we were miscommuncating.
It's typical in the US to have many phone jacks in one
house/apt all connected to the same number. So, while the
DSL and one phone are connected to one of the jacks
_exactly_ as in your diagram above, there are other phones
in other rooms, connected directly to the wall jack, and I
was under the impression that they need separate filters.

Alexander Lopez wrote:
 > BellSouth will provide Static IPs for home users, staring
 > with the Extreme product. (3MBit) and up.  No extra charge
 > for this, included in the package.

Cool. Good to know!

Andrew Kohlsmith wrote:
 > If the PPPoE session were interrupted all audio would
 > stop.  This is not the case.

That's exactly what I thought as well, but I had no other
explanation for the effect that I am seeing.

 > We need to see packet dumps on both the transmitting side
 > (just before the DSL modem) and on the receiving side (far
 > end Asterisk box).  I'm guessing that there is something
 > funny with the ATA or DSL modem, but I'm dumbfounded as to
 > a solution.

If that's straightforward to set up, I'm game to try it (I
have no idea what I would need to do, and if it has to be on
my Dad's PC as well, it will be a lot tougher to get it
going ;-).

Anyway, my Dad was game to call Bellsouth. Whenever he gets
them, and gets an answer (if there is one), I'll report back
for completeness sake.

Thanks again to everyone!