On 17/06/2020 18:38, Michael Kofler wrote:> Hi, > > I am the author of said blog article. > > FIRST: It was never my intention to criticize the CentOS > team. I appreciate the hard work you are doing. If my blog > text (which is in German langugage) gave a wrong impression, > I apologize. > > SECOND: I LOVE CentOS. Otherwise it would not matter to > me. I use CentOS to teach Linux administration at > university, I promote CentOS in my books and I use it > personally on some servers. > > THIRD: It is a fact that the update gaps for CentOS 8 are > currently too long for productive use. Basically, that's why > I now warn against using CentOS 8 on live systems. > > --- > > One might argue, CentOS was never intended for productive > use. Perhaps I misunderstood this. And with me all > administrators of some million web servers running on > CentOS. Hm. Time to rethink? >As far as I'm aware that has always been the case. Johnny has never been slow in coming forward and saying if you need updates, or a service level agreement, or support then you should buy RHEL. That is what it is for. If not, then use CentOS for free. But don't use CentOS for free on production servers and then shout or act surprised when you don't have updates on a timescale you consider appropriate. Nothing has changed in this regard for as long as I've been a CentOS user or been involved in the CentOS community. If you are now having to rethink your approach then you probably either haven't given it sufficient thought in the first place or you originally came to the wrong conclusion. This is a non-issue. Nothing has changed. Things were exactly the same with CentOS 4, CentOS 5, CentOS 6, CentOS 7, and by it's very nature it will be the same in CentOS 9... The simple matter is it takes time to rebuild a complete OS and there will always be a lag. Either that is acceptable to you and you use it, or you purchase a RHEL license for your publicly facing infrastructure. The only issue here is people's unrealistic expectations, and to be fair the CentOS Project can hardly be accused of falsely raising peoples expectations having consistently stated it will be ready when it's done for at least the last 15 years.
> On Jun 17, 2020, at 3:02 PM, Phil Perry <pperry at elrepo.org> wrote: > > Nothing has changed in this regard for as long as I've been a CentOS user or been involved in the CentOS community.This is the essence of the question, to me. I agree that _in_principle_ nothing has changed, and I don't even see any disagreement with that in the list. However, there is a separate question, and that is whether _in_practice_ the lag between RHEL and CentOS updates has increased with CentOS 8. I don't know what the answer is, because I'm not paying attention since I'm far from adopting CentOS 8, but it's a legitimate (and in fact empirical) question. Noam
On 17/06/2020 20:06, Noam Bernstein via CentOS wrote:>> On Jun 17, 2020, at 3:02 PM, Phil Perry <pperry at elrepo.org> wrote: >> >> Nothing has changed in this regard for as long as I've been a CentOS user or been involved in the CentOS community. > > This is the essence of the question, to me. I agree that _in_principle_ nothing has changed, and I don't even see any disagreement with that in the list. However, there is a separate question, and that is whether _in_practice_ the lag between RHEL and CentOS updates has increased with CentOS 8. I don't know what the answer is, because I'm not paying attention since I'm far from adopting CentOS 8, but it's a legitimate (and in fact empirical) question. >I get what you are saying, but what difference does it make if it has? What does it matter if the lag is 1 week, or 1 month, or more? The only reason it will matter to you is if you are trying to do something with CentOS that is time critical - e.g, publicly facing server that needs security updates, using CentOS on test servers to validate production releases for RHEL, etc. At which point you probably should be using RHEL if it is important to you, not CentOS, and it was a mistake to deploy CentOS in those roles in the first place. People need to hold their hands up and say, I took a gamble that CentOS would get updates out quick and I wouldn't get hacked in a week, and now updates are taking a lot longer my gamble is no longer paying off and I need to get myself a RHEL subscription or switch to Ubuntu or whatever other flavor you like the taste of. Coming here and complaining when (you) made a bet and lost doesn't achieve anything. On my home file server for example, which is not connected to the internet, what does it matter if the release is 1 month or 3 months out of date? I can install the server in the knowledge it's going to work, and be supported with updates for 10 years and I can largely forget about it. My el5 box ran for more than 10 years until the hardware eventually died.