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...capability. Thanks... David -----Original Message----- From: Andy Lutomirski [mailto:luto at amacapital.net] Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 12:07 PM To: Paolo Bonzini Cc: Jun Nakajima; KY Srinivasan; Mathew John; Theodore Ts'o; John Starks; kvm list; Gleb Natapov; Niels Ferguson; David Hepkin; H. Peter Anvin; Jake Oshins; Linux Virtualization Subject: Re: Standardizing an MSR or other hypercall to get an RNG seed? On Thu, Sep 18, 2014 at 11:58 AM, Paolo Bonzini <pbonzini at redhat.com> wrote: > >> > Actually, that MSR address range has been reserved for that >>...

...capability. Thanks... David -----Original Message----- From: Andy Lutomirski [mailto:luto at amacapital.net] Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 12:07 PM To: Paolo Bonzini Cc: Jun Nakajima; KY Srinivasan; Mathew John; Theodore Ts'o; John Starks; kvm list; Gleb Natapov; Niels Ferguson; David Hepkin; H. Peter Anvin; Jake Oshins; Linux Virtualization Subject: Re: Standardizing an MSR or other hypercall to get an RNG seed? On Thu, Sep 18, 2014 at 11:58 AM, Paolo Bonzini <pbonzini at redhat.com> wrote: > >> > Actually, that MSR address range has been reserved for that >>...

...t; From: Paolo Bonzini [mailto:paolo.bonzini at gmail.com] On Behalf Of Paolo > Bonzini > Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 10:18 AM > To: Nakajima, Jun; KY Srinivasan > Cc: Mathew John; Theodore Ts'o; John Starks; kvm list; Gleb Natapov; Niels > Ferguson; Andy Lutomirski; David Hepkin; H. Peter Anvin; Jake Oshins; Linux > Virtualization > Subject: Re: Standardizing an MSR or other hypercall to get an RNG seed? > > Il 18/09/2014 19:13, Nakajima, Jun ha scritto: > > In terms of the address for the MSR, I suggest that you choose one > > from the range betwe...

...t; From: Paolo Bonzini [mailto:paolo.bonzini at gmail.com] On Behalf Of Paolo > Bonzini > Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 10:18 AM > To: Nakajima, Jun; KY Srinivasan > Cc: Mathew John; Theodore Ts'o; John Starks; kvm list; Gleb Natapov; Niels > Ferguson; Andy Lutomirski; David Hepkin; H. Peter Anvin; Jake Oshins; Linux > Virtualization > Subject: Re: Standardizing an MSR or other hypercall to get an RNG seed? > > Il 18/09/2014 19:13, Nakajima, Jun ha scritto: > > In terms of the address for the MSR, I suggest that you choose one > > from the range betwe...

...zini at gmail.com] On Behalf Of Paolo >>> Bonzini >>> Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 10:18 AM >>> To: Nakajima, Jun; KY Srinivasan >>> Cc: Mathew John; Theodore Ts'o; John Starks; kvm list; Gleb Natapov; Niels >>> Ferguson; Andy Lutomirski; David Hepkin; H. Peter Anvin; Jake Oshins; Linux >>> Virtualization >>> Subject: Re: Standardizing an MSR or other hypercall to get an RNG seed? >>> >>> Il 18/09/2014 19:13, Nakajima, Jun ha scritto: >>> > In terms of the address for the MSR, I suggest that you ch...

...zini at gmail.com] On Behalf Of Paolo >>> Bonzini >>> Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 10:18 AM >>> To: Nakajima, Jun; KY Srinivasan >>> Cc: Mathew John; Theodore Ts'o; John Starks; kvm list; Gleb Natapov; Niels >>> Ferguson; Andy Lutomirski; David Hepkin; H. Peter Anvin; Jake Oshins; Linux >>> Virtualization >>> Subject: Re: Standardizing an MSR or other hypercall to get an RNG seed? >>> >>> Il 18/09/2014 19:13, Nakajima, Jun ha scritto: >>> > In terms of the address for the MSR, I suggest that you ch...

On Thu, Sep 18, 2014 at 9:36 AM, KY Srinivasan <kys at microsoft.com> wrote: > > I am copying other Hyper-V engineers to this discussion. > Thanks, K.Y. In terms of the address for the MSR, I suggest that you choose one from the range between 40000000H - 400000FFH. The SDM (35.1 ARCHITECTURAL MSRS) says "All existing and future processors will not implement any features using

On Thu, Sep 18, 2014 at 9:36 AM, KY Srinivasan <kys at microsoft.com> wrote: > > I am copying other Hyper-V engineers to this discussion. > Thanks, K.Y. In terms of the address for the MSR, I suggest that you choose one from the range between 40000000H - 400000FFH. The SDM (35.1 ARCHITECTURAL MSRS) says "All existing and future processors will not implement any features using

On Thu, Sep 18, 2014 at 11:58 AM, Paolo Bonzini <pbonzini at redhat.com> wrote: > >> > Actually, that MSR address range has been reserved for that purpose, along >> > with: >> > - CPUID.EAX=1 -> ECX bit 31 (always returns 0 on bare metal) >> > - CPUID.EAX=4000_00xxH leaves (i.e. HYPERVISOR CPUID) >> >> I don't know whether this is

On Thu, Sep 18, 2014 at 11:58 AM, Paolo Bonzini <pbonzini at redhat.com> wrote: > >> > Actually, that MSR address range has been reserved for that purpose, along >> > with: >> > - CPUID.EAX=1 -> ECX bit 31 (always returns 0 on bare metal) >> > - CPUID.EAX=4000_00xxH leaves (i.e. HYPERVISOR CPUID) >> >> I don't know whether this is

...nks... David -----Original Message----- From: Andy Lutomirski [mailto:luto at amacapital.net] Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 12:04 PM To: Niels Ferguson Cc: H. Peter Anvin; Nakajima, Jun; KY Srinivasan; Paolo Bonzini; Mathew John; Theodore Ts'o; John Starks; kvm list; Gleb Natapov; David Hepkin; Jake Oshins; Linux Virtualization Subject: Re: Standardizing an MSR or other hypercall to get an RNG seed? On Thu, Sep 18, 2014 at 11:54 AM, Niels Ferguson <niels at microsoft.com> wrote: > Defining a standard way of transferring random numbers between the host and the guest is an excell...

...nks... David -----Original Message----- From: Andy Lutomirski [mailto:luto at amacapital.net] Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 12:04 PM To: Niels Ferguson Cc: H. Peter Anvin; Nakajima, Jun; KY Srinivasan; Paolo Bonzini; Mathew John; Theodore Ts'o; John Starks; kvm list; Gleb Natapov; David Hepkin; Jake Oshins; Linux Virtualization Subject: Re: Standardizing an MSR or other hypercall to get an RNG seed? On Thu, Sep 18, 2014 at 11:54 AM, Niels Ferguson <niels at microsoft.com> wrote: > Defining a standard way of transferring random numbers between the host and the guest is an excell...

...s very odd. Niels -----Original Message----- From: H. Peter Anvin [mailto:hpa at zytor.com] Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 11:39 AM To: Andy Lutomirski; Nakajima, Jun Cc: KY Srinivasan; Paolo Bonzini; Mathew John; Theodore Ts'o; John Starks; kvm list; Gleb Natapov; Niels Ferguson; David Hepkin; Jake Oshins; Linux Virtualization Subject: Re: Standardizing an MSR or other hypercall to get an RNG seed? Quite frankly it might make more sense to define a cross-VM *cpuid* range. The cpuid leaf can just point to the MSR. The big question is who will be willing to be the registrar. On Septem...

...s very odd. Niels -----Original Message----- From: H. Peter Anvin [mailto:hpa at zytor.com] Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 11:39 AM To: Andy Lutomirski; Nakajima, Jun Cc: KY Srinivasan; Paolo Bonzini; Mathew John; Theodore Ts'o; John Starks; kvm list; Gleb Natapov; Niels Ferguson; David Hepkin; Jake Oshins; Linux Virtualization Subject: Re: Standardizing an MSR or other hypercall to get an RNG seed? Quite frankly it might make more sense to define a cross-VM *cpuid* range. The cpuid leaf can just point to the MSR. The big question is who will be willing to be the registrar. On Septem...

...ni [mailto:paolo.bonzini at gmail.com] On Behalf Of Paolo >> Bonzini >> Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 10:18 AM >> To: Nakajima, Jun; KY Srinivasan >> Cc: Mathew John; Theodore Ts'o; John Starks; kvm list; Gleb Natapov; Niels >> Ferguson; Andy Lutomirski; David Hepkin; H. Peter Anvin; Jake Oshins; Linux >> Virtualization >> Subject: Re: Standardizing an MSR or other hypercall to get an RNG seed? >> >> Il 18/09/2014 19:13, Nakajima, Jun ha scritto: >> > In terms of the address for the MSR, I suggest that you choose one >> &g...

On 09/18/2014 02:46 PM, David Hepkin wrote: > I'm not sure what you mean by "this mechanism?" Are you suggesting that each hypervisor put "CrossHVPara\0" somewhere in the 0x40000000 - 0x400fffff CPUID range, and an OS has to do a full scan of this CPUID range on boot to find it? That seems pretty inefficie...

On Thu, Sep 18, 2014 at 2:46 PM, David Hepkin <davidhep at microsoft.com> wrote: > I'm not sure what you mean by "this mechanism?" Are you suggesting that each hypervisor put "CrossHVPara\0" somewhere in the 0x40000000 - 0x400fffff CPUID range, and an OS has to do a full scan of this CPUID range on boot to fin...

Il 18/09/2014 23:54, David Hepkin ha scritto: > The chief advantage I see to using a hypercall based mechanism is > that it would work across more architectures. MSR's and CPUID's are > specific to X86. If we ever wanted this same mechanism to be > available on an architecture that doesn't support MSR'...

...Of >Paolo >>>> Bonzini >>>> Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 10:18 AM >>>> To: Nakajima, Jun; KY Srinivasan >>>> Cc: Mathew John; Theodore Ts'o; John Starks; kvm list; Gleb >Natapov; Niels >>>> Ferguson; Andy Lutomirski; David Hepkin; H. Peter Anvin; Jake >Oshins; Linux >>>> Virtualization >>>> Subject: Re: Standardizing an MSR or other hypercall to get an RNG >seed? >>>> >>>> Il 18/09/2014 19:13, Nakajima, Jun ha scritto: >>>> > In terms of the address for th...

On Thu, Sep 18, 2014 at 03:00:05PM -0700, Andy Lutomirski wrote: > On Thu, Sep 18, 2014 at 2:46 PM, David Hepkin <davidhep at microsoft.com> wrote: > > I suggest we come to consensus on a specific CPUID leaf where an OS needs to look to determine if a hypervisor supports this capability. We could define a new CPUID leaf range at a well-defined location, or we could just use one of the existing CP...