I think it''s time to say that the continuous integration, break/fixed notices should be moved to a new list. It''s seriously diluting the important conversations real humans are having. As much as I thoroughly enjoy seeing the reports and status updates. It means little to nothing to me on a "live" perspective, more on a.. if I use this rev of edge, is it stable ( as far as all the oracle, sqlserver, cruisecontrol, etc tests reports are concerned). Nathaniel. -- Nathaniel Steven Henry Brown Toll Free: 1-877-446-4647 Vancouver: 604-724-6624 --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Core" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-core@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-core-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-core?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
On 3/29/07, Nathaniel Brown <nshb@inimit.com> wrote:> > > I think it''s time to say that the continuous integration, break/fixed > notices should be moved to a new list.I had this filter in GMail for a long time now: Matches: *to:rubyonrails subject:("AR/Oracle Unit Test" OR SQLServer OR "Rails-MySQL Build")* Do this: Skip Inbox, Delete it I''m updating it as new continuous integration setups are made. --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Core" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-core@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-core-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-core?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
No doubt then, seems you are already making procedures to silence it. I could defiately create the filter as well, but I am sure I am not the only one noticing that the emails on core would have more impact if we didn't have to sift through the commit checks. Especially as more systems are setup in place to ensure that quality is consistently high. Nathaniel. On 3/29/07, Mislav Marohnić <mislav.marohnic@gmail.com> wrote:> On 3/29/07, Nathaniel Brown <nshb@inimit.com> wrote: > > > > I think it's time to say that the continuous integration, break/fixed > > notices should be moved to a new list. > > I had this filter in GMail for a long time now: > > Matches: to:rubyonrails subject:("AR/Oracle Unit Test" OR SQLServer OR > "Rails-MySQL Build") > Do this: Skip Inbox, Delete it > > I'm updating it as new continuous integration setups are made. > > > >-- Nathaniel Steven Henry Brown Toll Free: 1-877-446-4647 Vancouver: 604-724-6624 --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Core" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-core@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-core-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-core?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
On 3/29/07, Nathaniel Brown <nshb@inimit.com> wrote:> > > > I think it''s time to say that the continuous integration, break/fixed > > > notices should be moved to a new list. >Just one question: what name that new list should have? Should it be called rails-core-core or rails-notices-that-nobody-ever-sees? :) Point being, Rails-core is the Rails project team mail list, isn''t it? For continuous integration to have real value, failures in CI should be highly visible, and get fixed quickly. Otherwise, all you have is a perpetually broken build that nobody cares about. Which is not worth the hassle to have. We can consolidate Oracle and SQLServer builds, once I get that fat dual Opteron box set up with VMs for multiple OS/database combos. Even now, it''s not like Rails build is broken 10 times a day. -- Alex Verkhovsky CI build monkey --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Core" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-core@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-core-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-core?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
On 29/03/07, Alexey Verkhovsky <alexey.verkhovsky@gmail.com> wrote:> On 3/29/07, Nathaniel Brown <nshb@inimit.com> wrote: > > > > I think it''s time to say that the continuous integration, break/fixed > > > > notices should be moved to a new list. > > > > Just one question: what name that new list should have? Should it be called > rails-core-core or rails-notices-that-nobody-ever-sees? :) > > Point being, Rails-core is the Rails project team mail list, isn''t it? For > continuous integration to have real value, failures in CI should be highly > visible, and get fixed quickly. Otherwise, all you have is a perpetually > broken build that nobody cares about. Which is not worth the hassle to have.+1. I''d like the notices to remain in rails-core Tom --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Core" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-core@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-core-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-core?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
On Mar 29, 2007, at 5:25 PM, Tom Ward wrote:> > +1. I''d like the notices to remain in rails-core > > TomIn fact I''ve reconcidered and I also give a +1 now CI is awareness and IMO the fact that errors clog the main list prompts to fix them faster -- Julian ''Julik'' Tarkhanov please send all personal mail to me at julik.nl --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Core" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-core@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-core-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-core?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
> I think it''s time to say that the continuous integration, break/fixed > notices should be moved to a new list.Moving them to another list will simply create an error message ghetto which no one checks. I''m happy with them here at present, and their volume is tiny relative to the discussion threads. -- Cheers Koz --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Core" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-core@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-core-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-core?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
On 29.3.2007, at 19.34, Julian Tarkhanov wrote:> On Mar 29, 2007, at 5:25 PM, Tom Ward wrote: >> +1. I''d like the notices to remain in rails-core >> >> Tom > > In fact I''ve reconcidered and I also give a +1 now > CI is awareness and IMO the fact that errors clog the main list > prompts to fix them faster+1 from here as well. -- Jarkko Laine http://jlaine.net http://dotherightthing.com http://www.railsecommerce.com http://odesign.fi
I''d rather they be seen. On 3/29/07, Jarkko Laine <jarkko@jlaine.net> wrote:> On 29.3.2007, at 19.34, Julian Tarkhanov wrote: > > On Mar 29, 2007, at 5:25 PM, Tom Ward wrote: > >> +1. I''d like the notices to remain in rails-core > >> > >> Tom > > > > In fact I''ve reconcidered and I also give a +1 now > > CI is awareness and IMO the fact that errors clog the main list > > prompts to fix them faster > > +1 from here as well. > > -- > Jarkko Laine > http://jlaine.net > http://dotherightthing.com > http://www.railsecommerce.com > http://odesign.fi > > > >-- Kevin Clark http://glu.ttono.us --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Core" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-core@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-core-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-core?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
On Fri, Mar 30, 2007 at 12:47:51AM -0700, Nathaniel Brown wrote:> To think that they would be ignored if they are as important as > everyone is making them out to be seems a shame. > > It''s called organization. Putting a central resource where you can > subscribe to - and yes, I did say you can actually subscribe to the > list - won''t stop people from reading them. > > Anyways, was a suggestion to clean things up, but hey. I suppose > people like messy sometimes too :) I added the filter that was > originally recommended, so my itch is scratched for the time being. > Although I still see value in having a separate list, but hey - better > ideas have been shot down before!CI sending an email means something is wrong that needs to be fixed. Sometimes this is the result of some oversight, like we messed up the Oracle adapter and Michael chimes in with what the issue was and what the fix is. So these emails are usually the beginning of a conversation about how to fix the problem. Having them on the mailing list whose purpose is, in part, to have a conversation about how to fix problems, seems very orderly to me, not messy. But you''re all set now with your filtering rule in place though, so cheers. marcel -- Marcel Molina Jr. <marcel@vernix.org> --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Core" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-core@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-core-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-core?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
I agree with your observation that having CI build errors go into core seems messy and disorganized. That said, however, I believe that human nature requires that the errors be obnoxious and in-your-face. I''m not very disciplined, and I know that the instant I relegate those kind of errors to a separate list that I have to remember to check, code reliability starts going away - and I suspect I''m not alone in this. -bd On Mar 30, 12:47 am, "Nathaniel Brown" <n...@inimit.com> wrote:> To think that they would be ignored if they are as important as > everyone is making them out to be seems a shame. > > It''s called organization. Putting a central resource where you can > subscribe to - and yes, I did say you can actually subscribe to the > list - won''t stop people from reading them. > > Anyways, was a suggestion to clean things up, but hey. I suppose > people like messy sometimes too :) I added the filter that was > originally recommended, so my itch is scratched for the time being. > Although I still see value in having a separate list, but hey - better > ideas have been shot down before! > > Nathaniel. > > On 3/29/07, Kevin Clark <kevin.cl...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > > I''d rather they be seen. > > > On 3/29/07, Jarkko Laine <jar...@jlaine.net> wrote: > > > On 29.3.2007, at 19.34, Julian Tarkhanov wrote: > > > > On Mar 29, 2007, at 5:25 PM, Tom Ward wrote: > > > >> +1. I''d like the notices to remain in rails-core > > > > >> Tom > > > > > In fact I''ve reconcidered and I also give a +1 now > > > > CI is awareness and IMO the fact that errors clog the main list > > > > prompts to fix them faster > > > > +1 from here as well. > > > > -- > > > Jarkko Laine > > >http://jlaine.net > > >http://dotherightthing.com > > >http://www.railsecommerce.com > > >http://odesign.fi > > > -- > > Kevin Clark > >http://glu.ttono.us > > -- > Nathaniel Steven Henry Brown > > Toll Free: 1-877-446-4647 > Vancouver: 604-724-6624--~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Core" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-core@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-core-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-core?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
On 3/30/07, eventualbuddha <brian.donovan@gmail.com> wrote:> > > ... however, I believe that human > nature requires that the errors be obnoxious and in-your-face.Like the Rails depreciation warnings. --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Core" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-core@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-core-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-core?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
> Moving them to another list will simply create an error message ghetto > which no one checks. I''m happy with them here at present, and their > volume is tiny relative to the discussion threads.Completely agree. Rails is all about recognizing human nature. That beauty makes us happy and that happy people are more productive. It works just as well on the flip side. We all procrastinate, we all ignore that which we can, but we get out of the chair to fix something that is annoying us. If a particular set of broken reports are annoying you, please get out of your chair and fix it. This list is optimized for those who do rather than those who don''t. Seems that there''s broad consensus on that fact, though. --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Ruby on Rails: Core" group. To post to this group, send email to rubyonrails-core@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rubyonrails-core-unsubscribe@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rubyonrails-core?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---