thr3ads.net - R help - [R] Meta: R-Help reply-to [Dec 2020]

If this information is useful, please help other people find it:
Share via:

Jeff Newmiller

2020-Dec-15 18:54 UTC

[R] Meta: R-Help reply-to

For the record: this is not nearly as cut-and-dried as you imply. The current
settings actually make replying off-list rather tricky for some mail clients...
I have tried and failed a few times to reply off-list due to this.

The next level of invasiveness is to make it appear that the original author is
the list... and having participated in lists that were setup that way in the
past, I will vote strongly against such a change.

So some mail clients make it too easy to ignore the email headers, and for some
reason newbies end up using those mail clients frequently. But making changes to
the default list configuration is not necessarily going to solve that problem,
so beware of solutions that are worse than the problems they purport to solve.

On December 15, 2020 9:04:56 AM PST, "Patrick (Malone Quantitative)"
<malone at malonequantitative.com> wrote:>Ok. If this is a desirable change, of whom would we request it? I was
>unable to find a name, and as I said, I got no response from the
>generic
>address.
>
>Pat
>
>On Tue, Dec 15, 2020 at 11:43 AM P?r Leijonhufvud via R-help <
>r-help at r-project.org> wrote:
>
>> Unless I am getting senile that should be an option in Mailman...
>>
>https://docs.mailman3.org/projects/mailman/en/latest/src/mailman/handlers/docs/reply-to.html
>>
>> /P?r
>>
>> --
>> P?r Leijonhufvud               .
>> par.leijonhufvud at regionjh.se
>> Sjukhuskemist
>> +46(0)63-153 376, +46-(0)70-242 7006
>> Laboratoriemedicin, ?stersunds sjukhus
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: R-help <r-help-bounces at r-project.org> On Behalf Of
Patrick
>(Malone
>> Quantitative)
>> Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 2020 4:52 PM
>> To: r-help <r-help at r-project.org>
>> Subject: [R] Meta: R-Help reply-to
>>
>> Greetings.
>>
>> Something I've wondered for some time--is mailman configurable to
>have a
>> default reply-to be set to the list or to reply-all?
>>
>> Many newcomers who reply to individual R-Help participants may not
>notice
>> that they are doing so, and it seems a source of vexation to some of
>the
>> more frequent helpers.
>>
>> I wrote to r-help-owner with this query several months ago and never
>heard
>> back.
>>
>> Pat
>>
>> --
>> Patrick S. Malone, Ph.D., Malone Quantitative NEW Service Models:
>>
>https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmalonequantitative.com%2F&amp;data=04%7C01%7Cpar.leijonhufvud%40regionjh.se%7Cf773b2b128b24916fe2808d8a111c4a5%7Cd3b4cf3aca774a02aefaf4398591468f%7C0%7C0%7C637436444979024301%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&amp;sdata=M4XyJrU7fidlWAwaa9NNBC6yUSTCl0VSF2icCKfhfLw%3D&amp;reserved=0
>>
>> He/Him/His
>>
>> [[alternative HTML version deleted]]
>>
>> ______________________________________________
>> R-help at r-project.org mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see
>>
>>
>https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fstat.ethz.ch%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fr-help&amp;data=04%7C01%7Cpar.leijonhufvud%40regionjh.se%7Cf773b2b128b24916fe2808d8a111c4a5%7Cd3b4cf3aca774a02aefaf4398591468f%7C0%7C0%7C637436444979034293%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&amp;sdata=MV2Y2L86j6AczuXdc%2Fni2PzRl0ZvCcBsnrV1xkrL2b8%3D&amp;reserved=0
>> PLEASE do read the posting guide
>>
>https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.r-project.org%2Fposting-guide.html&amp;data=04%7C01%7Cpar.leijonhufvud%40regionjh.se%7Cf773b2b128b24916fe2808d8a111c4a5%7Cd3b4cf3aca774a02aefaf4398591468f%7C0%7C0%7C637436444979034293%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&amp;sdata=wOeXpqKMfqfsSZjSyar%2Bqmhf7ZSFeiH3qwqQkIlfyhs%3D&amp;reserved=0
>> and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.
>>
>> Region J?mtland H?rjedalen behandlar dina personuppgifter vid
>> kommunikation via e-post. Hanteringen av personuppgifter f?ljer
>g?llande
>> dataskyddslagstiftning. Du kan l?sa mer om hur vi behandlar dina
>uppgifter
>> p? https://regionjh.se/gdpr
>>
>> ______________________________________________
>> R-help at r-project.org mailing list -- To UNSUBSCRIBE and more, see
>> https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-help
>> PLEASE do read the posting guide
>> http://www.R-project.org/posting-guide.html
>> and provide commented, minimal, self-contained, reproducible code.
>>
-- 
Sent from my phone. Please excuse my brevity.

Martin Maechler

2020-Dec-17 08:00 UTC

head link

[R] Meta: R-Help reply-to

>>>>> Jeff Newmiller 
>>>>>     on Tue, 15 Dec 2020 10:54:00 -0800 writes:
    > For the record: this is not nearly as cut-and-dried as you
    > imply. The current settings actually make replying
    > off-list rather tricky for some mail clients... I have
    > tried and failed a few times to reply off-list due to
    > this.  The next level of invasiveness is to make it appear
    > that the original author is the list... and having
    > participated in lists that were setup that way in the
    > past, I will vote strongly against such a change.

    > So some mail clients make it too easy to ignore the email
    > headers, and for some reason newbies end up using those
    > mail clients frequently. But making changes to the default
    > list configuration is not necessarily going to solve that
    > problem, so beware of solutions that are worse than the
    > problems they purport to solve.

I agree that to change the so-called 'Reply-To:' mail header  is
not something I'd personally want, nor something I'd like the
R-help mailing list to suddenly change to.

Yes, people using e-mail should know the difference between the
'reply' and the 'reply all' "button" in their e-mail
clients.

I Jeff sends an e-mail to me and others, I do know that if I
'reply', I reply to him, and if I "reply all" I reply to him
*and* the others.  This is how e-mail works and has worked forever.

As Jeff mentions -- and as I have experienced myself also
(rarely) -- when mailing lists are configured differently, their
behavior is much more confusing and for many list recipients
it becomes almost impossible to reply to just the poster.

In my view such a change would be quite disruptive particularly
for those who use e-mail regularly in their professional life
and also those who've helped making R-help a valuable resource
by being "R-helpers" as I call them.

Martin


    > On December 15, 2020 9:04:56 AM PST, "Patrick (Malone
    > Quantitative)" <malone at malonequantitative.com> wrote:
    >> Ok. If this is a desirable change, of whom would we
    >> request it? I was unable to find a name, and as I said, I
    >> got no response from the generic address.
    >> 
    >> Pat
    >> 
    >> On Tue, Dec 15, 2020 at 11:43 AM P?r Leijonhufvud via
    >> R-help < r-help at r-project.org> wrote:
    >> 
    >>> Unless I am getting senile that should be an option in
    >>> Mailman...
    >>> 
    >>
https://docs.mailman3.org/projects/mailman/en/latest/src/mailman/handlers/docs/reply-to.html
    >>> 
    >>> /P?r
    >>> 
    >>> --
    >>> P?r Leijonhufvud .  par.leijonhufvud at regionjh.se
    >>> Sjukhuskemist +46(0)63-153 376, +46-(0)70-242 7006
    >>> Laboratoriemedicin, ?stersunds sjukhus
    >>> 
    >>> -----Original Message----- From: R-help
    >>> <r-help-bounces at r-project.org> On Behalf Of Patrick
    >> (Malone
    >>> Quantitative) Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 2020 4:52 PM
    >>> To: r-help <r-help at r-project.org> Subject: [R] Meta:
    >>> R-Help reply-to
    >>> 
    >>> Greetings.
    >>> 
    >>> Something I've wondered for some time--is mailman
    >>> configurable to
    >> have a
    >>> default reply-to be set to the list or to reply-all?
    >>> 
    >>> Many newcomers who reply to individual R-Help
    >>> participants may not
    >> notice
    >>> that they are doing so, and it seems a source of
    >>> vexation to some of
    >> the
    >>> more frequent helpers.
    >>> 
    >>> I wrote to r-help-owner with this query several months
    >>> ago and never
    >> heard
    >>> back.
    >>> 
    >>> Pat
    >>> 
    >>> --
    >>> Patrick S. Malone, Ph.D., Malone Quantitative NEW
    >>> Service Models:
    ....
    >>> He/Him/His
    >>> 
    >>> [[alternative HTML version deleted]]

    ....
    
    >>> Region J?mtland H?rjedalen behandlar dina
    >>> personuppgifter vid kommunikation via
    >>> e-post. Hanteringen av personuppgifter f?ljer
    >> g?llande
    >>> dataskyddslagstiftning. Du kan l?sa mer om hur vi
    >>> behandlar dina
    >> uppgifter
    >>> p? https://regionjh.se/gdpr

R help - Dec 2020 - Meta: R-Help reply-to

[R] Meta: R-Help reply-to

[R] Meta: R-Help reply-to