llvm dev - Dec 2020 - Fwd: Question about the platform/OS used by most LLVM developers

Thanks for the info!
Made a survey with 3 questions here, it would be great to get some answers:

https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/SDQMM3Q

I assumed there is a mix of OS usage (although didn't think about FreeBSD,
to be honest) and getting the app to run on all these platforms would be
ideal.
Main issue is that it's made using .NET Core (C#) and WPF, with WPF being
now the Windows-only part, officially. I've got it to work really well with
Wine though on Linux, and Docker makes things even easier by having to just
get a prebuilt image that has everything configured properly.

The app does have several libs, with a "core" part and 1-2
command-line
tools that would run natively where .NET core does, just that the power of
the tool is all in the UI. Not sure I can share screenshots yet, that would
give a better idea of what it is. Think about it as an IDE for compiler
devs I guess. Sometimes I regret not going with QT, but such a change would
be a big rewrite at this point and it's mostly my free-time project. And to
be honest I would rather not use C++ for this even though I work on a C++
compiler...

Btw, should I send another message just with the survey link, or does this
have enough visibility?

Thanks,
Gratian


On Thu, Dec 10, 2020 at 9:38 AM Everett Maus <evmaus at google.com> wrote:
> I'm not the most regular contributor, but if I were to guess, I'd
expect
> it's reasonably well mixed and there are likely a decent number of
> "poly-OS" folks (I'm currently prototyping something &
working on it on
> both debian linux + mac osx).
>
> One thing that immediately occurred to me is that splitting a tool like
> that into a library/command line tool/service that's independent of the
> actual 'display' is something that seems relatively common with
clang/llvm
> libraries and also a technique that's been done with clang-related
tools in
> the past to get cross platform & cross editor exploration (e.x. the
clangd
> service + a vscode plugin or a plugin for any other editor that supports
> the LSP).  That could be an easy or easy-ish way to build something cross
> platform that helps with visualizing compiler IR without having to solve
> the cross-platform-GUI problem.
>
> --EJM
>
> On Thu, Dec 10, 2020 at 7:00 AM Robinson, Paul via llvm-dev <
> llvm-dev at lists.llvm.org> wrote:
>
>> I’m not aware of any survey like that.  It would be interesting to
know,
>> and I expect a lot of people would be willing to respond to a survey. 
Some
>> people use more than one; I use both Ubuntu and Windows, for example.
>>
>> In general the project looks for tools to be usable across the major
>> platforms, so I would recommend against using the results of the survey
to
>> focus on one platform to the exclusion of others.  This is admittedly
>> trickier if you have GUIs in the mix, but seems solvable.
>>
>> --paulr
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* llvm-dev <llvm-dev-bounces at lists.llvm.org> *On Behalf
Of *Gratian
>> Lup via llvm-dev
>> *Sent:* Thursday, December 10, 2020 4:49 AM
>> *To:* llvm-dev at lists.llvm.org
>> *Subject:* [llvm-dev] Fwd: Question about the platform/OS used by most
>> LLVM developers
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>>
>>
>> I'm working on a tool that is very useful for understanding and
>> visualizing compiler IR and the plan is to open source it next year
('m a
>> dev on the MSVC optimizer at Microsoft). It's a Windows-based UI
tool, but
>> does work well on Linux using Wine with a couple of distributions I
tried,
>> including Ubuntu.
>>
>>
>>
>> What I wonder is what OS most LLVM devs use for the typical dev work,
bug
>> investigations etc. that involve dealining with LLVM IR/MLIR. I assume
most
>> are not using Windows, but do wonder about the Linux/Mac OS split, and
then
>> for Linux what distro.
>>
>>
>>
>> Was there such a survey ever done? If I'd make a survey, would
people be
>> willing to answer it? :) Knowing this would help make sure the tool
works
>> fine for the platform used by most LLVM devs.
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Gratian Lup
>> _______________________________________________
>> LLVM Developers mailing list
>> llvm-dev at lists.llvm.org
>> https://lists.llvm.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/llvm-dev
>>
>
>
> --
> --EJM
>
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I suggest a separate email with a more obvious subject line.  And not to be
snarky—survey design is oddly non-trivial--some suggestions about the survey
itself:
Q.1 should allow more than one response.  I’m not sure which I would pick, if
forced to pick only one.
Q.3 appears to assume “your platform/OS” is not Windows, which as a Windows
user, makes it hard to choose an answer.  Would I want to run something not
native to Windows in a Windows VM running on Windows? Hmmmm…
Looking forward to an improved survey,
--paulr

From: Gratian Lup <lgratian at gmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, December 10, 2020 1:40 PM
To: Everett Maus <evmaus at google.com>
Cc: Robinson, Paul <paul.robinson at sony.com>; llvm-dev at lists.llvm.org
Subject: Re: [llvm-dev] Fwd: Question about the platform/OS used by most LLVM
developers

Thanks for the info!
Made a survey with 3 questions here, it would be great to get some answers:

https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/SDQMM3Q<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/www.surveymonkey.com/r/SDQMM3Q__;!!JmoZiZGBv3RvKRSx!sskD0g5-xl8C6zueOn1RXrbQ0mGrqYl2iWbn5RiSwCSOHBy-_GiJ5VJ7SwGaMe9EbQ$>

I assumed there is a mix of OS usage (although didn't think about FreeBSD,
to be honest) and getting the app to run on all these platforms would be ideal.
Main issue is that it's made using .NET Core (C#) and WPF, with WPF being
now the Windows-only part, officially. I've got it to work really well with
Wine though on Linux, and Docker makes things even easier by having to just get
a prebuilt image that has everything configured properly.

The app does have several libs, with a "core" part and 1-2
command-line tools that would run natively where .NET core does, just that the
power of the tool is all in the UI. Not sure I can share screenshots yet, that
would give a better idea of what it is. Think about it as an IDE for compiler
devs I guess. Sometimes I regret not going with QT, but such a change would be a
big rewrite at this point and it's mostly my free-time project. And to be
honest I would rather not use C++ for this even though I work on a C++
compiler...

Btw, should I send another message just with the survey link, or does this have
enough visibility?

Thanks,
Gratian


On Thu, Dec 10, 2020 at 9:38 AM Everett Maus <evmaus at
google.com<mailto:evmaus at google.com>> wrote:
I'm not the most regular contributor, but if I were to guess, I'd expect
it's reasonably well mixed and there are likely a decent number of
"poly-OS" folks (I'm currently prototyping something & working
on it on both debian linux + mac osx).

One thing that immediately occurred to me is that splitting a tool like that
into a library/command line tool/service that's independent of the actual
'display' is something that seems relatively common with clang/llvm
libraries and also a technique that's been done with clang-related tools in
the past to get cross platform & cross editor exploration (e.x. the clangd
service + a vscode plugin or a plugin for any other editor that supports the
LSP).  That could be an easy or easy-ish way to build something cross platform
that helps with visualizing compiler IR without having to solve the
cross-platform-GUI problem.

--EJM

On Thu, Dec 10, 2020 at 7:00 AM Robinson, Paul via llvm-dev <llvm-dev at
lists.llvm.org<mailto:llvm-dev at lists.llvm.org>> wrote:
I’m not aware of any survey like that.  It would be interesting to know, and I
expect a lot of people would be willing to respond to a survey.  Some people use
more than one; I use both Ubuntu and Windows, for example.
In general the project looks for tools to be usable across the major platforms,
so I would recommend against using the results of the survey to focus on one
platform to the exclusion of others.  This is admittedly trickier if you have
GUIs in the mix, but seems solvable.
--paulr

From: llvm-dev <llvm-dev-bounces at lists.llvm.org<mailto:llvm-dev-bounces
at lists.llvm.org>> On Behalf Of Gratian Lup via llvm-dev
Sent: Thursday, December 10, 2020 4:49 AM
To: llvm-dev at lists.llvm.org<mailto:llvm-dev at lists.llvm.org>
Subject: [llvm-dev] Fwd: Question about the platform/OS used by most LLVM
developers

Hi,

I'm working on a tool that is very useful for understanding and visualizing
compiler IR and the plan is to open source it next year ('m a dev on the
MSVC optimizer at Microsoft). It's a Windows-based UI tool, but does work
well on Linux using Wine with a couple of distributions I tried, including
Ubuntu.

What I wonder is what OS most LLVM devs use for the typical dev work, bug
investigations etc. that involve dealining with LLVM IR/MLIR. I assume most are
not using Windows, but do wonder about the Linux/Mac OS split, and then for
Linux what distro.

Was there such a survey ever done? If I'd make a survey, would people be
willing to answer it? :) Knowing this would help make sure the tool works fine
for the platform used by most LLVM devs.

Thanks,
Gratian Lup
_______________________________________________
LLVM Developers mailing list
llvm-dev at lists.llvm.org<mailto:llvm-dev at lists.llvm.org>
https://lists.llvm.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/llvm-dev<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/lists.llvm.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/llvm-dev__;!!JmoZiZGBv3RvKRSx!sskD0g5-xl8C6zueOn1RXrbQ0mGrqYl2iWbn5RiSwCSOHBy-_GiJ5VJ7SwEFvzIavA$>


--
--EJM
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