Ironruby core - Feb 2008 - Dead Slow Progress on IronRuby... No Beta Yet

Hi,

I was expecting a rapid growth on IronRuby keeping following things in
my mind which i had preserved so far.

(1) Ruby.Net code ( partially ) was licensed by MS to incorporate in to
IronRuby

(2) IronRuby was announced in last year Mix 2007 event ( almost a year
now )

(3) It was decided to place IronRuby on RubyForge for great support..

Even with all this aspects... IronRuby Progress is dead slow.

If a part of Ruby.Net was included, and if Ruby.Net can give a stable
version, why IronRuby lacks Beta Stage so far. Its almost one year since
IronRuby was announced in the Mix event last year, and the new Mix 2008
is round the corner, still no news about Beta yet...

If we add, (1) Ruby.Net Code + (2) Ruby Forge contribution + (3) Full
time IronRuby Team support... this could have shaped very fast.

Plan your work.... and workout your plans. This would have yielded
better results so far. It seems there is something wrong with the exact
tuning with DLR

My simple question... "will there will ever be LINQ support with Dynamic
language like IronRuby " still remains hanging.which shows the lack of
correct tuning with other areas in .Net.

Hoping to see Beta stage soon.

( Let me clarify... I am totally in support with IronRuby, but the slow
progress kills my enthusiasm )

Just my 2 cents

WebReservoir
-- 
Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.

Web Reservoir:
> Even with all this aspects... IronRuby Progress is dead slow.
>
> If a part of Ruby.Net was included, and if Ruby.Net can give a stable
> version, why IronRuby lacks Beta Stage so far. Its almost one year
> since IronRuby was announced in the Mix event last year, and the new
> Mix 2008 is round the corner, still no news about Beta yet...
If you feel progress is ''dead slow'', then *you* can help out.
You can contribute by downloading the sources, building them and reporting bugs.
You can also contribute by contributing patches.

We *do* have members from the community who have helped out tremendously in
their spare time. Surely you can do the same?

BTW, can you please define ''beta stage'' for me so that we can
make sure to add it to our plans?

Thanks,
-John

On Tue, 26 Feb 2008 21:25:01 -0700, Web Reservoir <lists at
ruby-forum.com>
wrote:
> It seems there is something wrong with the exact
> tuning with DLR
If I were to speculate I would think that you''ll see a massive influx
of
code just after Mix08 for the simple fact that -- as far as I can tell --  
everyone @ MSFT working on DLR-related projects is heads down at the  
moment preparing for a spectacular showcase of platform capabilities, new  
announcements of products/project features, etc.  Once the pressure of  
Mix08 has been released my *guess* is that these same folks will start  
churning out code that extends from what was shown @Mix by the truck load.

Of course, this is just a guess, but having worked @MSFT and having  
presented at many conferences while I was there I can assure you that the  
preparations for shows as big as Mix begin _well_ in advance, and the  
pressure to go big is tremendous. Once that pressure has subsided, I would  
expect rapid advancement of the IronRuby project.

Just my two cents.

-- 
/M:D

M. David Peterson
Co-Founder & Chief Architect, 3rd&Urban, LLC
Email: m.david at 3rdandUrban.com | m.david at amp.fm
Mobile: (206) 418-9027
http://3rdandUrban.com | http://amp.fm |  
http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/au/2354

On Tue, 26 Feb 2008 21:35:01 -0700, John Lam (DLR) <jflam at
microsoft.com>
wrote:
> You can contribute by downloading the sources, building them and  
> reporting bugs. You can also contribute by contributing patches.
Just an observation from the outside:  I can count the number of  
patches/contributions to this project from external folks on one hand, and  
every single one of those patches/contributions were reviewed/commented  
upon/injected into the source tree when and as appropriate within 48 hours.

Of course, I''m just as guilty as everyone else: I haven''t
contributed a
single line of code to this project, something I really need to fix.

-- 
/M:D

M. David Peterson
Co-Founder & Chief Architect, 3rd&Urban, LLC
Email: m.david at 3rdandUrban.com | m.david at amp.fm
Mobile: (206) 418-9027
http://3rdandUrban.com | http://amp.fm |  
http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/au/2354

Dear John,

Unfortunately i am from VB6 background, exploring more with Ruby 
Knowledge, and willing to start working extensively with IronRuby and 
Asp.Net MVC

My Knowledge with C# is *ZERO* and thats what keeps me out to 
contribute.

You can expect my best support for IronRuby 2.0

Since you have already classified Pre Alpha 1 and 2.... You are the 
owner and judge to announce BETA stage.

Thanks

-- 
Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.

Web Reservoir:
> My Knowledge with C# is *ZERO* and thats what keeps me out to
> contribute.
That''s OK. But you can download and build from sources, right? If so,
then you can contribute by writing tutorials about your experiences, or by
filing bug reports.

If *building* IronRuby blocks you from participating, expect that to be fixed
post-MIX.

Thanks,
-John

2008/2/27, John Lam (DLR) <jflam at
microsoft.com>:
> That''s OK. But you can download and build from sources, right? If
so, then you can contribute by writing tutorials about your experiences, or by
filing bug reports.
>
>  If *building* IronRuby blocks you from participating, expect that to be
fixed post-MIX.
Indeed, if you have some Ruby knowledge, the easiest way to contribute
for outsiders is to try to use your favorite Ruby library or to run
your favorite Ruby application with IronRuby, and report minimal
testcases. This does not require any C# or DLR knowledge.

Testing and testcase reduction are very important works, and can be rewarding.

That said, the problem is that IronRuby is currently so incomplete
that you can hardly require any Ruby standard library before running
into problems. In my experience this has been the most discouraging.

In comparison, I could require ''date'' and
''url'' in Ruby.NET just after
a small number of bug fixes.

-- 
Seo Sanghyeon

Because of the current heads down nature of the DLR team, I think the
current /perception/ of lack of progress is real.  Knowing that things
are going to change around Mix in the code kind makes one a bit lery
to put too much stock in what we have now.  Meaning, I don''t know what
bugs are being worked on and what interfaces and APIs might change
between now and then.  Just makes me a bit hesitant.  That said, one
can still download, play and submit bugs..

On Tue, Feb 26, 2008 at 11:38 PM, M. David Peterson
<m.david at xmlhacker.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 26 Feb 2008 21:25:01 -0700, Web Reservoir <lists at
ruby-forum.com>
>  wrote:
>
>
>  > It seems there is something wrong with the exact
>  > tuning with DLR
>
>  If I were to speculate I would think that you''ll see a massive
influx of
>  code just after Mix08 for the simple fact that -- as far as I can tell --
>  everyone @ MSFT working on DLR-related projects is heads down at the
>  moment preparing for a spectacular showcase of platform capabilities, new
>  announcements of products/project features, etc.  Once the pressure of
>  Mix08 has been released my *guess* is that these same folks will start
>  churning out code that extends from what was shown @Mix by the truck load.
>
>  Of course, this is just a guess, but having worked @MSFT and having
>  presented at many conferences while I was there I can assure you that the
>  preparations for shows as big as Mix begin _well_ in advance, and the
>  pressure to go big is tremendous. Once that pressure has subsided, I would
>  expect rapid advancement of the IronRuby project.
>
>  Just my two cents.
>
>  --
>  /M:D
>
>  M. David Peterson
>  Co-Founder & Chief Architect, 3rd&Urban, LLC
>  Email: m.david at 3rdandUrban.com | m.david at amp.fm
>  Mobile: (206) 418-9027
>  http://3rdandUrban.com | http://amp.fm |
>  http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/au/2354
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>  Ironruby-core mailing list
>  Ironruby-core at rubyforge.org
>  http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/ironruby-core
>


-- 
Michael Letterle
[Polymath Programmer]
http://michaeldotnet.blogspot.com

In the IR crew''s defense, there is a lot you can do with IronRuby right
now,
that isn''t practical otherwise.  Sure the ruby libraries are great, and
running Rails on .NET is cool.  But I''m a .NET programmer, I
don''t really
care that much about the ruby framework, I want the language in MY apps.

The .NET interop in IronRuby really works well, and makes a great way to
control mountains of .NET code dynamically with a much more elegant
language.

Good job guys!

On one level I agree though... It''s about time for a binary release. 
It''s
hard to convince other people to look at something you have to grab from SVN
and compile.  Beta, alpha or CTP, I don''t really care.

-Eric

On Tue, Feb 26, 2008 at 11:25 PM, Web Reservoir <lists at ruby-forum.com>
wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I was expecting a rapid growth on IronRuby keeping following things in
> my mind which i had preserved so far.
>
> (1) Ruby.Net code ( partially ) was licensed by MS to incorporate in to
> IronRuby
>
> (2) IronRuby was announced in last year Mix 2007 event ( almost a year
> now )
>
> (3) It was decided to place IronRuby on RubyForge for great support..
>
> Even with all this aspects... IronRuby Progress is dead slow.
>
> If a part of Ruby.Net was included, and if Ruby.Net can give a stable
> version, why IronRuby lacks Beta Stage so far. Its almost one year since
> IronRuby was announced in the Mix event last year, and the new Mix 2008
> is round the corner, still no news about Beta yet...
>
> If we add, (1) Ruby.Net Code + (2) Ruby Forge contribution + (3) Full
> time IronRuby Team support... this could have shaped very fast.
>
> Plan your work.... and workout your plans. This would have yielded
> better results so far. It seems there is something wrong with the exact
> tuning with DLR
>
> My simple question... "will there will ever be LINQ support with
Dynamic
> language like IronRuby " still remains hanging.which shows the lack of
> correct tuning with other areas in .Net.
>
> Hoping to see Beta stage soon.
>
> ( Let me clarify... I am totally in support with IronRuby, but the slow
> progress kills my enthusiasm )
>
> Just my 2 cents
>
> WebReservoir
> --
> Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.
> _______________________________________________
> Ironruby-core mailing list
> Ironruby-core at rubyforge.org
> http://rubyforge.org/mailman/listinfo/ironruby-core
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL:
http://rubyforge.org/pipermail/ironruby-core/attachments/20080227/52a522ad/attachment-0001.html

Eric Nicholson:
> On one level I agree though... It''s about time for a binary
release.
> It''s hard to convince other people to look at something you have
to
> grab from SVN and compile.  Beta, alpha or CTP, I don''t really
care.
Post-MIX we''re going to have binaries available.

Thanks,
-John

Michael Letterle:
> Because of the current heads down nature of the DLR team, I think the
> current /perception/ of lack of progress is real.  Knowing that things
> are going to change around Mix in the code kind makes one a bit lery to
> put too much stock in what we have now.  Meaning, I don''t know
what
> bugs are being worked on and what interfaces and APIs might change
> between now and then.  Just makes me a bit hesitant.  That said, one
> can still download, play and submit bugs..
Right now we''re getting things ready for MIX. What that means is making
sure that our interop works correctly, that we build *and run* correctly on
CoreCLR (the Silverlight version of the CLR). There are bug fixes in the core
language among other things that are in that build.

There are no user-visible changes as far as anyone outside will see, nor are
there any breaking changes in APIs that you would use to build libraries.

There are no major changes planned on the library interfaces. So if
you''re currently hacking on a library we shouldn''t break you
today.

Thanks,
-John

Hello...

Finally the wait seems to be over..

I am just referring a session at Mix 2008 by John Lam.

Here it is..

Microsoft Silverlight and Dynamic Languages
Friday, March 7 10:00 AM - 11:15 AM, Delfino 4003
Speaker(s): John Lam, Jimmy Schementi
Audience(s): Technical
Session Type: Breakout
Learn how the Dynamic Language Runtime (DLR) works in Silverlight. 
Includes an introduction to Microsoft Silverlight for Python and Ruby 
programmers.

https://content.visitmix.com/public/sessions.aspx

Just few days to go. BTW.. does any one any idea about the LINQ support 
with IronRuby. Will this topic be included in the above session, since 
Fetching data is the main scenario.

Cheers
-- 
Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.