freebsd stable - Aug 2018 - drm / drm2 removal in 12

On Sun, Aug 26, 2018 at 4:32 PM Hans Petter Selasky <hps at selasky.org>
wrote:
> On 8/26/18 3:20 AM, blubee blubeeme wrote:
> > Have you or anyone working on this drm-legacy-kmod stuff done any
> testings
> > of how this will affect current users?
>
> Hi Blubee,
>
> Are you here to try to stir a conflict?
> If so that is not appreciated.
>
> --HPS
>
Hans, you of all people should know that's not true.

I would think that trying to sneak in code during a code freeze that would
break the release. Forcing the core devs to revert those changes and having
to dust off old policies to try to keep you guys in check is what's
stirring up conflicts, but hey; what do I know?

It's really sad state when capable engineers are so obsessed with something
that they cannot see the forest for the trees. Try to step away from the
canvas and look at the big picture.

If you don't mind me asking, Hans care to answer these questions below?
1) Take a [test] system with the current graphics stack installed and
working.
2) Apply your patches to remove the drm from base to create a port
3) update the working [test] system after applying your changes

How does your changes affect a [test] system that is already up and running?

Have any of you guys tried that? Do you have any documentation on how it'll
affect users.

You guys want to remove things from the current system but you come with;
it works for us hobbyists.
Where do users go to get steps to do all of this stuff?

You've repeatedly said what you want to do sure, but have you tested it?

On Sunday, August 26, 2018, blubee blubeeme <gurenchan at gmail.com>
wrote:
> On Sun, Aug 26, 2018 at 4:32 PM Hans Petter Selasky <hps at
selasky.org>
> wrote:
>
> > On 8/26/18 3:20 AM, blubee blubeeme wrote:
> > > Have you or anyone working on this drm-legacy-kmod stuff done any
> > testings
> > > of how this will affect current users?
> >
> > Hi Blubee,
> >
> > Are you here to try to stir a conflict?
> > If so that is not appreciated.
> >
> > --HPS
> >
> Hans, you of all people should know that's not true.
>
> I would think that trying to sneak in code during a code freeze that would
> break the release. Forcing the core devs to revert those changes and having
> to dust off old policies to try to keep you guys in check is what's
> stirring up conflicts, but hey; what do I know?

Please use git pull or svn up. They are already reverted and you get back
your old drivers.

https://github.com/freebsd/freebsd/commit/ae526637c4a79045579abc632ffbfd
b368c66ea8#diff-6ee1ee279be0fe8a84e853198b2b4c43

Please try to learn how to use development tools.

https://github.com/freebsd/freebsd/commits/master/sys/dev/drm2

I think the latest binary snapshot from 12.0-ALPHA3 contains the old state
of code if not, next should be.

> It's really sad state when capable engineers are so obsessed with
something
> that they cannot see the forest for the trees. Try to step away from the
> canvas and look at the big picture.

Let's do some more step backwards, and see how the graphics driver
developments works from the corporation side.
They not bother about any of the BSDs, they focus only to Windows and
Linux. If you want to use a recent (haha recent, something after  2014) you
are forced to use new drivers from linux.
The fore/advantage on the Linux side are the zillions of corporately paid
kernel developers.
They can just focus on a new hw supports, on freebsd side, there are no
corporately paid drm driver developer. Sadly.
In linux word their internal KPI (try a Google for a "stable API
nonsense"
words) moves so fastly, that porting of these drivers gets non trivial
without a dedicated paid team.

If you want to change on this situation, try to learn for you could help or
send directed donations to freebsd foundation. ;)

>
> If you don't mind me asking, Hans care to answer these questions below?
> 1) Take a [test] system with the current graphics stack installed and
> working.
> 2) Apply your patches to remove the drm from base to create a port
> 3) update the working [test] system after applying your changes
>
>
With the latest 12, nothing special. Only a deprecation notice gets
printed, once the driver is loaded.

> How does your changes affect a [test] system that is already up and
> running?
>
> Have any of you guys tried that? Do you have any documentation on how
it'll
> affect users.
>
> You guys want to remove things from the current system but you come with;
> it works for us hobbyists.
> Where do users go to get steps to do all of this stuff?
>
> You've repeatedly said what you want to do sure, but have you tested
it?
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blubee blubeeme <gurenchan at gmail.com> writes:
> Hans Petter Selasky <hps at selasky.org> writes:
> > Are you here to try to stir a conflict?  If so that is not
> > appreciated.
> Hans, you of all people should know that's not true.
And yet here we are.

You have made it perfectly clear that you are not interested in an
honest discussion.  Your entire strategy is to wear people down until
they either leave or agree with you just to shut you up.  Like Hans
Petter says, it is not appreciated.

You clearly believe that you know better than anyone else how this
should be handled, so instead of telling us, I suggest you just go do
it.  It only takes seconds to fork the FreeBSD mirror on Github, and a
few minutes to clone it onto your machine.  We look forward to hearing
from you again when you have everything working perfectly and seamlessly
out of the box for everybody on any equipment.  I'm sure that Johannes,
Niclas, Warner and others with a century of combined experience will be
thrilled to see you succeed where they, by your account, have failed.

DES
-- 
Dag-Erling Sm?rgrav - des at des.no