So? that is why you have this lmtp not? Afaik was mdbox created to solve the (performance) issues with mbox and maildir etc. So I just wonder what the logics is behind chosing maildir current day.> Not sure what this had to do with the question asked. > You're using mbox, but he is using mdbox. > Postfix is unable to write to mdbox itself. > > > Quoting justina colmena ~biz <justina at colmena.biz>: > > > *My* inbox gets filled with thousands of emails, more or less > > commercial content and trivial notifications from shopping online, > > and postfix crashes and will not accept new messages if the file > > "/var/mail/justina" becomes too large. > > > > Configuring postfix to deliver the mail to "~/Maildir" solved that > problem. > > > > I still need to configure a sieve or a filter or some nicer > > mechanism to clear out messages that are either outright spam or too > > old or no longer of interest to me. > > > > On August 13, 2022 10:00:36 AM AKDT, Marc <marc at f1-outsourcing.eu> > wrote: > >>> > >>> We need to move all users from one (pretty old) installation of > dovecot > >>> to a new one. > >>> The old one uses mdbox for users' mailboxes and maildir for > >>> shared/public mailboxes. > >>> The new one must be maildir only. > >> > >> why did you decide to move to maildir?
mdbox is a proprietary format, only dovecot can handle it (afaik). Postfix can write maildir natively, other MTAs, too. There are many tools to help in case something strange happens. I believe that using maildir seems to be not that bad. And I don't see the real benefits of mdbox. Maybe with "old" spindle driven devices, you may have a performance benefit, but with SDDs... If you use the right filesystem, use raid 10.... Yes, it is said that mdbox is performing better. The largest installations we had with dovecot were about 2k users (maildir was used) and another one had about 3k users (with mdbox), they all have branch offices that are connected to their "home" via some sort of vpn or direct connect by the ISP. We did not see a real difference between maildir and mdbox, maybe because of the surrounding conditions. And I believe mdbox may be faster, but we did not have the critical masses to see that.> Gesendet: Sonntag, 14. August 2022 um 11:47 Uhr > Von: "Marc" <Marc at f1-outsourcing.eu> > An: "Patrick Domack" <patrickdk at patrickdk.com>, "dovecot at dovecot.org" <dovecot at dovecot.org> > Betreff: RE: convert mdbox to maildir > > So? that is why you have this lmtp not? Afaik was mdbox created to solve the (performance) issues with mbox and maildir etc. So I just wonder what the logics is behind chosing maildir current day. > > > > > Not sure what this had to do with the question asked. > > You're using mbox, but he is using mdbox. > > Postfix is unable to write to mdbox itself. > > > > > > Quoting justina colmena ~biz <justina at colmena.biz>: > > > > > *My* inbox gets filled with thousands of emails, more or less > > > commercial content and trivial notifications from shopping online, > > > and postfix crashes and will not accept new messages if the file > > > "/var/mail/justina" becomes too large. > > > > > > Configuring postfix to deliver the mail to "~/Maildir" solved that > > problem. > > > > > > I still need to configure a sieve or a filter or some nicer > > > mechanism to clear out messages that are either outright spam or too > > > old or no longer of interest to me. > > > > > > On August 13, 2022 10:00:36 AM AKDT, Marc <marc at f1-outsourcing.eu> > > wrote: > > >>> > > >>> We need to move all users from one (pretty old) installation of > > dovecot > > >>> to a new one. > > >>> The old one uses mdbox for users' mailboxes and maildir for > > >>> shared/public mailboxes. > > >>> The new one must be maildir only. > > >> > > >> why did you decide to move to maildir? > >
On 14/08/22 21:47, Marc wrote:> So? that is why you have this lmtp not? Afaik was mdbox created to solve the (performance) issues with mbox and maildir etc. So I just wonder what the logics is behind chosing maildir current day.maildir is probably what most people use and should continue to use. There are cases where mbox is still viable but nowadays they are rare edge cases. Basically put mbox was one file for all mail in the mailbox, it served us well in the days of POP when clients would download all the mail from the server and it would be deleted right away on the server-side with no folders and very rarely leaving mail on the server at all. This worked because when a client downloaded the messages they could for the most part just basically stream the entire mbox file straight through the TCP POP connection and then simply delete or truncate the file. Nowadays IMAP is prevalent and so we have multiple folders stored server-side and mail is largely left on the server, so messages need to be accessed in a sort of random-access style instead of just streaming the whole lot of them down at once as used to be done in the POP days. This makes Maildir (where messages are stored one-per-file) much more efficient for storage and access. Most people should probably be using Maildir nowadays, it's a good format and is extremely portable so that other tools can easily recognize and work directly with the Maildir files. There is, however, one major issue with Maildir. Filesystems store files in clusters on disk (and even, I believe on SSD drives), and these cluster sizes have been growing over the years in order to accommodate increasingly bigger file and filesystem sizes. The problem is that when you have 10,000 messages all approximately 500 bytes in size and a 4k cluster size, those messages don't take up 5MB on disk, but rather they take up approximately 40MB on disk because each file (which correspeonds to each message) takes up at least a full cluster on disk. To solve this we now have mdbox which stores many messages (by default 10M worth) in one file, but not so many as to make the file unwieldy for random access of messages. The idea is that we can store way more messages that way in the same given space because we're not wasting most of the disk space on the filesystem having to use a full cluster per message. 10M is not, however, a huge amount of memory to allocate in RAM to manipulate one file with, so storing 10M worth of messages to each file tends to bedome a good compromise between storing all of the messages in one file vs storing one message per file. At the end of the day, though, the storage benefits of mdbox should be weighed against the sheer simplicity and widespread use of Maildir. If you have really huge mailboxes (like ones that contain 50,000 or more messages) then mdbox may be the right solution for you, but most people will be fine with Maildir. Peter