Hi, llvmbb's job is to inform people of build breaks. However, it seems to trigger for a big list of bots, and at least one of them seems to always be broken, and the broken bots tend to have cycle times of several hours. So if you're on IRC and you commit something, you get pinged by llvmbb for hours afterwards. Does anyone think llvmbb is useful? The best thing about llvmbb I've heard it's easy to just "/ignore llvmbb", but if that's what everybody does then why not not have it in the first place? Nico -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.llvm.org/pipermail/llvm-dev/attachments/20200901/055a648b/attachment.html>
Keane, Erich via llvm-dev
2020-Sep-01 19:10 UTC
[llvm-dev] [cfe-dev] Can we remove llvmbb from IRC?
Check out the #llvm-build channel. In themain IRC channel, I block llvmbb, then just also listen in for my name in #llvm-build. The bot has a different name there, so it is still possible to block in #llvm. From: cfe-dev <cfe-dev-bounces at lists.llvm.org> On Behalf Of Nico Weber via cfe-dev Sent: Tuesday, September 1, 2020 12:08 PM To: llvm-dev <llvm-dev at lists.llvm.org>; cfe-dev <cfe-dev at lists.llvm.org> Subject: [cfe-dev] Can we remove llvmbb from IRC? Hi, llvmbb's job is to inform people of build breaks. However, it seems to trigger for a big list of bots, and at least one of them seems to always be broken, and the broken bots tend to have cycle times of several hours. So if you're on IRC and you commit something, you get pinged by llvmbb for hours afterwards. Does anyone think llvmbb is useful? The best thing about llvmbb I've heard it's easy to just "/ignore llvmbb", but if that's what everybody does then why not not have it in the first place? Nico -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.llvm.org/pipermail/llvm-dev/attachments/20200901/95f1f658/attachment.html>
Keane, Erich via llvm-dev
2020-Sep-01 19:10 UTC
[llvm-dev] [cfe-dev] Can we remove llvmbb from IRC?
+cfe-dev again 😊 From: Keane, Erich Sent: Tuesday, September 1, 2020 12:10 PM To: Nico Weber <thakis at chromium.org>; llvm-dev <llvm-dev at lists.llvm.org> Subject: RE: [cfe-dev] Can we remove llvmbb from IRC? Check out the #llvm-build channel. In themain IRC channel, I block llvmbb, then just also listen in for my name in #llvm-build. The bot has a different name there, so it is still possible to block in #llvm. From: cfe-dev <cfe-dev-bounces at lists.llvm.org<mailto:cfe-dev-bounces at lists.llvm.org>> On Behalf Of Nico Weber via cfe-dev Sent: Tuesday, September 1, 2020 12:08 PM To: llvm-dev <llvm-dev at lists.llvm.org<mailto:llvm-dev at lists.llvm.org>>; cfe-dev <cfe-dev at lists.llvm.org<mailto:cfe-dev at lists.llvm.org>> Subject: [cfe-dev] Can we remove llvmbb from IRC? Hi, llvmbb's job is to inform people of build breaks. However, it seems to trigger for a big list of bots, and at least one of them seems to always be broken, and the broken bots tend to have cycle times of several hours. So if you're on IRC and you commit something, you get pinged by llvmbb for hours afterwards. Does anyone think llvmbb is useful? The best thing about llvmbb I've heard it's easy to just "/ignore llvmbb", but if that's what everybody does then why not not have it in the first place? Nico -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.llvm.org/pipermail/llvm-dev/attachments/20200901/c15353b9/attachment.html>
Serge Guelton via llvm-dev
2020-Sep-01 19:10 UTC
[llvm-dev] [cfe-dev] Can we remove llvmbb from IRC?
Hi Nico, On Tue, Sep 01, 2020 at 03:07:37PM -0400, Nico Weber via cfe-dev wrote:> Hi, > > llvmbb's job is to inform people of build breaks. However, it seems to trigger > for a big list of bots, and at least one of them seems to always be broken, and > the broken bots tend to have cycle times of several hours. So if you're on IRC > and you commit something, you get pinged by llvmbb for hours afterwards. > > Does anyone think llvmbb is useful? > > The best thing about llvmbb I've heard it's easy to just "/ignore llvmbb", but > if that's what everybody does then why not not have it in the first place?I find it useful to /ignore llvmbb it *and* /join #llvm-build
Florian Hahn via llvm-dev
2020-Sep-01 19:18 UTC
[llvm-dev] [cfe-dev] Can we remove llvmbb from IRC?
Hi,> On Sep 1, 2020, at 20:10, Serge Guelton via llvm-dev <llvm-dev at lists.llvm.org> wrote: > > Hi Nico, > > On Tue, Sep 01, 2020 at 03:07:37PM -0400, Nico Weber via cfe-dev wrote: >> Hi, >> >> llvmbb's job is to inform people of build breaks. However, it seems to trigger >> for a big list of bots, and at least one of them seems to always be broken, and >> the broken bots tend to have cycle times of several hours. So if you're on IRC >> and you commit something, you get pinged by llvmbb for hours afterwards. >> >> Does anyone think llvmbb is useful? >> >> The best thing about llvmbb I've heard it's easy to just "/ignore llvmbb", but >> if that's what everybody does then why not not have it in the first place? > > I find it useful to /ignore llvmbb it *and* /join #llvm-buildThat’s great, I wasn’t aware of the #llvm-build channel. If we already have a dedicated #llvm-build channel, IMO it would make sense to remove llvmbb from the main channel, to cut down on the noise. It does not seem to add much because the false-positive rate is high and people who are interested can use #llvm-build. Cheers, Florian
David Blaikie via llvm-dev
2020-Sep-01 19:32 UTC
[llvm-dev] [cfe-dev] Can we remove llvmbb from IRC?
On Tue, Sep 1, 2020 at 12:07 PM Nico Weber via cfe-dev < cfe-dev at lists.llvm.org> wrote:> Hi, > > llvmbb's job is to inform people of build breaks. However, it seems to > trigger for a big list of bots, and at least one of them seems to always be > broken, >If a bot is always broken it shouldn't be sending email/notifications - generally they are configured only to send email on green>red and red>green transitions, so if it's already broken you shouldn't be blamed for it. If you are seeing bot spam or emails from a bot that's already red, please email llvm-dev and the bot maintainer and ask the bot to be reconfigured or disabled. If a bot is regularly flakey (& thus sending email/notifications that are false-positives/that no one can act on) please also send email asking for the bot to be reconfigured or disabled. (or, if you want to be a bit more punchy - send a patch to the zorg repository to have the bot disabled & explain why you're proposing that)> and the broken bots tend to have cycle times of several hours. >Long cycle times are a real problem - that might be best left to another discussion about buildbot maintenance - I would be for a policy that says bot windows shouldn't be longer than, say, an hour or maybe less. (so, eg: if you have a bot that's just going to take 5 hours to run - then you need 5 machines that each pickup work every hour, so the blame lists are smaller) this doesn't solve the problem of being notified 5 hours later about a breakage that was caused by someone else who committed a few minutes before or after you. Solving that problem will require a much greater investment in infrastructure to chain buildbots, possibly use built artefacts from one buildbot to another, etc.> So if you're on IRC and you commit something, you get pinged by llvmbb for > hours afterwards. > > Does anyone think llvmbb is useful? >I sometimes find it useful, but happy to move to llvm-build to get those notifications. Other folks might not know to do that, though.> The best thing about llvmbb I've heard it's easy to just "/ignore llvmbb", > but if that's what everybody does then why not not have it in the first > place? > > Nico > _______________________________________________ > cfe-dev mailing list > cfe-dev at lists.llvm.org > https://lists.llvm.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/cfe-dev >-------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.llvm.org/pipermail/llvm-dev/attachments/20200901/9a7bf16f/attachment.html>
Nico Weber via llvm-dev
2020-Sep-01 19:42 UTC
[llvm-dev] [cfe-dev] Can we remove llvmbb from IRC?
On Tue, Sep 1, 2020 at 3:32 PM David Blaikie <dblaikie at gmail.com> wrote:> On Tue, Sep 1, 2020 at 12:07 PM Nico Weber via cfe-dev < > cfe-dev at lists.llvm.org> wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> llvmbb's job is to inform people of build breaks. However, it seems to >> trigger for a big list of bots, and at least one of them seems to always be >> broken, >> > > If a bot is always broken it shouldn't be sending email/notifications - > generally they are configured only to send email on green>red and red>green > transitions, so if it's already broken you shouldn't be blamed for it. If > you are seeing bot spam or emails from a bot that's already red, please > email llvm-dev and the bot maintainer and ask the bot to be reconfigured or > disabled. > > If a bot is regularly flakey (& thus sending email/notifications that are > false-positives/that no one can act on) please also send email asking for > the bot to be reconfigured or disabled. (or, if you want to be a bit more > punchy - send a patch to the zorg repository to have the bot disabled & > explain why you're proposing that) >I agree with this in the abstract, but I get pinged completely reliably at least twice after every single of my commits. This isn't something that sometimes happens, it's something that always happens.> > >> and the broken bots tend to have cycle times of several hours. >> > > Long cycle times are a real problem - that might be best left to another > discussion about buildbot maintenance - I would be for a policy that says > bot windows shouldn't be longer than, say, an hour or maybe less. (so, eg: > if you have a bot that's just going to take 5 hours to run - then you need > 5 machines that each pickup work every hour, so the blame lists are > smaller) this doesn't solve the problem of being notified 5 hours later > about a breakage that was caused by someone else who committed a few > minutes before or after you. Solving that problem will require a much > greater investment in infrastructure to chain buildbots, possibly use built > artefacts from one buildbot to another, etc. > > >> So if you're on IRC and you commit something, you get pinged by llvmbb >> for hours afterwards. >> >> Does anyone think llvmbb is useful? >> > > I sometimes find it useful, but happy to move to llvm-build to get those > notifications. Other folks might not know to do that, though. > > >> The best thing about llvmbb I've heard it's easy to just "/ignore >> llvmbb", but if that's what everybody does then why not not have it in the >> first place? >> >> Nico >> _______________________________________________ >> cfe-dev mailing list >> cfe-dev at lists.llvm.org >> https://lists.llvm.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/cfe-dev >> >-------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.llvm.org/pipermail/llvm-dev/attachments/20200901/794ae504/attachment.html>
Reid Kleckner via llvm-dev
2020-Sep-03 15:47 UTC
[llvm-dev] [cfe-dev] Can we remove llvmbb from IRC?
I'm not on IRC anymore, so my opinion matters less, but I think it's time to shut it down. It is a relic from a different time when there were fewer bots, fewer contributors, and more IRC users. These days it generates too many notifications and the audience isn't as well targeted. On Tue, Sep 1, 2020 at 12:08 PM Nico Weber via cfe-dev < cfe-dev at lists.llvm.org> wrote:> Hi, > > llvmbb's job is to inform people of build breaks. However, it seems to > trigger for a big list of bots, and at least one of them seems to always be > broken, and the broken bots tend to have cycle times of several hours. So > if you're on IRC and you commit something, you get pinged by llvmbb for > hours afterwards. > > Does anyone think llvmbb is useful? > > The best thing about llvmbb I've heard it's easy to just "/ignore llvmbb", > but if that's what everybody does then why not not have it in the first > place? > > Nico > _______________________________________________ > cfe-dev mailing list > cfe-dev at lists.llvm.org > https://lists.llvm.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/cfe-dev >-------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.llvm.org/pipermail/llvm-dev/attachments/20200903/f806326f/attachment.html>
David Blaikie via llvm-dev
2020-Sep-03 17:34 UTC
[llvm-dev] [cfe-dev] Can we remove llvmbb from IRC?
Fair enough - it is very noisy. I'm surprised these aren't all producing corresponding emails, though (at least those only go to the people on the blame list - but that seemed to be the case Nico was citing - though the general "I'm not even to blame but this is adding a lot of noise to the channel/making it hard to have conversations" is a broad/broader problem). And still seems important to improve the signal/noise ratio. Sent https://reviews.llvm.org/D87100 to do that. & also looking into the config about IRC V email notification configuration. Hopefully those configurations can be unified. I don't think it's any more appropriate to send IRC notifications than email notifications. (I guess now that the IRC notifications will be fairly opt-in, maybe - but I still would rather there be less noise to make the signal stand out, so if a bot isn't producing accurate enough info to send mail, then maybe not IRC either) On Thu, Sep 3, 2020 at 8:47 AM Reid Kleckner via cfe-dev < cfe-dev at lists.llvm.org> wrote:> I'm not on IRC anymore, so my opinion matters less, but I think it's time > to shut it down. It is a relic from a different time when there were fewer > bots, fewer contributors, and more IRC users. These days it generates too > many notifications and the audience isn't as well targeted. > > On Tue, Sep 1, 2020 at 12:08 PM Nico Weber via cfe-dev < > cfe-dev at lists.llvm.org> wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> llvmbb's job is to inform people of build breaks. However, it seems to >> trigger for a big list of bots, and at least one of them seems to always be >> broken, and the broken bots tend to have cycle times of several hours. So >> if you're on IRC and you commit something, you get pinged by llvmbb for >> hours afterwards. >> >> Does anyone think llvmbb is useful? >> >> The best thing about llvmbb I've heard it's easy to just "/ignore >> llvmbb", but if that's what everybody does then why not not have it in the >> first place? >> >> Nico >> _______________________________________________ >> cfe-dev mailing list >> cfe-dev at lists.llvm.org >> https://lists.llvm.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/cfe-dev >> > _______________________________________________ > cfe-dev mailing list > cfe-dev at lists.llvm.org > https://lists.llvm.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/cfe-dev >-------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.llvm.org/pipermail/llvm-dev/attachments/20200903/5ee5d71a/attachment.html>